Child Support Questions

[kdham1964]

Just have a few questions and thought I'd ask those who hve been through it (saves me 14 hours of searching the net...

she's separated, 12 year old daughter, she has custody...without a legal order...dad doesn't want custody, or pay CS...

Friend wants to know:

what are her rights?
what is she (daughter) entiled to?
how is CS calculated?

any info, directions to reliable websites for info, anything...

she just wants to take care of her daughter, get what she's entitled to, no more...

I know there are lot of fathers here who are trying to do right... i respect that and applaud you for it...she just wants to go into this well informed...any advice would be apprieciated...

[wretchedotis]

Well I have no sympathy for a deadbeat dad. Or mom.

First of all, she needs an agreement or a court order. Then, as I understand it, she could register it with Family Responsablity Office (This is Ontario I'm speaking of).

Pretty much through court order her Child Support would be based on his income, and the guidelines would be applied.

The FRO collects and distributes Child Support payments.

I suggest you google child support guidelines in ontario.

[NBDad]

Child Support tables can be found here:

Federal Child Support Amounts: Simplified Tables

You would use the line 150 number on the payor's notice of assessment for the prior year (This is the most common method) and readjust the amounts each year to account for any increase (or decrease) in the payor's income.

Your friend sounds as if she needs a support order. She should look into Legal Aid or pay a visit to the Family Law Information Center (FLIC) found at the courthouse to get her pointed in the right direction. Barring that, paying for a 1/2 hour or 1 hour consult with a lawyer might be worthwhile for her as well.

Go with a list of questions she needs answered. She can self rep if necessary, it's not overly difficult as it appears it's ONLY a matter of support/access being handled.

IF at any point the child's father increases his time over 40% (essentially 3 overnights/week) then you would use the offset method of child support. (Calculate what BOTH sides would pay, subtract the smaller from the larger, and the person with the larger amount pays the difference). THAT is the most common method, but there was a post on here a while ago about a slightly different method that hopefully will become more prevalent.

[karmaseeker]

but there was a post on here a while ago about a slightly different method that hopefully will become more prevalent.

Oh I missed this - which post? Do you remember?

[winterwolf7]

It was from case law and judge in question made the payor pay HALF the difference in the two table amounts so that each party would make up half the difference.

For example:
Person1 table amount $1000.
Person2 table amount $400.

In conventional method, person1 would pay person2 $600.

In new case law method, person1 would pay person2 $300. This equalizes their table amounts at $700 each, or something. I don't really understand the logic. I'll look around and see if I can find the link.

[LakeErie]

It was from case law and judge in question made the payor pay HALF the difference in the two table amounts so that each party would make up half the difference.

For example:
Person1 table amount $1000.
Person2 table amount $400.

In conventional method, person1 would pay person2 $600.

In new case law method, person1 would pay person2 $300. This equalizes their table amounts at $700 each, or something. I don't really understand the logic. I'll look around and see if I can find the link.

Is this widely used and accepted? Somehow I think logically it actually makes sense.

[iznogood]

There is also the case where a self employed person who isn't declaring his income has to be imputed one. The way to do this is 1) ask first for child support to be based on the delared income, then 2) ask for the court to order a full financial disclosure, then 3) bring a motion to vary child support (which includes deferred revenues/expenses put through the corporation. etc) . You should only do that when the declared income is of obvious bad faith, like my ex who makes about 200-300K per year and suddenly reduced his income to 10K when we split (made a lot of sense since he pays 4K per month in mortgage too). The judges thought this was quite outrageous and he was charged costs on a full recovery basis(meaning he had to cover the ENTIRE bill for my legal fees for the motion) and was imputed an income of 140K (what we had evidence for) which now serves as the amount on which child and spousal support is based, not his ridiculous 10K of declared income.
Good luck to your friend. There is no shame in asking for child support. My mother never asked my father for it and I wish she did. There is a way to do it which is fair and reasonable and court recognizes that too (at least it did work for me).

[kdham1964]

First of all, let me thank you all for your info. It really helps my friend to keep informed.

I took her to the first court date last week, he didn't show up! A court date was set for the beginning of September (uncontested trial). When his daughter asked why he didn't show, his reponse was "I don't have time for this sh#@!". Her response - "I guess I feel loved". Sad to hear from a 13 year old girl!

He has made it clear that he will not be attending court (this info came from a series of threatening phone calls to my friend). All she wants is what THEIR daughter is entitled to, as well as custody (for obvious reasons).

I respect every dad out there fighting for their kids...obviuosly this man is not one of them. He claims he has 2 other kids to worry about (his girlfriend's) and does not want to deal with his real responsibilities. He works under the table, and claims that they can never force child support. Any thoughts on the matter?

The bitch is that she is only doing this because welfare is forcing her (she is now working and will be off welfare soon). Any thoughts on her chances with FRO?

This is his daughter, and he has a responsibility!

Once again, kudos to all those dads doing right by their kids! You have my undying respect! (my ex not included - long story, not going ther)

[billm]

The bitch is that she is only doing this because welfare is forcing her

as well they should - she should be pursuing support from the father, not from the tax payer.

If she pursues it, at the least he will have a tough time of it (dodging the FRO), at the most he will be forced to pay CS.

There is no wiggle room (except by not accurately reporting your income). You pay CS based on your income and the table amounts, and it should be adjusted yearly based on previous year's tax return. Income can be imputed if he is not reporting it.

Should be easy through courts to get an order in place and register with FRO - what happens after that depends on how effective FRO is..which I don't know anything about first hand.

He is an embarrassment to the rest of us. CS is cheap (ie not much to pay to have someone else 100% raise your child).

[kdham1964]

I'm sorry if I implied that she should not be seeking support...I fully agree, and so does she, that her daughter is entitled to it.

The only problem is that she does not have the resources to seek professional help, which is why she turned to me and I turn to this forum for advice. We thank all of you.

I will pass on your advice and experience to her.

[NBDad]

If she is on welfare she should have no issues qualifying for legal aid. She should look into that. A legal aid lawyer will do everything in their power to max out the certificate, and they can only charge so much an hour.