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  • classic situation

    Living common law in ontario for almost 6 years in my apartment, which i own and is only in my name. No kids involved. I have always worked and earn about $65k a year, while she has seldom worked and earned next to nothing. As it doesn't look like things are going to change, i am thinking of selling my apartment and going my own way.

    With respect to my alimony obligation, i understand that the methods used to calculate are complex, but *approximately* how much can i expect to have to pay in a situation like this? Would the judge take into consideration that she has been lazy, or, would he simply do the math with respect to the difference in our salaries and order me to pay out half my salary for the next half decade?

    Is it worth it for me to pay a lawyer to help me, or am i "screwed"?

    Most of the cash i get from selling the apartment will go to paying off the massive credit card debt i have accumulated from the years supporting her. I understand that my ability to pay is part of the equation in calculating the amount of alimony; so, if i for example go rent an expensive place & expensive car, etc.. to keep my expenses high at the time that she puts the claim through, would this work in my favor due to my high expenses compromising "my ability to pay"?

    kevin

  • #2
    Originally posted by kevin999
    With respect to my alimony obligation, i understand that the methods used to calculate are complex, but *approximately* how much can i expect to have to pay in a situation like this? Would the judge take into consideration that she has been lazy, or, would he simply do the math with respect to the difference in our salaries and order me to pay out half my salary for the next half decade?

    Most of the cash i get from selling the apartment will go to paying off the massive credit card debt i have accumulated from the years supporting her. I understand that my ability to pay is part of the equation in calculating the amount of alimony; so, if i for example go rent an expensive place & expensive car, etc.. to keep my expenses high at the time that she puts the claim through, would this work in my favor due to my high expenses compromising "my ability to pay"?

    kevin

    First and foremost, grow up.
    You had no issue it seems with her being home while you worked until there started to be problems.

    And no, being a nasty (insert word here) in hopes to not have to pay out anything to her is not going to help you.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Kimberley View Post
      First and foremost, grow up.
      You had no issue it seems with her being home while you worked until there started to be problems.
      Really? You're sure of that? How did you come to that conclusion after reading one post? Maybe he's had an issue all along with her not working or not working much and maybe he's had 6 years of it and is fed up. Maybe he has been fine with it all along and there's another reason, one that he hasn't even mentioned, that makes him think it's over. Maybe it's his fault, maybe it's her fault, maybe they're both at fault, but we really don't know and I don't see how jumping to conclusions is appropriate.

      Comment


      • #4
        Ouch, Kimberly! I just came looking for some constructive feedback, not to be insulted. Shafted is absolutely correct in his response, I really *really* wanted things to work out and therefore was extremely patient with her for 6 years.

        Admittedly, I went back and re-read my post, and I can see how it might be interpreted as me trying to be a devious (insert word here, as you say) to try and get out of paying, and I apologize for that. The truth is, I really am a good person. However, I just don’t feel it’s fair that I could end up having to compensate her a sizeable amount after all the support I have provided over the past several years, especially considering that she has contributed nothing to the relationship.

        The family legal system seems extremely biased against men in this regard, and I just don’t think it’s fair, so, I am searching for a technicality or loop hole of some kind that I may be able to use to gain some leverage. Sorry for that.

        Yes, I should have probably done something sooner, but when you love someone and really want things to work out, sometimes, that clouds judgment.

        If you just have something insulting to say, pls kindly keep it to yourself, I am seeking constructive replies from mature people. Thanks.

        Comment


        • #5
          kevin999 - my brother is going through a very similar situation to yours.

          Unfortunately, she does have a claim for spousal support. I think it is 100% wrong, but in the courts eyes, you have supported her for six years, so you are probably on the hook for 3 to 6 years of support.

          According to my brothers lawyer, the court will not care about your expenses after the fact, they go by your gross income minus any previous support you may be paying. If you have alot of expenses, that is your problem.

          If she has no excuse for not working, they may impute an income to her, it depends on the judge. But you will definitely owe her support.

          Women like this are disgusting. No kids, not working, grow up and stop being a leech off the rest of society!!!

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Kelly

            Thanks for your response. My only other question then, is, in a situation like this, what is a ballpark amount that i will have to pay? I realize it can vary based on many factors, but i am just looking for a ballpark so that i can assess my own lifestyle going forward.

            So, in a situation like this (my income = $65k, and her income = almost $0, and capable of working but just lazy), would i be looking at a few hundred bucks a month, or, more like a couple grand a month?

            Is it worth it for me to engage a lawyer to fight for me to try and minimize it? Is there anything a lawyer can do for me, or is "the law the law"? Of course, a lawyer will just tell me what i want to hear to try and shake me down, but, i am seeking an honest opinion...k

            Comment


            • #7
              I wonder if the two of you have spoken about this and what she has said, or you think, she wants or thinks she is entitled to.

              Morrally she does not deserve any support in my opinion - isn't the pat 6 years enough of a gift?!

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks Bill. Of course, I totally agree with you, and, fortunately, she has told me that she would never come after me like this, aside from expecting me to throw her a few thousand bucks to get her started which I would have no problem with. Let’s hope she’s sincere, but we all know how the world works, and 6 months down the road, she could always change her mind and make that call. Call me a bit of a cynic, I guess.

                If it does come to pass, I am just wondering how a situation like this would typically play out in the courts in a best & worst case scenario (i.e. judge in good mood vs judge in bad mood), and some ball park numbers so that I can be prepared…k

                Comment


                • #9
                  What kind of education does she have? How much is she capable of making if she worked full time? If it does come down to having to pay SS you can ask that she has a fair income imputed on her, one that she should be able to make. The SS would then be based on your income and her imputed income, so at least that's better than her having no income.

                  The reality is that you've supported her for 6 years, so you'd probably have to pay SS for a few years if she pushed the idea. If it would save going to court and getting a SS order, you'd probably be best to offer a lump sum amount up front. There are a couple of calculators out there for determining the amount, but this one's probably the best:

                  Spousal Support Advisory Guidelines

                  From this, if you make 65k and she makes 30k, you'd have to pay between $263 and $350 a month for anywhere from 3-6 years, so a low of $9450 to a high of $25200 total. Mind you, these are for married people, so I'm not sure how being common-law affects SS.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    The formula is basic. it is 1.5 to 2 percent in the difference in incomes.

                    65000 - 0 = 65000
                    1.5% x 65000 = 9750
                    2.0% x 65000 = 13000

                    9750/12 = 812.50
                    13000/12 = 1083.33

                    so the low is 812.50 per month and the high is 1083.33 per month. The duration is based on lenth of marriage. Your relationship is relatively short term so it depends on the judge. 6 years would be the max, but i highly doubt she would qualify for that. She may only get 1 or 2 years depending on the judge, to help her get on her feet.

                    You may be best to come to an agreement with her, offer her a lump sum of money and have it signed or drawn up by a lawyer or paralegal. She has to claim on income tax, but if you give her a lump sum, neither of you can claim. So if you offer lump sum, take off the take she would have to pay.
                    I am not a lawyer, so dont quote me, but i have been very involved in my brothers crap with his ex.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      kelly, those numbers are accurate, but if she is capable of working, and the courts would likely impute an income for her, then the numbers would change.

                      Classic, your best chance is to try to offer her something to get her started in lieu of spousal support (if you are able to). Make sure you get an agreement in writing.
                      Last edited by paris; 02-13-2009, 03:51 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by kelly001 View Post
                        The formula is basic. it is 1.5 to 2 percent in the difference in incomes.

                        65000 - 0 = 65000
                        1.5% x 65000 = 9750
                        2.0% x 65000 = 13000

                        9750/12 = 812.50
                        13000/12 = 1083.33
                        Actually, it's 1.5%-2% for each year married, but there's an error in the math above. If she didn't have any income or any income imputed, it would be

                        65000 - 0 = 65000
                        1.5% x 65000 = 975 per year together, or 6 x 975 = 5850
                        2.0% x 65000 = 1300 per year together, or 6 x 1300 = 7800

                        9750/12 = $487.50 per month
                        7800/12 = $650 per month

                        I still think that you'e be able to get an income imputed, and $30k might be reasonable, depending on her education and past work experience, so the numbers I posted before are likely more in line with what you'd have to pay.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Kevin, the formulae that these folks are referring to is in the Spousal Support Advisory Guidelines, which you should search for and look over.

                          Comment

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