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  • Just how illegal is it?

    I have been sitting on this for quite a while and I am wondering what the forum users think about this. Below is a statement that I wrote just after the incident and just recently added to it.

    "(Original Statement written on October 10th, 2005)

    Statement of Duped October 10th, 2005

    On October 5th, 2005 I walked into my son’s new school (school name) to introduce myself and get updated school records. Upon the mention of my name I was nearly accosted by the principal. Stating that any physical contact with my flesh would constitute assault, I was invited into the principal’s office for an explanation of his actions. He stated that he had in his possession documents from the court stating that the mother had custody and that I was not to be allowed at the school. It was apparent by his demeanor that he had been misled into believing that I was an abusive parent. I informed him that I had all court documents in my possession and that none of these documents stated that the mother had custody or that I was not allowed to be at the school. It was at this point that he retrieved my sons file and produced a faxed copy of the decision of Justice (judge's name) with an attached hand written letter stating;


    “ATT: Management:

    For proven the mother of (child's name) has the custody.

    P.S. Not to let (child) leave with the father, without the signature of the mother (mothers name).” (Literal translation, original document written in French)


    The principal loosely translated for me that the hand written note that came directly from the judges office stated that since the mother had custody, I was not allowed to be at the school.

    I asked the principal to specifically read for me the judges decision as stated in the court document pertaining to the mother having custody and he was unable to do this. I pointed out that the only mention of custody was the point where it stated that if the mother did not return within 21 day to live with the child in (city name) that the father would be automatically grated interim custody of the child. In his confusion he stated that (my ex) had asked him just the other day if the fax from the judge had come yet, he was convinced that this order and the hand written note that were faxed to the school together had come directly from the judge himself. It was at this point that I pointed out to him that the fax lacked a letterhead and a signature and was not a legal document.

    It was also at this point that I realized a discussion that I had overheard previously while in court on October 3rd 2005 had relevance. (my ex’s) father walked into the court room, sat down beside her, she asked him if he had sent the fax, he stated all sent and she said good. Fax was received at 1:51 pm on October 3rd, 2005 and at that time we were awaiting the judge in the court room.

    I asked the principal if he would be willing to give me a statement to the effect of what we had discussed and he stated that he would only do so if officially requested by a judge, as he did not want to get involved.

    I immediately took a photocopy of the hand written note over to my lawyer’s office for his information.

    (Added on May 10th, 2007)

    The original photocopy remains in my file at the Law Office of (name of former lawyer).

    I was appalled that (name of former lawyer) did not submit this document to the appropriate person(s) immediately as I believe it to be unethical at best to be passing off documents as though they were written by a judge. If nothing else, it is insulting that this behaviour is tolerated. I had hoped he would have brought this to the attention of Justice (judges name) but he did not.



    Sincerely,




    Duped

    Dated: ____________________"

    What should I do with this piece of manipulative deception?
    Is it illegal to pass off documents as official documents from the court?
    Is there someone specific or a specific office that deals with this sort of thing?
    Should I bring this to someone's attention or should i just sit on it?

    Information or advice please!

    Thanks

    Duped

  • #2
    I see this as very good documentation of a very unfortunate situation. A situation that fortunately your child did not witness.
    If the situation has been rectified and you are not being denied access to your son at school or any records pertaining to him, I would simply hold on to the documentation should you need it as proof of the damaging behaviour of the mother in a court situation. Just make sure the son’s file contains the actual court documents for future reference. Remember you need to stay focused on the best interests of your son; you are lucky he did not witness this, and that it was corrected quickly.

    I would write a letter to the lawyer of your ex and clearly outline what transpired and how you were appalled at the behaviour of your ex and request that it not repeat itself. Stress the severity of the situation had the son witnessed it, IE the emotional and psychological damage. Stress that this type of behaviour is intentionally damaging to the bond you have with your son one which a child centred parent would not engage. Keep it succinct and polite, key word, “polite”. She’ll understand your position and that such behaviour is neither acceptable nor tolerated. Do not threaten legal action as that does not reflect positively on you, the “child centered” parent, it can be implied however without actually stating it.

    What she did was despicable but you shouldn’t stoop to her level.

    Comment


    • #3
      Second thought

      Thanks FL_Needs_To_Change,

      I just think that if I were a judge I would want to know that my statments and statements that I have made were being fraudulently misrepresented or simply created by others on my behalf.

      I guess I am old fassioned and believe in the truth and that wrong is wrong no matter where it is.

      I guess my initial question still stands, is it illegal to pass off documents as official documents from the court?

      Thanks

      Duped
      Last edited by Duped; 05-16-2007, 01:55 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Duped
        Thanks FL_Needs_To_Change,
        I guess my initial question still stands, is it illegal to pass off documents as official documents from the court?
        I think the judge would be appalled to learn someone was misrepresenting him via fraudulent faxes purportedly from him/her!

        No matter how you look at this, it is indeed fraud, and depending on the judge may be punishable by law. I think the answer is, do you want to take the next step and make this a criminal/civil matter? Because it is no longer just a family law issue when someone alleges they are someone of authority when they are not for the sole purpose of being vengeful and hurtful.

        Comment


        • #5
          Live by the rules...

          Thanks,

          No matter how you look at this, it is indeed fraud, and depending on the judge may be punishable by law.
          So fraud is illegal? I was under the impression that anything goes in family court, no penalties what so ever.

          I think the answer is, do you want to take the next step and make this a criminal/civil matter?
          Is this really up to me? Am I not obligated to provide information of fraud to the authorities.
          Because it is no longer just a family law issue when someone alleges they are someone of authority when they are not for the sole purpose of being vengeful and hurtful.
          Should I let my ex know that I have a copy of this document and a statement to accompany it? She does not know yet, never mentioned it.

          To be perfectly honest I am torn between putting this out there for the judge to see and the possible effect it may have on our alternating week joint shared custody, putting it out there should result in a total death of any credability she has, but might cause me to get sole custody when the max I want is joint shared. Don't get me wrong, I want sole custody for me, but she is his mother and has as much right to raise him as I do, it was a team effort before separation and should be a team effort still. We just play for different teams now. When he is old enough to choose one living arrangement over another, I will respect his choice, until then, I believe it best to remain joint shared, even if she is the spone of pure evil (her dad is pure evil).

          Thanks again

          Duped

          Comment


          • #6
            Here's something....

            Don't tell her about the document and that you have this information, then find out who the judge is they tried to impersonate and send him a letter explaining what happened with a copy of the so called fax leaving your contact information for him/her to get in touch with you over the matter. There are many things we can do as human beings without lawyers involved but if you feel better also send copies of the same letter to your lawyer and hers showing them you have forwarded all info to the judge involved. Somehow I doubt that judge will just let this slide!

            Comment


            • #7
              It's a beautiful day in the neighbourhood...

              <grin>

              Thanks Taestoy,

              I so want to do that, but at the same time I am worried, worried for my son, worried for his future, etc... What to do, what to do. Think, think, think... I'm so confused right now I am not sure what I am going to do.

              Any other suggestions welcome, I will find the address of the judge and get it ready, just in case.

              Thanks again

              Duped

              Comment


              • #8
                Do It!

                In a way i think your helping your son by shedding some light to this judge on his disgusting mother and her actions, with those actions comes consequences and that is life, trust me the older that boy gets the more light he will see i saw it first hand. If the mother is a nighmare once there older it doesn't take them long to see her for her true self and it often back fires on them in the end because the child grows up and doesn't want much to do with them because of this I have seen it and if already at 8 he avoids some of her calls he has already started this process. Screw em! If this was me I would most definitley send a letter to that judge with a copy of this fax or the original if u can get it back, i mean how else would he/she know about this and don't they have a right to know this went on behind there back! By law she can't keep your son from you what else have you got to lose! Show this judge what an idiot she really is!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Also.....

                  This may be your ticket to showing her true colours but the judge may wonder why it took you 2 years to come forward with this that's the only thing.

                  Best of Luck!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Draft..

                    I have drafted this letter to be addressed to the judge

                    Dear Justice (Judges name);

                    I wish to bring to your attention the existence of a document of a fraudulent nature that was faxed to my son’s school.

                    It was originally my intention to wait until after my file had been completed in the Ontario Court of Justice before releasing this information to you as I believe that the nature of this document would cause influential bias in my case which you preside over and that would be unethical. I have neither the desire nor the conscience for this.

                    Unfortunately, with consideration of the current state of the family law system my file will not be complete for quite some time and I believe it is my duty to bring forth the existence of the enclosed document without delay.

                    I have placed the document in question and my statement pertaining to the document in a separate sealed envelope along with my contact information. I have done this so that you may at your discretion pass this envelope off to the appropriate person or department without having viewed the contents yourself and thereby not having been influenced by it.

                    As I am unsure of the exact legalities of this document, I am confident that whomever you direct the enclosed package too will be very capable of making that determination.

                    If you decide to view the contents of the envelope rather than passing it on to someone else, please consider that it was not my intention for you to view these contents until after my case had been finalized, hence the separate envelope and lack of contact information in the outer envelope.

                    Best Regards,

                    Unsigned
                    basically explains it!

                    So what ya think? What would the judge do? What would you do? Could this come back and kick me?

                    Thanks again

                    Duped

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Sorry you misunderstood me.
                      I said I felt this was not a family matter but a criminal matter and that it should be up to the judge to decide if he/she wants to take action. And that it would be up to you to determine if you want him/her to know.

                      I'd provide a letter to the the ex's lawyer about the situation and your distaste to it happening and that you do not feel it should have happened nor happen again. I would not provide the proof, only let the other side know that you know etc.

                      Sorry for the confusion.

                      FL

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Duped,

                        neither party to an action is to have any sort of contact with a prevailing Judge outside the court room.

                        When events such as this has occurred it is best to use it to your advantage.

                        Have you considered forwarding the matter to the local police. I believe they would and have the duty to investigate the matter of apparent fraud and determine the individual responsible representing themselves to be an officer of the court with fraudulent court orders.

                        If it was me, I would also make a formal complaint with the Superintendent of Education at board of education on the matter. What if the contents of the letter were different IE: instructions to the principle to release the child into the care of a stranger.

                        I think you would get more resolve and publicity of the matter if you involved the third parties I mentioned. No doubt opening a can of worms such as this more likely will put the principle of the school in the spotlight and no doubt they would be distrustful of the mother in the future.

                        You would also be able to refer to the police investigations and how the board of education handled the matter. Either way, the only individual to gain from such a letter would be the other parent. On the balance of probabilities their conduct is questionable.


                        lv
                        Last edited by logicalvelocity; 05-16-2007, 09:40 PM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Clearity

                          Thanks LV,

                          One thing, I am confused as to what exactly you meant by
                          Either way, the only individual to gain from such a letter would be the other parent.
                          please explain further or clarify.

                          Thanks

                          Duped

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Awesome!

                            That letter is perfect, well done!!!! I cannot see how this can come back to bite you at all you did the right thing in my opinon. If you had taken this to the police they would of laughed and shoved it aside, trust me they wouldn't do much with this information so it's best that you do the dealing yourself and followed thru yourself. Don't let her know you have this information by now she probably figures she got away with it and all is good so let's hope consequences are coming her way. Were you sending copies to your lawyer and hers? Maybe just leave that and send it to the judge only that way they don't have the opportunity to counter anything they will have no time to prepare. If I was a judge I would have her charged with inpersonation or identity fraud so it will be interesting to see what comes of this and identity fraud is taken very seriously now and if her father was involved he could be liable as well.

                            Again very well written and well done good for you for taking control!!!!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Just going to bite the bullet..

                              Hello all,

                              I am glowing today, like I am walking on air. My ex is determined to take my child away from me, she has several illigitimate reasons for this and I have confirmation of at least 2 so far that are false, with supporting statements.

                              I spoke with the principal of my sons school today and basically gave him the heads up that I will be involving the police in the matter of the fraudulent documents. He agrees with me that it was fraud and needs to be handled by the police. He has gotten in touch with the school board over the matter.

                              I will also be in touch with the school board over the matter.

                              I have spoken to the school teacher and discussed several of the accusation that were made that if trueshe would be completely aware of, however she stated on record (digital recorder) that these are outright lies.

                              Once the police are involved, I will have the fraudulent info submitted to the court in an official document via my lawyer. And I will be filing for sole custody.

                              Any suggestions welcome!

                              Duped

                              Comment

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