Enough already

[littleman]

there is part of the problem.....let your child come back to reality
put them in an apartment, daycare, ex gets job and goes to work like everyone else (shows responsibility to child), sell the BMW/Lexus and get a Ford. Live life within your means not the means you can obtain with someone else supporting you. Heres a reality for you. What if the one paying SS died then what? The recipient is FORCED to get a job and they wont be making no 5k per month after taxes and if they are then they should have been working all along.

[WorkingDAD]

btw I run my whole household on less than 3k per month- with 17 year old bottomless eating machine....Im not sure why a child would ever need 5k a month to live. That must be some house!!! Or possibly a whole new set of braces every month

common LittleMan
read between the lines

My child is used to $5,000 a month to support the lifestyle - my child should not have to live in a slum because Daddy decided to move on to a newer, brighter model!

that really not about child - it about newer, brighter model!

and BTW topic was SS not CS.

[punked]

In this world of ever growing entitlement era I feel that things are being lost. People say that this generation of children are born in the "entitlement era" I want to know where the hell these people (be it CP, NCP, or just ex wives/husbands) get off feeling they are entitlted to spousal support. How about being entitled to getting off your ass and supporting yourself instead of living off everyone and everything around you!!!! Im just fed up with these questions like if I make 45k and he makes 60k then am I entitled to SS. NO you ass you arent. If you want to maintain same lifestyle then either do not get a divorce and go back to him or get another job to bring your income up to that. Seriously people get off your highg horses and coem back to reality. This world was not built on entitlement and it will not continue if that is the general thinking. The only entitlement is CS and that is only table amount. You cannot tell/convince me that one child needs over 1000$/month to live. If you believe so then you need a reality check.
I just had to rant cause I find it is getting too much.

And - yes - I can tell you - that there are cases where a child needs over $1,000.00 per month to live.

And - yes - I think that he is talking about cs - not ss - if I am wrong - please correct me.

[punked]

there is part of the problem.....let your child come back to reality
put them in an apartment, daycare, ex gets job and goes to work like everyone else (shows responsibility to child), sell the BMW/Lexus and get a Ford. Live life within your means not the means you can obtain with someone else supporting you. Heres a reality for you. What if the one paying SS died then what? The recipient is FORCED to get a job and they wont be making no 5k per month after taxes and if they are then they should have been working all along.

And herein is the problem with society - the acceptance of mediocrity

I never said someone else was supporting me.

I said that the amount of child support that might be required to be paid is commensurate with the income of the payor and the lifestyle prior to separation.

Just look at celebrities. They are not the norm - but their spawn certainly are entitled to be supported by Daddy just like when they lived with Daddy - or perhaps just like when their Moms lured Daddy into a hotel room and poked a hole in the condom

[littleman]

And herein is the problem with society - the acceptance of mediocrity

Mediocrity??? I dont think so!!!! It is called reality. If your ex needs 5000$ a month to support a child you got hosed. What is your ex going to do if God forbids you die? who is going to pay that 5k a month you so generously give? thats right me cause your ex doesnt have any life skills let alone job skills to be self sufficient.

[WorkingDAD]

Mediocrity??? I dont think so!!!! It is called reality. If your ex needs 5000$ a month to support a child you got hosed. What is your ex going to do if God forbids you die? who is going to pay that 5k a month you so generously give? thats right me cause your ex doesnt have any life skills let alone job skills to be self sufficient.

I believe that she (oh pardon her child) who needs 5k a month, not her ex... did I miss something ?

[littleman]

And - yes - I can tell you - that there are cases where a child needs over $1,000.00 per month to live.

And - yes - I think that he is talking about cs - not ss - if I am wrong - please correct me.

and for that statement I was talking about CS but I was also stating that it should table amount and NOTHING more...you needed to go back a sentence. My original rant is about SS and some people believing they are entitled.

So you mean to tell me punked that when you marry and divorce that one spouse is entitled to pay for the other for the rest of their life.

btw I am a woman not a man..I have sole custody of my child. I DO NOT get SS and table amount CS

[punked]

and for that statement I was talking about CS but I was also stating that it should table amount and NOTHING more...you needed to go back a sentence. My original rant is about SS and some people believing they are entitled.

So you mean to tell me punked that when you marry and divorce that one spouse is entitled to pay for the other for the rest of their life.

And I have only ever been referring to child support, and the fact that YOU determined, on your own, what standards every one else should live by

I am totally on the fence about SS! I admit that in some cases is seems justified, and in others it's a complete "system-working" catastrophe.

BUT - and here is the big BUTT talkin' - you have to take every case on its' own merit. Courts have a hard time doing it. Hence the utter inconsistency!

[hadenough]

Littleman: SS is like welfare?? You have tunnel vision. Your opinion is not realistic nor is it based on the LAW. My ex ripped me off for tens of thousands of dollars. This greatly affected my life and my son's. He is NOT pounding any pavement I can assure you. He spends money like water and rips ppl off (currently the new wife). She sold her house and w/the profits, "they" bought another home. He works. When he feels like it, and spends other people's money. Hers, her parents (they've loaned him money - (money they will never ever see returned). It was determined in Court, at Trial, by a JUDGE - based on evidence that I had been left in financial hardship as the result of his willful actions. Left financially burdened.. At a "clear disadvantage" - so YES I DO deserve SS, and a hell of a lot more than what was awarded. It will be years, if EVER that I can properly recover from the ruin he caused. He even blew our son's RESP. A total maggot. A mercedes benz driving, wild spending, sociopath. Hell ya - I deserve SS. And so do many many others. It's up to a Judge to decide, not you.

[punked]

I believe that she (oh pardon her child) who needs 5k a month, not her ex... did I miss something ?

You got it right WorkingDAD. And when EX was paying MORE than that during the marriage - who gets to say that $1,000.00 per month is it?

[BeenThereTwice]

While I do not agree with everything littleman has said, I DO agree with this last post (actually couple of posts ago now). What would the CP do if this $5K/month support simply stops as at result of payor death. As far as I can tell, the laws are all written that both CS and SS shall be paid in an amount determined by payor income.. and it's safe to say that that income will stop at death. Though the courts will sometimes order one or both parents to have life insurance to deal with this, there is, to my knowledge, NO requirement to pay support after death, even if the estate can afford it.

So.. and here is where I agree with littleman, the recipient CP should be responsible to earn his/her own income, if for no other reason than to enure that the child will have cared for after payor death. And BTW.. it's not only the "death" life event hat can trigger this. The same would be true if the payor had a stroke, a serious car accident, or got downsized out of a job.

In my own case, I have shared custody (in same home) and I pay CS, and pay all home expenses and most child expenses, AND deliver half of all child care. (kids 10 and 15). Been these way for 5 years. My ex has very limited expenses for the kids, and none for the home. In total there are 3 adults in the house (her sistyer as well) all capable to take care of the kids (who in any event are quite capable and independant themselves. So the setting SHOULD enable the ex to get re-educated and get a job.. but she does NEITHER. She is 45, and i am 58, and I can see the day coming where I am no longer able to cover expenses as I have been. And unfortnately, when that day comes, the ex will not be equipped or ready to take over.

I know that my ex EXPECTS to receive support for life, in the form of CS and free housing (as now) or in the form of indefinate CS and SS if in separet housing. She has told me so. She EXPECTS to not work. She feels ENTITLED to "lifetime support".

And.. in case anyone thinks we had a traditional marriage, where she was a stay at home mom when the kids were younger, we were NOT. She worked the entire time of our marriage, with the exception of 12 months maternity leave at the birth of each child. We have day care from a young age, and my youngest spent 18 months with my ex and I in the office where we both worked. Then.. about 7 years ago.. she just decided.. unilaterally, that she was done working.. forever. I didn't agree.. and that lead in 2006 to our separation.

BOTH parents are supposedly REQUIRED to act in the best interests of their children. And I simply can't see ANY arguement that would justify my ex NOT seeking employment as being in the kids best interests. If anything, it's a bad influence on the kids to see a parent litterally doing nothing.

[littleman]

there is no amount of BS in this world that will EVER convince me that a child needs an absorbant amount of cash to survive in a month. if so time to get a reality check and move them to an apartment and out of the 4000 square foot home, drop the designer threads and see the way the real world lives.
no ex spouse needs to be carried through life by their ex. when does this ever stop. He is paying for her and he is paying for the kids on top but he is living at his parents cause HE cant afford to live. (just an example).

there is nothing in this world that will convince me that anyone should be qualified for SS. No one ever looks at what if the payor dies, SS cut off immediately and the receipient has to get a job. Why in the world does something tragic have to happen for people to be self sufficient. Back to my original statement that this has become world of entitlement and it needs to stop.

[punked]

Littleman: SS is like welfare?? You have tunnel vision. Your opinion is not realistic nor is it based on the LAW. My ex ripped me off for tens of thousands of dollars. This greatly affected my life and my son's. He is NOT pounding any pavement I can assure you. He spends money like water and rips ppl off (currently the new wife). She sold her house and w/the profits, "they" bought another home. He works. When he feels like it, and spends other people's money. Hers, her parents (they've loaned him money - (money they will never ever see returned). It was determined in Court, at Trial, by a JUDGE - based on evidence that I had been left in financial hardship as the result of his willful actions. Left financially burdened.. At a "clear disadvantage" - so YES I DO deserve SS, and a hell of a lot more than what was awarded. It will be years, if EVER that I can properly recover from the ruin he caused. He even blew our son's RESP. A total maggot. A mercedes benz driving, wild spending, sociopath. Hell ya - I deserve SS. And so do many many others. It's up to a Judge to decide, not you.

HERE HERE!

Everyone has their own set of circumstances.

The unfortunate part is that the only tool the court system has to punish/reward with is MONEY.

Let's look at it this way .......

If the Judge had it within his means to cut off his balls and turn him into a eunich and serve me for the rest of his life .... feeding me those bon bons I apparently sit there and eat all day while the kids are in school .... then perhaps I wouldn't think that SS was the be-all and end-all of conclusions to a shitty marriage that had a shitty outcome. ???

Sorry .... dreaming there. Money is the only tool the courts can use.

[littleman]

Littleman: SS is like welfare?? You have tunnel vision. Your opinion is not realistic nor is it based on the LAW. My ex ripped me off for tens of thousands of dollars. This greatly affected my life and my son's. He is NOT pounding any pavement I can assure you. He spends money like water and rips ppl off (currently the new wife). She sold her house and w/the profits, "they" bought another home. He works. When he feels like it, and spends other people's money. Hers, her parents (they've loaned him money - (money they will never ever see returned). It was determined in Court, at Trial, by a JUDGE - based on evidence that I had been left in financial hardship as the result of his willful actions. Left financially burdened.. At a "clear disadvantage" - so YES I DO deserve SS, and a hell of a lot more than what was awarded. It will be years, if EVER that I can properly recover from the ruin he caused. He even blew our son's RESP. A total maggot. A mercedes benz driving, wild spending, sociopath. Hell ya - I deserve SS. And so do many many others. It's up to a Judge to decide, not you.

that means he is a dead beat and you got screwed but sadly doesnt mean you are entitled. and yes I thik SS is similar to welfare. You get money for not going to work correct? Im thinking you are missing the mark. I empathize with you however I still dont think you are entitled. He is her problem now ad be thankful not vengeful- vengeance comes out with children - they can feel it
all you have to think is he is putting her in debt so far she cant see daylight but be thankful you can

[HappyMomma]

Im sorry but above argument doesnt hold water with me. I am a parent, I was married and we had a marital home...all the married stuff. I never once considered asking for SS because I believe that parents have an obligation to their children to show that there is no shame in working to obtain what you want in life. To me accepting SS is living off someone elses dime and equal to being on welfare. SS is never appropriate. The other person is out there pounding the pavement while the one collecting is at home on couch eating bonbons and the kids are off to school. I can see the equality there for sure.

Agreed - however, if one parent gave up their career and/or education to stay at home and raise the children then SS may be necessary for a while. I don't agree it should be indefinite but you can not seriously expect someone to leave a marriage with no education or skills and find a job to support themselves and their children right away.

When you are married you are a unit. You support each other. Just because one person works and the other stays home, does not make the money coming into the household the possession of the employed. That's an archaic outlook. If that marriage breaks down, the one who stayed home should not be left with nothing. They contributed as well. They should be given the opportunity to get on their feet and support themselves.

Unfortunately, there are way too many people who feel they should never have to look after themselves.