Child Tax Benefit, does it offset Section 7?

[respondent]

I guess I am at loss after reading this thread.
Imagine ex getting CS/SS, and on top of that gets about 6-7K per child each year (UCCB or whatever it is called).

She then spends about 10k a year per child on extra curriculum activities, and demands % of 10k a year that derives from NDI (from Divorce Mate). Let imagine for the sake of argument all expenses were agreed between parties. Would you need to pay % from 10k or % from 10-7 = 3k?

[blinkandimgone]

You are only required to pay a proportionate share of expenses for daycare required for her employment. If you were previously paying $250 for full-time care and it has been reduced to only before and after school care it is reasonable to expect a substantial reduction in daycare costs.

Extended daycare programs through the school cost an average of $11-14 for either before or after school care per child, so between 22-28$ per day for before and after school care.

Also remember to prorate the expenses to take into account summer, march break and xmas holidays where the kids are with the parents rather than in daycare.

Crunch the numbers and figure out how many days on average the kid should require care, whether EDP or a private daycare would be less. Either way, the cost should drop when no longer in full time care.

With a mock up return with her numbers, you should be able to figure out the actual out of pocket expense for care and determine your proportionate share of that.

Once you do that, yoi can decide if it is worth the time and money to seek a motion to change.

[rockscan]

They dont calculate those amounts. When you file your taxes you claim daycare and THAT benefit is what comes off. Do a mock tax return with her info (if you have an old return of hers enter the income info) and then enter the daycare amount and see the return then take the daycare amount out and see the return. The difference in those amounts is the tax benefit that comes off the total.

If her mother is providing a receipt to her then its claimed. If youre concerned about it then contact the cra snitch line to report her as failing to report income.

[petta24]

child tax benefit,ucb, determining section 7 expenses share

hi I have the same problem, wondering how the system determines the proportional share of section 7 expenses after tax credits. here are the numbers

ex has sole custody, I have access on alternating weekends

me: $49 664
ex: $44 256

Daycare: $12 800

ex: $7000 cctb, $ 1200 ucb

my question is how do they take the $7000, $ $1200 tax benefits into account for the yearly cost of $12 800 for day care in determining my proportional share of section 7 costs.

$12 800
-7000
-1200
= $4600 IS THIS NUMBER OF DAYCARE COSTS I SHOULD BE SHARING,? AS OF RIGHT NOW HER LAWYER IS SAYING I HAVE TO pay $500/MONTH FOR DAYCARE WHICH SEEMS REALLY HIGH

- SIDE NOTE THE EX HAS HER MOTHER BABYSITTING AND IS APPARENTLY CHARGING THE EX $250.00/WEEK FOR BABYSITTING, AND IS STILL CHARGING HER ON PAPER THIS RATE EVEN THOUGH OUR CHILD IS GOING TO SCHOOL FULL TIME KINDERGARTEN MON-FRI? QUITE THE SCAM THEY HAVE GOING, SEEMS LIKE TAX FRAUD, THEFT, STEALING TO ME.

[blinkandimgone]

MySupportCalculator.ca

The quoted part above is in the info (blue question mark) on the results calculation page.

[dave9911]

Actually, my support calculator specifically addresses this:

Hi Blink,

Thanks. I've been off here for a couple years so not sure what calc you're referring to. I'm interested in what stands up in court. Your example is what seems fair and reasonable for sure but my 6 plus years in the Family Law grinder have taught me that's often not relevant..

[blinkandimgone]

Actually, my support calculator specifically addresses this:

Special Expenses are shared between the parties "proportionately" which means that each pays his or her share of the net cost of the expense according to his or her income in relation to the combined incomes of the parties. For instance, if Self earns $80,000/year, and Spouse earns $20,000/year, Self is responsible for 80% of the net cost of the Special Expenses and Spouse is responsible for 20% of the net cost of the Special Expenses.

Any monthly spousal support paid/received by the parties must be deducted/included in each one’s income (as appropriate) and so will affect each party’s proportionate share of Special Expenses. For instance, if Self is paying Spouse spousal support of $1,154 per month (ie. $13,848 per year), Self’s annual income will be reduced to $66,152 and Spouse’s annual income will be increased to $33,848, meaning that Self will now be responsible for 66% of the net cost of the Special Expenses and Spouse for 34% of the net cost of the Special Expenses.

[blinkandimgone]

Ss is taxable income to the recipient and a tax credit to the payor, so it is most likely it would be the 70/30 scenario above.

Eta: mysupportcalculator.ca does a reasonably good job of determining s.7 amounts for both in a variety of scenarios.

[dave9911]

Think you've confused what I'm asking. Been paying SS for 4 years now. Simply asking how that SS paid (and received) for her factors into s7 apportioning.

Example: Bob earns 80k and pays 10k in SS
Sue Earns 20k and received 10k in SS

Is the split of s7 then 80/20 or 70/30 or maybe 80/30? The law has crazier interpretations...

Thanks

[Rioe]

Shared custody and my income high enough I think not. Thanks though.

Anyone know how SS gets factored into s7 percentage paid? I'm thinking like CRA fr income. Comes off my side and gets added to hers? So if SS 10k my income for s7 shows 10 lower and hers 10 higher?

I've always thought it should be like that too, but as I understand it, kid stuff is always done before adult stuff. So CS and s7 proportion are determined based on your incomes, and THEN SS is determined. Something about how the kids' needs come first, and because CS is automatic and starts immediately, while entitlement to SS must be determined, sometimes at length.

[dave9911]

Shared custody and my income high enough I think not. Thanks though.

Anyone know how SS gets factored into s7 percentage paid? I'm thinking like CRA fr income. Comes off my side and gets added to hers? So if SS 10k my income for s7 shows 10 lower and hers 10 higher?

[rockscan]

Child Tax Benefit, does it offset Section 7?

Then your kid should be eligible for some government grants with moms income.

Get your SS issues figured out then deal with university. Youve got two battles going on.

[dave9911]

Already done. Judge imputed 10k annual. Hilarious as doesn't break CS floor and likely less than she'd make on welfare. ECE teacher and likely make 25 or so but not worth a 20k court battle in terms of what I'd hope to recoup in CS. Anyway my my point.

Just a bit grey on where spousal factors in for percentage of s7 obligation.

[rockscan]

In that case depending on what your ex does, you might want to also look at imputing an income to her. Might make s7 expense calculation much easier.

[dave9911]

Well if you lol at references above it says to deduct spousal (not CS) in determined s7. Doesn't say to add it to receiving party for same purpose but yes on taxes this is what happens. I deduct she adds it to her income for taxation purposes.

Well aware new partner income matters not. Just that spousal normally ends when receiving party is self sufficient. I'd say 45 grand in support and settlement income and 120 grand from a new spouse applies. But I have to get the court to agree. I digress...

Yes the law is intentionally grey so that it perpetuates itself. As lawyers always say...'well if the parties can't agree you'll have to get in front of a judge for a ruling". Of course, at $500 an hour for the lawyer quoting this.