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  • Judge Putting Condition on Motion Filing?

    Looking for some input here... the more this sits with me the more it is bothering me and doesn’t seem “right”

    At our Settlement Conference the judge gave ex a 30 day disclosure order for specific employment info and 12 months of bank statements- he has been saying he’s been unemployed for a year when he really wasn’t. He even admitted to the judge at the SC that he did in fact work at the place I was requesting disclosure from.

    I then asked the judge if we could schedule a motion for CS and arrears for a date after the 30 day deadline (neither of us have brought a single motion yet, and everything is settled on in a final order except for CS and arrears). He said he wasn’t scheduling it, and I would need to see the clerks to schedule one.

    At some point my ex’s lawyer stood up and indicated that her client wants to take our daughter on an out of country vacation (all inclusive week long Caribbean vacation to be exact) and that he needs me to apply for our child’s long form birth certificate in order to apply for the passport. I’m not sure why she felt the need to mention this- I told my ex IN WRITING that I had no problem providing written consent for this, and would have the documents to him by the end of this month. I also had this in my most recent offer to Settle. I stood up and told the judge that this has never been an issue and that I would have it to him in the next couple weeks. Judge nodded and continued on.

    Then I get the endorsement sheet from one of the clerks after we’re all finished. It reads “Applicant May bring a motion for child support after June 15/19 and only once she provides the Resp with the child’s birth certificate “

    - Issue 1: June 15 is more than a whole MONTH after the ex’s 30 day disclosure deadline. Our daughter has gone without CS from my ex from July 2017-December 2018, and a minimal amount (less than min wage guideline) since January 2019

    - Issue 2: I have never and will never use our child’s passport and ability to experience a different country as “leverage” against my ex. The way the endorsement reads, it looks like I am being unreasonable and not providing my ex with our child’s proper documentation. And I don’t want a future judge thinking that. Would it not have made more sense to put something about the birth certificate in our final order, not in the endorsement and as a condition for me to seek CS??

    Issue 3: In my mind (and I am pretty sure within family law as well), child support and ensuring that the child is properly supported and taken care of are one of the top priorities. This judge has now made our daughter’s child support (for which she has received nothing- and I mean nothing- for 1.5 years, and in the last few months a VERY small amount) tied to a condition that my ex receive documentation to take her on a vacation (in OCTOBER) while he is currently owing thousands of dollars.
    Like I said, I planned on providing this documentation as soon as I receive it within the next few weeks anyways, so it’s not actually an issue. Its more the principal of the whole thing that really bothers me. Plus, I basically have to twiddle my thumbs and wait over a month after the disclosure deadline before I can file for child support?!?

    What the heck?!? Is this the norm and I’m just getting upset over nothing? Or is this not right??

  • #2
    First, can you fix your keyboard? Theres a little icon at the bottom right of your screen that is a keyboard, click on it and change it to US English. (Pet peeve of mine).

    The judges endorsement is only an endorsement. Your ex could file to have it made an order but until it is an order, its simply instructions.

    I dont understand why he needs to file for a new passport if you already have one. You planned to give him the passport. For someone who isnt paying support, why would he spend money to get a second passport?

    I think you can file a motion whenever you want. Your motion judge is different than the conference judge. Plus judges go slightly easier on self rep people. There really isnt anything stopping you from filing a motion after he misses the deadline. If he doesnt provide disclosure then you would need to get the endorsement made into an order to find him in contempt.

    Best advice is to wait for the disclosure. Provide him with a notarized consent and the passport (send registered mail) and be done with it. Then if he doesnt comply with the disclosure, file your motion.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by rockscan View Post
      First, can you fix your keyboard? Theres a little icon at the bottom right of your screen that is a keyboard, click on it and change it to US English. (Pet peeve of mine).

      The judges endorsement is only an endorsement. Your ex could file to have it made an order but until it is an order, its simply instructions.

      I dont understand why he needs to file for a new passport if you already have one. You planned to give him the passport. For someone who isnt paying support, why would he spend money to get a second passport?

      I think you can file a motion whenever you want. Your motion judge is different than the conference judge. Plus judges go slightly easier on self rep people. There really isnt anything stopping you from filing a motion after he misses the deadline. If he doesnt provide disclosure then you would need to get the endorsement made into an order to find him in contempt.

      Best advice is to wait for the disclosure. Provide him with a notarized consent and the passport (send registered mail) and be done with it. Then if he doesnt comply with the disclosure, file your motion.
      Im typing from my phone maybe thats why? I see no US English option. I will just try to leave out some punctuation for now lol

      Our child does not currently have a passport. The issue is that he needs her long form birth certificate to apply for the passport, which we do not have either. I need to apply for the long form and give it to him, as I hold the regular birth certificate. I have told him a hundred times I would have it to him by the end of the month. I told him in writing. I included it in my offer to Settle to his lawyer.

      If he supplies full disclosure within 30 days I would still need to file for a motion though no? He is not going to voluntarily up the payments even if it is laid out for him in plain English. Same with arrears.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by rockscan View Post
        ...
        I dont understand why he needs to file for a new passport if you already have one. You planned to give him the passport. For someone who isnt paying support, why would he spend money to get a second passport? ...

        Perhaps I misread her comments, but it sounded like nobody had applied for a passport yet. She just had the documentation, that was required to do so.
        Last edited by dad2bandm; 04-09-2019, 09:47 AM. Reason: Never mind...OP responded same time I did to clarify.

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        • #5
          I agree with Rocksan- except- that I would wait until the deadline set by SC judge. If you don't- you may face some uncomfortable questions on why you chose to ignore it. Your sc judge sounds like a dick.

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          • #6
            Why not just get the passport done and give it to him? Its probably easier that way? Or just get the long form bc. Anything you can do to show you are reasonable goes a long way.

            I will let someone else weigh in on the motion thing. My partners lawyer said his ex could file a motion any time she wanted but it was at the judges discretion. If you are wrong then you may be on the hook for costs. Plus if it turns out his disclosure is late, you have more against him for it all.

            (Keyboard thinggo to settings, general, keyboard and then choose U.S.)

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            • #7
              I originally thought about just getting the passport for him. But then I was like no, f this. I will provide him with what he NEEDS (long form bc) and let him pull up his big boy pants and apply/pay for the passport. 2 years of paying for everything on my own is gettin old real quick.

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              • #8
                Yes I agree. Let him do it for sure. I think mom form BC costs money as well.

                Wait for his disclosure like Rockscan said. And then for sure fill out the papers for the motion.


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by iona6656 View Post
                  I agree with Rocksan- except- that I would wait until the deadline set by SC judge. If you don't- you may face some uncomfortable questions on why you chose to ignore it. Your sc judge sounds like a dick.
                  I agree with you about waiting until June 15. Just super annoying though that I have to sit around for a whole extra month + for zero reason. Most cases seem to put a priority on CS.

                  But in my case? Oh your child never saw support for 1.5 years? And the payor just admitted to us that he actually was employed all last year when he wrote on his response that he wasnt, and told the clerk at the first court date he wasnt, and the CC judge he wasnt? And after multiple requests he has still refused to supply you with that employment information? Oh and you have an offer to Settle here that forgives the past 2 years of arrears if he just starts paying the proper support amount based on his REAL income? Let us tell you what we are gonna do for you:

                  We WILL order him to disclose this info you have asked for.

                  We WONT give you costs for this step. Why would someone be awarded costs when the other party has acted in bad faith for 2 years and lied non stop, and made the first SC date completely useless? You are self represented, costs do not exist for you

                  And you can wait 2 more months before you can attempt to get an order for proper CS. Because we feel that the child having a passport for a vacation half a year away takes priority over her basic needs.

                  Family court for the win.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I hear you!! I want to somehow bring up bad faith with my case... Im not sure judges care. My ex has delayed 4 times now... 1 yr later and only 1 CC under our belt. If the next SC doesnt get adjourned again it will be over a year just to get to that point. And my ex owes me money as well. Good on you for doing this on your own!!


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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                    • #11
                      Technically the judge doesnt see the offer so they dont know what you are doing.

                      If it makes you feel better, weve been held hostage for two years now on a court process that was unnecessary. We have spent thousands on a lawyer, travel and hotel to defend him against false claims on money. I have been accused of shit and his kids have not spoken to him in five years because of their mothers bullshit. It isnt easy when you are dealing with an unreasonable person!

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                        Technically the judge doesnt see the offer so they dont know what you are doing.
                        The Settlement Conference brief form has a section for your offer. It says if you have not already made one to make one within that section. It then says that if you HAVE already made one, to attach it to the brief. So I attached mine to the brief. The ex/lawyer had not made one before, so theirs was detailed within that section, right in the brief.

                        But whether the judge actually read it (probably not) is a whole other ball game.

                        I know that no future judge will see it though, unless we were to go to trial.

                        I just want to be done with all of this. It is surprising how much it consumes your time, especially when you are self repping. But I dont have costs

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                        • #13
                          Workingdad self repped and won costs. If you have some time you may want to go through some of his posts on it. Or even look through his case on canlii. I dont remember his last name but if you do a search on here you will find it.

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                          • #14
                            costs on a sc are a loooong shot. i don't think I've ever heard of them being ordered...even if you are represented.

                            even costs on a motion are usually only partial indemnity. don't focus of recouping- focus on moving your matter along and thinking about how much money you are saving by doing this yourself. It's a LOT.

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                            • #15
                              I just had a wild thought.

                              Exs lawyer went in to speak to the judge privately at least twice during our conference. And then judge randomly hands out this Applicant cant motion for child support until after June 15 endorsement.

                              Ex stopped voluntarily paying child support June 2017.

                              Do you think this is a ploy by the exs lawyer to stretch this on for as long as possible and therefore thwart my attempts of getting arrears from June 17 onwards (Ive read that backdating 2 years seems to be the standard cutoff date for arrears?)

                              Or am I just obsessing/worrying about this a wee bit too much?

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