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  • rockscan
    replied
    The court would look to your agreement and then the law. So if your agreement says grants and scholarships then OSAP then the RESP then parents it would be the 1/3 split approach. If you paid the full tuition bill for the first term then the agreement and the law have both not been followed.

    Your first step is to reach out to your ex via email…

    Dear ex,

    There seems to be an issue with provision of statements of account and receipts and payment of school expenses. (Kid) is not a signatory to our agreement and therefore I expect you to be providing full details.

    As such, until I receive full disclosure of the statement of accounts from the school and OSAP, I will not be providing any further payment of school expenses. Once I receive these documents, we will be able to calculate the accurate amounts owing by all three parties.

    Thank you

    They will probably panic and bitch and stomp and yell and the ex will make kid contact you. Until you get the printed/digital copies, you ignore them.

    My husband went through this. It took him two months of staying strong and calls and emails from his ex and kid. They both kept saying they don't have any copies and kid didn't know how to get their account details etc. Turns out, kid got $2000 more in grant funds AND expenses were almost $4,000 cheaper than they were claiming.

    Their failure to provide full disclosure does not constitute a crisis on your part. If the tuition is owed immediately then they should have provided everything up front. They've had three months.

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  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by StillPaying View Post
    The agreement would not be enforced.

    So in about a year, when the child's RESP runs out, they will be forced to rely on their full OSAP loan unless they start disclosing financials. You haven't spent any money yet; seems like a lot of stress for a couple hundred dollars you'll recover once asked to pay...
    it is more than couple hundred dollars. From the current term I accidentally discovered, grant was covering almost 50% of tuition - pleasant surprise from the government. I can only assume what was in other years, but if it was comparable amount of grants, had child used it on school and not on something else, the grants plus RESP would've be sufficient to graduate without asking parents for money and without taking OSAP loans. And without going to courts and arguing about it.

    Leave a comment:


  • StillPaying
    replied
    The agreement would not be enforced.

    So in about a year, when the child's RESP runs out, they will be forced to rely on their full OSAP loan unless they start disclosing financials. You haven't spent any money yet; seems like a lot of stress for a couple hundred dollars you'll recover once asked to pay...

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by StillPaying View Post
    Pre-separation RESP's would come off the top.
    The agreement said "grants, scholarship and OSAP" comes first, then RESP, then parents.
    I did pay 100% from RESP, as both ex and child didn't tell there were grants. I guess what I am afraid, is RESP will run out in about a year, and then child will claim "grants are also gone", or will simply decline to disclose them




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  • StillPaying
    replied
    Pre-separation RESP's would come off the top.

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by rockscan View Post
    I just remembered…ask for the child's statement of account from the school AND the OSAP account. The school receipt will show the breakdown of loan/grant from OSAP and what fees were charged. The OSAP account will also show it but the school receipt will have a lot of detail.

    .
    Did exactly that. I was only provided a single statement from OSAP - the older one were not provided, and I suspect it will uncover fund misuse. The school account shows only tuition fee like an invoice, nothing else, is there a different name to this document I should request?

    The scholarship/grant information outside of OSAP was also not provided, and I gave an option to state "I didn't receive any". The thing is I know that school gives at least one minimum scholarship, so I know it was given, and likely spent on something other than school.

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by rockscan View Post
    Also note, you should be dealing with your ex on this not just your child. The agreement is between you and your ex not you and your child. Not sure why your ex is making your child do this.
    this is where it get's funny. My ex doesn't talk to me. But I know it is my ex who writes those letters from child's email address - we lived together for way too long, it doesn't take degree in literature to tell apart writing of my ex from my child. So, I can either ignore them completely, or politely ask for account statements, and get a silence in response.
    I believe ex is doing it this way, so that should case get to court, ex would claim the letters were written by child, and ex didn't have anything to do with it. But probably I should respond to "have other parent reach to me, I won't be discussing it with you moving on" Not sure. Technically child is now over 18 and is adult.

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by rockscan View Post

    The rule is that kids shouldn't be punished financially for their parent's split BUT kids do have a responsibility. Your child can't say $500 is my contribution and you can't say use all the loan money.

    At this point I think you need the receipts to see what the full cost was and how much grant money was awarded. I have a strong feeling that the other parent isn't stepping up and kid spent all their money on shit.
    I was paying 100% for child's education (from my RESP opened before separation) until suddenly I discovered there was a grant from OSAP (and more than one, just I know the $ value on one only) and scholarship from the school. So at minimum I say that all grants / scholarships received that were misused, should be applied as future school payment.

    The OSAP loan was never even a question before as I didn't know my child was getting one, but as I got myself into this uncomfortable situation with misused grants, I started looking into it as well. In general I agree that child should contribute, and it isn't that my life would become much easier - half of child's 30% is a drop in a bucket, but it is a good economical lesson to a young adult.

    Leave a comment:


  • rockscan
    replied
    I just remembered…ask for the child's statement of account from the school AND the OSAP account. The school receipt will show the breakdown of loan/grant from OSAP and what fees were charged. The OSAP account will also show it but the school receipt will have a lot of detail.

    At least this was the way it was for my husband and both his kids went to different schools.

    Leave a comment:


  • rockscan
    replied
    Also note, you should be dealing with your ex on this not just your child. The agreement is between you and your ex not you and your child. Not sure why your ex is making your child do this.

    Leave a comment:


  • rockscan
    replied
    My husband went to court on this. His ex felt kids shouldn't have to pay anything. Their agreement said “a reasonable contribution from the child”. It also included the loans, grants, scholarships etc part.

    Hypothetically, let's say tuition is $10,000. OSAP grants total $1,000. So then to split it 1/3, kid has to pay $3,000 with the remaining $6,000 split between parents. You would apply the RESP to that.

    The rule is that kids shouldn't be punished financially for their parent's split BUT kids do have a responsibility. Your child can't say $500 is my contribution and you can't say use all the loan money.

    At this point I think you need the receipts to see what the full cost was and how much grant money was awarded. I have a strong feeling that the other parent isn't stepping up and kid spent all their money on shit. But that's just my two cents.

    Leave a comment:


  • StillPaying
    replied
    It wouldn't make sense for child to take out loan before RESP's are used. On behave of the child, yes - it could be set aside.

    Whether or not a child will be expected to take out student loans depends on the facts of the case, including the intentions of the parents prior to separation and the economic realities of the parties at the time the education expense is incurred. Student loans are routinely considered and will usually reduce the contribution required by a parent if those loans have in fact been received. The student loan should be considered a contribution by the child, since it will be the child who has to pay the loan following graduation. In some cases, where a parent has wrongly refused to contribute to a child's education costs, the parent may be required to make a full contribution to reimburse the child for the loan that otherwise would not have been incurred. And, sometimes a loan is received one year and reduces the parent's obligation, but is not required of the child the next year, or vice versa. As noted above, these cases are very fact-specific.

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Good link, thank you. Let me copy part from it:

    "Children are expected to make a reasonable financial contribution to their own post-secondary education costs. All the financial means of the child are considered and are relevant to the determination of the child's contribution. Those "means" include both income and capital resources, such as:
    • employment income;
    • savings;
    • scholarships;
    • grants and bursaries; and
    • loans (including OSAP).

    The extent that a child is expected to contribute to his or her education costs varies widely from case to case. The analysis is very fact specific, even within the same family.
    ​"

    So it is really not that clear. Does court order we have has any weight, or it could be set aside? Our order says that scholarships, grants and OSAP applied before RESP or Parents do.

    Leave a comment:


  • StillPaying
    replied
    Child wouldn't be expected to fund, borrow/repay, their entire post secondary so parents don't have to; regardless of agreement. It's the "free" money they get that comes off the top, then the rest split into 3rds. OSAP loan, if they choose to use it, is for the child's portion. If they get scammed by either parent, they can use more OSAP to cover the costs, then get an order for repayment.

    Here a good explanation of post secondary:
    https://www.lexisnexis.ca/en-ca/sl/2...-expenses.page

    Leave a comment:


  • alive
    replied
    Originally posted by rockscan View Post
    They would have to apply for OSAP as they are entitled to tuition grants. Depending on how much they get it would be their 1/3.
    I appreciate your answer, but would like to clarify this part. The OSAP consists of grants (non repayable) and loans (repayable). Child's position that he takes only grant from OSAP (by the style of letter I assume it is written by my ex from child's email account, but it doesn't really matter). I see this as OSAP is OSAP, including a loan, and if court order says available OSAP has to be applied before parents contribution, that includes the loan. Maybe the truth is the loan has to be included to cover 1/3 of after grants tuition fee. Would you have any thoughts on this?

    Leave a comment:

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