How do I ensure that opposing counsels are not colluding ?

[plainNamedDad44]

Thank you all for the input. A couple of points

1. My STBX is trying to take everything. Literally. They are attempting it on a stack of lies. So of course I am going to fight like hell. That's how I got my 4 children back full time, the STBX paying support, full control of the kids SDRESP, and a fair deal in the disposition of the marital home.

2. I have either felt "churned and burned" by previous lawyers, or that they don't give a shit, as I am one of many cases they have.

So am I micro managing ? You're f*cking right i am. Do I care if they like me ? NO. Do I pay my legal bills - yes.

I have not fought 6 years, for my children, home and life back to have it messed up because my file was not being paid close enough attention to. I would then have to sue my lawyer. I don't want to have to do that.

[OrleansLawyer]

Frankly, my counsel's assistant seems to have some degree of "your not a lawyer" contempt towards a client showing as much control on their file.

You seem to be taking things very personally. From your description in this thread it sounds like you are trying to micromanage your file because you do not trust your lawyer to do a good job without fleecing you.

Your lawyer is a professional. At best, that behavior is annoying. If they are honest then it is offensive to them as well. They will not bring this up with you because, as a professional, they should recognize that the information is yours to request and their job is to represent your interests in the litigation. Liking you is not a requirement to do that.

It is pretty normal for lawyers to have an off-the-record convo at some point to discuss how $$$ is "in the file."

Off the record conversations can also follow the lines of, "If we go to court the range of results is probably B -> G. My client would settle for up to E, so if your client will too then let's sort this out".

I do not know if this is true in every jurisdiction, however in Eastern Ontario there are more clients than the existing lawyers can handle. If a family lawyer is competent then the problem is deciding how many cases to turn away, not trying to keep existing clients going.

Sometimes we have to just sit back and let the people do their jobs.

Yes you have to have a very high degree of confidence in someone who is representing you in family court.

Don't over-analyze things. At some point you have to just "let 'er rip" and go with it.

Good advice.

[arabian]

It is pretty normal for lawyers to have an off-the-record convo at some point to discuss how $$$ is "in the file." There is little you can do about this. How does one really "control" this sort of thing? Lawyers are business people. If two individuals are long-time litigators then that amounts to additional billable hours for both lawyers.

I believe you already have your lawyer on a 'limited retainer' agreement of sorts as you have been doing much of your own work correct?

You are quite within your rights to bring any billing discrepancies to your lawyer's attention. However, to discuss billing with his assistant I think would be inappropriate as she answers to her boss not you.

I was quite firm in my request for all correspondence (outgoing and incoming) be forwarded to me via email. My lawyer complied magnificently. Only when I met with him did he let me know about those "lawyer-to-lawyer" convos with opposing counsel. I very quickly realized the benefit of the two lawyers being able to converse somewhat freely throughout stages of our litigation. I have to say that now that I am self-represented (as is my ex) I miss the gossipy tidbits that I would learn from my lawyer. I am, however, quite aware that those tidbits mattered nothing in the end.... everything was business as usual in the courtroom.

Perhaps you are uncomfortable with knowledge that your case is being discussed between the lawyers without your knowledge or involvement?

Focus on the end-game. Review your bills. Yes the "hired help" in the law firm is not as conscientious as you have been with documents but remember that your situation matters not at all to your lawyer or his assistant. Final bill is what matters as well as a good outcome and (if he is a peacock) a stellar transcription of the proceedings.

Perhaps you are nervous (understandable)?

Sometimes we have to just sit back and let the people do their jobs.

Yes you have to have a very high degree of confidence in someone who is representing you in family court.

Don't over-analyze things. At some point you have to just "let 'er rip" and go with it.

Best always

[OrleansLawyer]

Regardless, I get the sense that they are working to "milk" both parties.

1 - Are you being charged for communication that is not authorized?

2 - If you believe your lawyer is milking you why have you not fired them?

Opposing counsel is not preparing anything for trial... nothing, no RTA, no evidence book, just financials.

Some lawyers prepare last minute, either due to the nature of the case or not being paid. And some lawyers simply do not prepare.

I have instructed that I am to receive all communications with opposing counsel. Seems I'm not getting all of this communication.

Are you being charged for communication that is not being provided to you?

my counsel's assistant seems to have some degree of "your not a lawyer" contempt towards a client showing as much control on their file.

If you are micromanaging your file to the extent your comments suggest then they are probably wondering why you have hired them at all.

your lawyer is answering client emails on your dime, I call that double billing too.

So does the law society.

If your feeling unsettled, then your mostly likely on to something that just isn't right, go with your gut feeling.

Or talk to your lawyer. If you do not trust your lawyer enough to discuss issues then you should hire a different lawyer (or self rep).

[kate331]

If your feeling unsettled, then your mostly likely on to something that just isn't right, go with your gut feeling. I too would be upset if I was being billed to fix the assistant mistakes, that's double billing imo.

My pet peeve is sitting in court waiting for your file to be called, and your lawyer is answering client emails on your dime, I call that double billing too.

[rockscan]

Did they really need to file a request to admit? Did they need to file anything else? Is there a concern that they will adjourn? Have they missed a deadline?

Have you flat out asked your lawyer if there are conversations happening you are not privy to?

[plainNamedDad44]

Are you receiving a detailed bill monthly? i.e. phone call to opposing counsel? reviewing correspondence with opposing counsel?

I'm on top of billing. And I have instructed that I am to receive all communications with opposing counsel. Seems I'm not getting all of this communication. Its unsettling.

Also my counsel's assistant makes tons of errors that I have to pay extra to point out and have her fix. I have pointed this issue out to my counsel several times.

Frankly, my counsel's assistant seems to have some degree of "your not a lawyer" contempt towards a client showing as much control on their file.

[plainNamedDad44]

why exactly are you thinking your lawyer is trying to milk you? You are on top of everything and basically they cannot do anything without you knowing.

Opposing counsel is not preparing anything for trial... nothing, no RTA, no evidence book, just financials. Me on the other hand paying $$$ to have all things in order and on time.

Also my counsel wants to bring to mediation when the other party's current OTS is out in left field.

[kate331]

Are you receiving a detailed bill monthly? i.e. phone call to opposing counsel? reviewing correspondence with opposing counsel?

[standing on the sidelines]

why exactly are you thinking your lawyer is trying to milk you? You are on top of everything and basically they cannot do anything without you knowing.

[plainNamedDad44]

Hi community,

Since I have been handling my file so long, I am able to keep close tabs of the handling of my matter with my lawyer.

I have instructed my counsel that I am to be notified of any incoming communication, no phone calls with opposing counsel unless I am present and authorize, and I am to review all outgoing communication.

Regardless, I get the sense that they are working to "milk" both parties.

How to I manage/stop this.

PND