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Deciding decision making

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  • Deciding decision making

    As background

    There has never been in 4 years any adjudication of decision making and this is presumed to be shared

    Ex has a bad history of not communicating important details, there’s documentation from the school where the teachers were advised to communicate with me as she will not

    So a form of family therapy aimed to develop a parenting plan has been ongoing since the spring

    The kids are doing better and my daughter seems to be rounding the corner
    But both kids are still exposed to nonsense

    There was peace between me and ex until she reneged on a disclosure agreement and I had to bring a motion to which she texted “how dare I bring a motion during summer vacation and when she is moving, how is that good for the kids” meanwhile she did the same thing a year prior.

    Anyways, she simply ignores all communication and essentially refuses to coparent. More recently she had my daughter try to negotiate trading dates on her behalf. The psychologist involved emailed around this stating “as you are aware, she does not want to deal with you directly…”

    The worst thing in 4 years I have said to her was to get a job.

    So in determining shared decision making, there has to be evidence of coparenting. I mean if she simply refuses to communicate, that works against her right

  • #2
    on the case law I've read- just because you refuse to communicate doesn't mean that that is sufficient evidence that communication is impossible.

    the flip side is my ex tried to argue that we communicate "just fine" because we were using OFW and both agreeing to see a co-parent counsellor. My lawyer argued- and the OCL agreed that just because we CAN communicate doesn't mean I should be forced into it.

    However, given your history- I'm thinking parallel parenting seems the right decision with shared custody.


    • #3
      Our cases are different, from what I understand your ex was abusive
      In my case, my just refuses altogether..she even refused to talk about taking one of my days so she could take daughter to a daughter misses out

      My situation is also that when information or some type of decision making is given to her, she won't share that information, the school has to get involved and all.

      Parallel parenting would be tough because really that needs communication.
      I am hopeful that the psychologist can work with her to fix her behavior, but otherwise decision making to me because we know information will be shared and I will work with her.

      I would want a parenting coordinator first, but I think the same issues would happen, but it would be a good intermediate step to avoid litigation

      Parenting time, as much as I would like full time, I do not think there is enough to make her an access parent, I have 6/14 now, I just want 1 extra overnight


      • #4
        so your question is what?

        how do you secure sole custody/decision making?


        • #5
          Originally posted by iona6656 View Post
          so your question is what?

          how do you secure sole custody/decision making?

          I think his question is how does sole decision making happen? What needs to be proven?


          • #6
            The evidence is all there, the patterns over 4 years is obvious
            Especially if we have to go a section 30. The forensics will look at her and the family and be like ummm…
            I do not want to go a trial route. My biggest concern is that inherent bias of being a working male and her having 4 years of weekday time will hurt me…but she has failed miserably in managing a lot. My kids missed 30 days and were late 30 times this past year. Except Monday mornings bc I drove them in.


            • #7
              Trial seems like a drastic step for that, might need to go that route asap if nothing else is working for you, unless lawyers are involved it should be financially painless, might have to put together some pretty involved paper work and serve it.


              • #8
                i am trying to avoid a trial and trying to settle

                she does not and her lawyer is doing every stall delay tactic
                ie: our city has a custom of no settlement conference before questioning takes place, but I do not want to question him at this time unless mediation fails..but fails to state why she will not sign up for mediation

                I think there is something juicy hiding that she won't disclose
                it also serves her interest to drag this out. it reminds me of when workers do not want to go back to work as they are on WSIB or S/A benefits


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Kkc View Post
                  i am trying to avoid a trial and trying to settle

                  she does not and her lawyer is doing every stall delay tactic
                  Some lawyers like that - there is obvious conflict of interest and bad lawyer would delay because moment you both settle, the lawyer’s paycheque ends.

                  I can’t figure out how to handle it. Probably best strategy is making sure her strategy costs you less than it costs her. Having a good lawyer that plays by rules could be a disadvantage to you, despite all recommendations find a good lawyer.
                  Say for instance you request disclosure. She ignores it. You send a follow up, she ignores it. You do another follow up - she sends you a disclosure, but not what you requested. You write letter again. She ignores. Etc. etc.
                  At the end, you wasted 5 hours on disclosure, she only spent 1-2 hour via her lawyer, sending some useless replies. And while it may seem she hides something, often lawyers do it only to keep the bill.
                  Bringing a motion, getting court order etc. would often cost you even more, and at the end she will produce document revealing she wasn’t hiding anything - but their strategy was to make a big deal of something not worth hiding to increase your legal bills for nothing.


                  • #10
                    Thank you for the reply

                    We had to bring a motion as she had hidden bank accounts

                    The strategy you describe by her is a possibility but she has had a judge deem her behaviour unreasonable.

                    That same judge handling the disclosure will now say she is bad faith negotiating as she ignored the request for 3 months, then said she would cooperate when I threatened court, then she reneged, then I told her I was signing a motion, then it was she will cooperate and mediate, but when it came time to sign mediation agreement she refused.

                    Her lawyer also exposes himself for needlessly driving up my costs via law society…he’s done far worse

                    Here is where I am at, I’d love to make her an offer. She said she wants me to pay her cra debt because she didn’t file taxes for 3 years. I asked her to file them and what her debt is..then it’s an excuse for not filing taxes

                    She has had 500k go through her hands in the last 4 years and she owes me around 300k. So if she is literally broke vs having saved a lot will alter what reasonable would be.

                    I do not think anyone would be comfortable making an offer with absolutely no information


                    • #11
                      How did she increase your fees via law society? If she complained about your lawyer, I doubt he should’ve charge you for answering law society claim, but I learn every day.

                      Making an offer with closed cards very hard, but chances all you will get from court is an order allowing you make an account search in 5 major banks. She will sign the consent to search, but it will be done by lawyer. Then banks aren’t particularly happy giving away clients info, so chances it will result in few letters between your lawyer and them, until they’ll tell you they never had this client, and in the end you’ll have huge legal bill with zero outcome.

                      If she is to hide money; I could think of good dozen of ways doing it - won’t specify here just not to give the idea to future readers, but if she isn’t afraid to lie and not on T4, it is easily achievable.

                      Lawyers often use other tactic - they request credit applications, rental etc., as this is where people specify income more honestly.


                      • #12
                        I should clarify

                        I actually found hidden bank accounts not disclosed.
                        Basically I traced one check..and the other she sent to me accidentally when she thought she was disclosing her rrsp

                        We called it out and even in middle of court her lawyer didn’t even acknowledge this existence. Like make up a she forgot…here’s the account statement on date of separation to minimize this discovery..but to pretend it’s not there??

                        The way she likely did it was being labelled as an independent contractor at her parents business and that way it will not generate a t4

                        Even for me, ohip doesn’t give me a t4 it’s the honour system, but foolish to lie because ohip payments are very easy to track

                        Can you dm me some of those ways to cheat, it will be things to keep in mind when my forensic accountant family member goes through them.

                        Also…people lie on credit applications so I agree these are valuable but not when dealing with a compulsive liar


                        • #13
                          Credit applications are just the low hanging fruit where people disclose their incomes or may lie about it. If you're dealing with exempt incomes, they're useless- same for obvious incomes.

                          Bank accounts are whats required. Being able to see all income come in (work, child/gov benefits, etc) and all debts, expenses, loans, bills going out. Following the money, based on what's known and from their financial statement.


                          • #14
                            Not disagree that people lying on credit app, but proving it still useful. Imagine:
                            [you]- your honour, my ex is making 200k, but I can’t locate bank accounts
                            [ex]- I am not making 200k, I only make 30k a year, here is my NOA
                            [you] - your honour, but my ex got a million dollar mortgage and shown on application employment income of 200k
                            [ex] - oh, that one. No, you see your honour, I lied to the bank about my income so to secure mortgage, but in fact I am only earning 30k. I did lie to bank, but I don’t lie to my ex about finances.

                            If you can suggest other ways tracking funds, I’ll be happy to learn.


                            • #15

                              You don't locate bank account statements, you request them from ex and track every dollar coming and going. It's on ex to provide, not you to hunt down.


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