Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Chapter 2; Should have left along time ago

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Chapter 2; Should have left along time ago

    Hello:

    I'm the woman who posted the thread below.
    https://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/...archid=1586821

    For some reason, I cannot log into my old account but I would like to share the second chapter of my story (Because I know that I'm not alone).

    First, I want to thank EVERY person who commented in that last thread. THANK YOU ! You gave me the strength to do what I thought I couldn't do -Leave and call the police!! The police were useless, but I told my story. I can no longer be extorted or abuse because the entire story is out and my freedom is worth it.

    1. I left the matrimonial home 8 mths ago, and checked into a shelter, and then moved to another province (I'm assuming Tayken will be in here to rip me a new one, now)

    But this is my life. And I have a duty to protect my life and children. My last straw was when he said he would kill me and the girls if we left him. I left the next day. No regrets!

    We went for 5 1/2 half months without hearing from him. And for the first time in a long time, we finally felt safe, and our home life was peaceful.

    The EX said he and we would go to counseling if we came back. I just asked him to get some help, and for the contact details to his family lawyer (mind you, he's a lawyer himself).. He refused to hand it over but He tried to be nice at first but went back to his old self eventually.

    2. I went to police shortly after I left, it took them 7 months to "lay charges" and the detect called me on several occasions to let me know that he felt that I should have just left. He even told the witnesses he spoke to. Again, the police were NOT on the objective side of the law. The charges were dropped few weeks ago.

    3. During the time that I waited for the police's investigation to be completed, I went to counseling, started working and going to school, got the children settled into school, and waiting for my EX to take action.

    I consulted with a lawyer and she advised me to wait as long as possible to file.

    4. I finally filed (Parenting Order, EPO) and within my new jurisdiction in February but 3 days later I discovered that my EX has started proceedings a few weeks prior and pretended to serve me.

    He sent a registered letter to himself (his address), lied about serving me via email, and finally, he sent fake emails in as evidence.

    5. When I served him he obtained an endorsement letter from the courts forcing me to return to Ontario.

    The problem was that 98% of the allegations/reasons she based her decision upon was inaccurate. Her letter indicated that I called the police in February in retaliation to the court proceedings, she believes I was already aware of.

    They believe that I moved/ traveled after I was served in February. Also, untrue. They're also refusing to let go of Ontario's jurisdiction but acknowledges that BOTH courts have jurisdiction.

    Then she states that she's not willing to grant him custody. She states that if he was so concerned he should have taken action a long time ago.

    6. The courts in my jurisdiction made it a priority for me to serve him so his voice could be heard -They made is clear that even if he calls in, they wanted his side of the story. The courts in Ontario refused to afford me that same opportunity. When I called or tried to file, the clerks and the judicial secretary advised me that I was not permitted to call in. "You must return to Ontario".

    7. The problem with this is the Judge in Ontario consulted with me a few years ago, when they were a lawyer. I asked them (when they were a lawyer) for help in order to get out of my situation. I did not retain them, but I did share details related to the charges.

    8. This judge has since decided that they would recuse themselves but wanted to be a part of the process to "guide the "other" Judges" decision and changed their month 48 hours later. Yes, they are no longer recusing themselves.

    AND They advised us that they would be testifying in the Criminal case as well.

    9. This Judge also called into the hearings that took place in my jurisdiction (my EX was present, he flew in) They kept interrupting, and advocating for my EX..They knew all of his argument and kept interjecting to say "Well in Ontario we do it this way" . "let me teach you how we do things in Ontario"

    10. It was a circus. I know.

    11. There will be a jurisdiction hearing that my lawyer tells me I'm going to lose. The Ex denies being abusive but, I maintained records and videos of the things he's done. But I'm guessing that's not enough to keep us where we are. Both judges are insisting on supervised visits, which he rejects, me to chose a friend or another person to monitor interactions instead. He also wants sole custody.

    (During the time we've been gone he obtain my driving records, and testimony from my former employers, he even reached out to my employment lawyer from a year ago (my former boss gave him the contact details) I'm shocked that this stuff was event accepted as evidence without any question.)

    12. I've asked my youngest to call him. So far she's called 28 times over the past month and he's refusing to answer her calls. She leaves voicemails as well.

    13. Mediation has been suggested but he's not cooperating.

    14. An order has been made for our daughter to have a lawyer (She does not want to go back there)

    This is tough and many mistakes were made, I just can't go back there and live my life in fear of this man. I know I'm not alone, and I know I should have asked for permission or even stayed but ..who's there to protect us? As stupid as it sounds, I needed to be somewhere I had friends and ppl around me who cared about us so that I could recover and regroup. Dealing with people who are fundamentally exploitative drains your soul on so many levels.

    Your thoughts?

  • #2
    I am sorry for what you and your children had to go through to find normalcy and peace. Unfortunately, the family courts frown upon self-help remedies when it comes to custody and often people are forced to return to abusive situations. You have a challenge ahead of you with your ex being a lawyer and the situation with a former lawyer/judge (that you had consulted with) now endorsing your ex's position.

    How old are your children? I think it is significant that your daughter has tried unsuccessfully to telephone your ex 28 times. You should obtain all current school records as well as anything that shows how well your children have adjusted to their new schools.

    In one part of your post you say that the charges against your ex were dropped yet later in your post you indicate there will be a criminal case. Please expand upon that.

    You make mention of your ex obtaining employment records and information from your employment lawyer. What is that all about?

    I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet about being forced to move back. If your children can be well-represented by their own legal counsel (I don't know the age of your children) could an arrangement not be made for your ex or children travel for access visits?

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Arabian,

      Thank you for the reply. It is very hard to keep the faith. But everything about this feels wrong.

      My children are between (8 and 14). I met with their lawyer this week. (The EX argued vigorously against retaining a lawyer for the child but the judge said no and issued a court order.) Their lawyer told me that the girls are polite and I that I've done a good job, She said it obvious they want to live with me, but she said I have a tough battle ahead because the weight of this case is based on Jurisdiction. She urged me to retain new counsel ( I let go my last lawyer a few days ago because she refused to send my ex the report cards and photos he asked for in court, she just told me to go back to Ontario )because the law is not on my side (Ontario law).


      My daughter says she dislikes calling him, I still make her call anyway. I told her it's important that she does. I bought her her own phone and sat her down and dialed the number. I think it hurts her, even more, when he does not pick up or call back or respond to her text messages. Hopefully, we can come up with a schedule or a plan. My therapist thinks reunification therapy would be helpful. Still, I'm documenting everything because I'm sure he'll have a great explanation for this.


      Charges: The crown contacted me several days ago and said while it's obvious that he's done horrible things to you guys, they don't have enough evidence to move forward so that charges would be dropped. The judge made the announcement that they would be testifying in the criminal hearing back in March. (I'm ordering the transcripts, but the other lawyers in courtroom pulled me aside and advise me that what was going on was unorthodox. My lawyer just did not care)

      (Both the family and the Criminal matter were dealt with in the same courthouse) He also works out of there, so he's is very well known there. The court clerks and judicial security were calling him to advise him of the times I called requesting information/ or dates and documents. He included these details in his affidavit. )

      Employment: My former just had a manager that was very abusive to the staff, I quit after he threw a Christmas ornament at me. The problem was they did not want me to leave so they fired him. I decided to leave anyway because on top the stresses at work the EX would do anything in his power to prevent me from maintaining my independence. (He owned the house we lived in and he would come and go as he pleased, he would cut the heat, hot water, take away my house key and lock me out of the house, and cut the internet. I would come home and the mattress on our beds (He forced the kids and myself to sleep in the same room) would be gone. He would try to change the locks during the day (I have a video of this as well) This was very stressful, and my work suffered. I did not sue them I just left.

      ^ The EX used the incident in his affidavit in family court stating that I had a history of making false allegations against people. So he listed my former employer and their contact information and stated that he plans to subpoena them. The problem is he's lying but he did manage to get a copy of my severance package and they gave him the name of the employment lawyer I used.

      The second example he used was two family lawyers that I consulted with, and they went back to him and told him about it. I'm once again, shocked that this would be permitted as evidence. I thought this was privileged information.

      The only good thing about this is that the girls are both doing great, Sometimes I don't even recognize them! They're flourishing! but we're all having a hard time coping with the possibility of going back. We have a life here now, and it's important for us to no longer be financially dependent upon him. Forcing us to go back would force us into poverty and back into the same cycle we lived in before.







      Originally posted by arabian View Post
      I am sorry for what you and your children had to go through to find normalcy and peace. Unfortunately, the family courts frown upon self-help remedies when it comes to custody and often people are forced to return to abusive situations. You have a challenge ahead of you with your ex being a lawyer and the situation with a former lawyer/judge (that you had consulted with) now endorsing your ex's position.

      How old are your children? I think it is significant that your daughter has tried unsuccessfully to telephone your ex 28 times. You should obtain all current school records as well as anything that shows how well your children have adjusted to their new schools.

      In one part of your post you say that the charges against your ex were dropped yet later in your post you indicate there will be a criminal case. Please expand upon that.

      You make mention of your ex obtaining employment records and information from your employment lawyer. What is that all about?

      I wouldn't throw in the towel just yet about being forced to move back. If your children can be well-represented by their own legal counsel (I don't know the age of your children) could an arrangement not be made for your ex or children travel for access visits?

      Comment


      • #4
        You can try to explain this any way you want but the courts see it as this: abduction. This is why everyone is telling you to go back to Ontario. You have abducted your children. It does not matter what kind of monster your ex is and at this point there is no evidence that he was (evidence for the court being a charge and conviction) violent meaning he still has a right to see his kids.

        Further, it doesnt matter how your kids feel. This could be seen as you alienating them and the abduction proves you have no intention of not causing further damage to the relationship.

        Go back to Ontario and take your kids back. Work on your divorce and offer shared custody with primary residence to you.

        Hes not stalking you or watching or using his internal contacts to know things. He is simply trying to get his kids back from his ex wife who UNILATERALLY DECIDED to remove them from their province of residence.

        Right now you are looking at losing your kids. You need to smarten up and listen to your lawyer.

        Comment


        • #5
          We've been here for 8 months.

          This is our home.

          I'm not going back to an abuser.

          Originally posted by rockscan View Post
          You can try to explain this any way you want but the courts see it as this: abduction. This is why everyone is telling you to go back to Ontario. You have abducted your children. It does not matter what kind of monster your ex is and at this point there is no evidence that he was (evidence for the court being a charge and conviction) violent meaning he still has a right to see his kids.

          Further, it doesnt matter how your kids feel. This could be seen as you alienating them and the abduction proves you have no intention of not causing further damage to the relationship.

          Go back to Ontario and take your kids back. Work on your divorce and offer shared custody with primary residence to you.

          Hes not stalking you or watching or using his internal contacts to know things. He is simply trying to get his kids back from his ex wife who UNILATERALLY DECIDED to remove them from their province of residence.

          Right now you are looking at losing your kids. You need to smarten up and listen to your lawyer.

          Comment


          • #6
            You can do whatever you want. The children have to go home.

            You will lose this with that attitude.

            Comment


            • #7
              Your facing an uphill battle. A mobility case will cost you over 100 grand and you will likely loose. You need a Plan B to protect yourself in Ontario, because in all likelihood the children will be moved back here ordered by a Judge and you will want to still be part of their lives.

              You need to have a system in place for your protection, and some safety guard for the children. When your ex was charged a CAS investigation would have started. What is their position?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                You can do whatever you want. The children have to go home.

                You will lose this with that attitude.
                I'm a human being and so are my children.

                We've been here for 8 months.

                We were not married.

                He was abusive to us.

                We were dependent upon him.

                We have witnesses.

                There is video evidence.


                (
                4) The removal or withholding of a child without the consent of the person entitled to custody of the child does not alter the habitual residence of the child unless there has been acquiescence or undue delay in commencing due process by the person from whom the child is removed or withheld.
                I'm not going back to someone who threatened to kill us.

                I'm not going to subject my children to domestic violence.

                I'd rather pay the money and bring a mobility application, but my life and my children's future are worth it!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by kate331 View Post
                  Your facing an uphill battle. A mobility case will cost you over 100 grand and you will likely loose. You need a Plan B to protect yourself in Ontario, because in all likelihood the children will be moved back here ordered by a Judge and you will want to still be part of their lives.

                  You need to have a system in place for your protection, and some safety guard for the children. When your ex was charged a CAS investigation would have started. What is their position?
                  Thanks for your reply.

                  I've been told this as well. But I'm prepared to pay whatever I have to for my freedom. One of the lawyers that were in the courtroom told me not to give up, but to prepare myself for the long haul. It's hard to predict what can happen but she said that if I had no case I would have been ordered back a long time ago.

                  The hearing is only to discuss jurisdiction. BOTH judges have ordered supervised visits and have expressed that they will not be transferring custody over to him.

                  Both judges have acknowledged in their endorsements that BOTH provinces have jurisdiction. We need to decide upon the one that is more suitable and lay out the history and the best interest of the child.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by LeChateau View Post
                    I'm a human being and so are my children.

                    We've been here for 8 months.

                    We were not married.

                    He was abusive to us.

                    We were dependent upon him.

                    We have witnesses.

                    There is video evidence.


                    (

                    I'm not going back to someone who threatened to kill us.

                    I'm not going to subject my children to domestic violence.

                    I'd rather pay the money and bring a mobility application, but my life and my children's future are worth it!

                    The police dropped the charges.
                    He has not been convicted.
                    The courts dont listen to anything but a conviction.
                    He is still their father regardless of your marital situation, how you feel or what you think.

                    When they announce Ontario has the jurisdiction you will have to move back.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                      The police dropped the charges.
                      He has not been convicted.
                      The courts dont listen to anything but a conviction.
                      He is still their father regardless of your marital situation, how you feel or what you think.

                      When they announce Ontario has the jurisdiction you will have to move back.
                      I don't accept that.

                      He's a criminal lawyer who leveraged his relationships after being charged to beat domestic violence charges. That does not mean he wasn't abusive towards us and it certainly does not mean that the videos of him abusing us don't carry any weight in this matter. People beat charges all the time, it does not mean they're innocent.

                      We are home, we've been here for 8 months. And there has been an acquiescence of time.

                      I'm going to stop responding to you because you're trying to make this personal and I have no space in my life for your negativity.

                      Enjoy your day.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I believe there are three (3) things to consider:

                        1. I believe it is significant that your ex took so long to start legal action.
                        2. It is also significant that he, an officer of the court, lied about serving you.
                        3. Finally... his actions, if presented properly with corroborating evidence that you say you possess, may reveal a power imbalance. He is a lawyer and uses court resources to further his case?

                        These should be emphasized, IMO, by competent legal representation. There is case law on CanLii about these matters.

                        I'm not sure about the "judge's endorsement" that you move back to Ontario. I didn't think a judge could compel anyone to move... just children be returned and one would think it would have a police enforcement clause? It is now 8 months after the fact. This could be a very interesting case.

                        I'm sure Tayken will have some insight.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Thank you for the insight.

                          I agree that this will be an uphill battle. I certainly would have brought forth a mobility application if I had the foresight/or information at the time, instead of wanting to run away from him... I might have to retain counsel from both sides moving forward. * sighs *


                          Originally posted by arabian View Post
                          I believe there are three (3) things to consider:

                          1. I believe it is significant that your ex-took so long to start legal action.
                          2. It is also significant that he, an officer of the court, lied about serving you.
                          3. Finally... his actions, if presented properly with corroborating evidence that you say you possess, may reveal a power imbalance. He is a lawyer and uses court resources to further his case?

                          These should be emphasized, IMO, by competent legal representation. There is case law on CanLii about these matters.

                          I'm not sure about the "judge's endorsement" that you move back to Ontario. I didn't think a judge could compel anyone to move... just children be returned and one would think it would have a police enforcement clause? It is now 8 months after the fact. This could be a very interesting case.

                          I'm sure Tayken will have some insight.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by LeChateau View Post
                            Thank you for the insight.



                            I agree that this will be an uphill battle. I certainly would have brought forth a mobility application if I had the foresight/or information at the time, instead of wanting to run away from him... I might have to retain counsel from both sides moving forward. * sighs *


                            How old are your children? They have been there 8 months but how long were they in Ontario?

                            Iím sorry for what you have had to go through but you did abduct your children and moved them out of their habitual residence. It is very possible your ex was dealing with his criminal case before starting this one as with charges pending he knows he would lose. I would strongly urge you to hire an experienced mobility lawyer if youíre trying to fight your ex who is a lawyer.

                            The courts donít care what happened between the two of you. Without convictions or cas reports all you have are allegations against him. If you have video evidence of his abuse how was he not convicted?


                            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thank you, I'll definitely look into retaining a lawyer this week,

                              Originally posted by Berner_Faith View Post
                              How old are your children? They have been there 8 months but how long were they in Ontario?

                              Iím sorry for what you have had to go through but you did abduct your children and moved them out of their habitual residence. It is very possible your ex was dealing with his criminal case before starting this one as with charges pending he knows he would lose. I would strongly urge you to hire an experienced mobility lawyer if youíre trying to fight your ex who is a lawyer.

                              The courts donít care what happened between the two of you. Without convictions or cas reports all you have are allegations against him. If you have video evidence of his abuse how was he not convicted?


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

                              Comment

                              Our Divorce Forums
                              Forums dedicated to helping people all across Canada get through the separation and divorce process, with discussions about legal issues, parenting issues, financial issues and more.
                              Working...
                              X