parental alienation and child support

[JB514]

Thanks Tayken, I will look into that.

[Tayken]

Hi, I am in a kind of similar situation, but my Dtr is 14 almost 15 now and is refusing to see me or have any sort of communication. Recently I was taken to court to vary CS by my ex, and I had few consultations with lawyers. There was this one lawyer from a very established law firm and he has many years of experience. When we discussed things, he advised me that I should file a motion to terminate CS because my Dtr unilaterally terminated our relationship. If I had hired him for that purpose, it would cost me big $$. So I roughly calculated if it was worth it for me to pursue + there is no guaranty that it would be granted. Unless I represent myself.

From what I gathered, if the child UNILATERALLY terminates the relationship, then it might be reviewed. Parental Alienation does not necessary has grounds for terminating CS. There are ways of dealing with it through courts, and if that fails then you could review your options. But once the child is more or less old enough to decide for themselves, court understands that there is little they can do to force a child who can simply refuse to have a relationship with the other parent. I think that things like that are very case specific and there is no law that states that.

Section 30 Custody and Access evaluation is the real only option after age 14. A psychologist/psychiatrist would have to assist the court in the matter. They have to make the determination etc...

Good Luck!
Tayken

[JB514]

Hi, I am in a kind of similar situation, but my Dtr is 14 almost 15 now and is refusing to see me or have any sort of communication. Recently I was taken to court to vary CS by my ex, and I had few consultations with lawyers. There was this one lawyer from a very established law firm and he has many years of experience. When we discussed things, he advised me that I should file a motion to terminate CS because my Dtr unilaterally terminated our relationship. If I had hired him for that purpose, it would cost me big $$. So I roughly calculated if it was worth it for me to pursue + there is no guaranty that it would be granted. Unless I represent myself.

From what I gathered, if the child UNILATERALLY terminates the relationship, then it might be reviewed. Parental Alienation does not necessary has grounds for terminating CS. There are ways of dealing with it through courts, and if that fails then you could review your options. But once the child is more or less old enough to decide for themselves, court understands that there is little they can do to force a child who can simply refuse to have a relationship with the other parent. I think that things like that are very case specific and there is no law that states that.

[Tayken]

Respectfully, I was only asking a question. Can you show me where I suggested that I am more concerned about CS than getting back with my child? I reread my original post and nothing indicates such.

It seems that this is a common assumption that most people make.

1. You did not raise the concern about changing custody which would be the first thing a parent who is the victim of PAS would raise.

2. PAS is a very serious psychological attack on your child by the custodial parent. It is recognized as a serious form of abuse in the same line as physical abuse. To some justices, worse.

3. You did not ask about how to deal with the PAS issue. Just how to punish a child who you claim is being *abused* through PAS (or HAP) by ending child support payments.

4. Failing concerns on points 1-3 provided you asked how to end child support. This doesn't demonstrate that you are concerned about proving PAS and specifically you want to prove PAS so you can eliminate child support. Generally a concerned and child-centric parent would want to increase their access and custody of the child and remove them from an abusive situation.

This is the logic many people are probably applying to the limited information you provided. Hope it provides some insight into the questions you are getting.

Good Luck!
Tayken

[blinkandimgone]

Still curious as to how old the kid is.....

[Chris2008]

I think it's because the mere fact that you are saying that parenting alienation is somehow related to child support (aka taking care of your child).

Well, I am in the same boat as you where my newly ex is withholding access from me. We have yet to finalize a parenting plan and we're going to court for it. However, I still paid my share of the child support. Think of it this way, you have an obligation to support your own child from a moral let alone legal standpoint. The child needs to be clothed, fed, and have a roof under his head.

Just because you say it's PAS doesn't change the fact the child still has those needs to be taken care of by BOTH parents. Until the custody arrangement changes, then the CS changes.

Think of it on the other shoe, if you had the kids, your ex accused you of PAS, she can withhold money for your child? So now you don't have enough money to feed your kid etc..(in extreme case here) Who is that hurting in the end? I would say suck it up till you get a judgement.

I think a judge will question your motives if you showed him you didn't pay any child support for the past 3 months waiting for trial.

[kevindell]

...
It seems that this is a common assumption that most people make.

Exactly. As soon as I asked for custody(50/50) the assumption I had to fight was that I was doing it for the money. Something that my ex did not. Would have been cheaper for me to not ask for a change.

Get the custody changes you want. Then go for money changes later.

[RoCr]

Sorry, little experience with this other than being on the receiving end of bouts of alienation.

Respectfully though, on the face of things it seems that you are more worried about CS than getting back with your kid(s).

It seems that the solutions put in place put the kids in your custody.
Pettenuzzo-Deschene v. Deschene (Ontario, August 2007)

Respectfully, I was only asking a question. Can you show me where I suggested that I am more concerned about CS than getting back with my child? I reread my original post and nothing indicates such.

It seems that this is a common assumption that most people make.

[kevindell]

Thanks. I understood that there were some cases where child support was no longer an obligation since the alienation was so severe that...
Cheers,
Scotty

Sorry, little experience with this other than being on the receiving end of bouts of alienation.

Respectfully though, on the face of things it seems that you are more worried about CS than getting back with your kid(s).

It seems that the solutions put in place put the kids in your custody.
Pettenuzzo-Deschene v. Deschene (Ontario, August 2007)

[blinkandimgone]

And your child(ren) is/are how old? The 'child' in that particular case was almost 20 years old and given that she wouldn't provide proof of enrollment in post-secondary education was no longer considered a child of marriage for the purposes of child support.

[RoCr]

There aren't really any grounds for 'forgoing' child support. Access and financial responsibility are mutually exclusive. You don't have to be able to see your child in order to be responsible for financially supporting your child.

You should be more focused on gaining access or a change in custody to secure a meaningful relationship with your child(ren)then getting out of paying child support.

Thanks. I understood that there were some cases where child support was no longer an obligation since the alienation was so severe that no relationship could ever be salvaged and where the child severed the relationship.

Please take a look at Marsland v. Gibb 2000 BCSC 471 (CanLII), (2000), 5 R.F.L. (5th) 406 (B.C.S.C.) among others.

Cheers,
Scotty

[RoCr]

nope but can be grounds for change in custody.....

working on it. Thanks.

[blinkandimgone]

There aren't really any grounds for 'forgoing' child support. Access and financial responsibility are mutually exclusive. You don't have to be able to see your child in order to be responsible for financially supporting your child.

You should be more focused on gaining access or a change in custody to secure a meaningful relationship with your child(ren)then getting out of paying child support.

[RoCr]

I'm alleging that my x has alienated my child from me. We are going to be going to court. In the interim my x wants child support.

Can the allegation of Parental alienation be grounds for forgoing child support.

Thanks.