At what age can a child decide to go with one parent?

[zumoff]

MY ex and I have split custody. My children , one 10, one 12.5 want to come live with me. I asked them if they can wait until the older one is 14 but they want it now.

Is it worth going to court yet or are they too young? They are mature especially the older child. I don't want a trial unless the courts consider what the children say that age.

[Headwaters1]

I'd wait if the situation is at all bearable for them.

Before they can provide their own opinion which I believe is 12 then you will have a long drawn out process that won't be decided for three to four years anyways if it goes to court.

So I'd wait until youngest is 12. Doesn't mean you don't go to court anyways but it might not require OCL to be involved etc...the OP might recognize the children's decision will carry more weight in court.

[Serene]

I'm curious why the children's wants are the driver here. The parent they might want to live with my be the easier parent or the one with the bigger tv...why is it that the parent is not promoting the relationship with the other parent?

[standing on the sidelines]

I'm curious why the children's wants are the driver here. The parent they might want to live with my be the easier parent or the one with the bigger tv...why is it that the parent is not promoting the relationship with the other parent?

or maybe the parent has a new partner that the kids cannot stand to be around so that is why they want to go to the other parent to live?

[Tayken]

MY ex and I have split custody. My children , one 10, one 12.5 want to come live with me. I asked them if they can wait until the older one is 14 but they want it now.

Is it worth going to court yet or are they too young? They are mature especially the older child. I don't want a trial unless the courts consider what the children say that age.

Views will be heard at 14 but, you will need an independent assessment from OCL and/or Section 30 evaluator to establish. The age that no assessment is required is generally 16. A judge can't tell a child who is 16, has a drivers license, employed, can make their own medical decisions and can simply leave where to live.

There is case law where a judge has found a parent in contempt for not facilitating access for a 14 year old. That parent ran up 30,000 in costs for the trial and then an addition 20,000 for the contempt.

I don't recommend you influence your children to live at either of their homes. You should be working with them to resolve the issues with the other parent.

Good Luck!
Tayken

[Serene]

I'm with Tayken. There are many ways to achieve a positive end. The answer shouldn't be "go live with one parent". At the very least, it should only be explored after all else has been exhausted. We owe it to our children.

[HammerDad]

This is something that should be discussed with the ex. The child is 12.5, hardly an age where they should be making such drastic decisions.

Talk to the ex about the situation. See if you can work out a better arrangement for parenting time, maybe something that increases your time with the child. Approach everything from the child's best interests. Counseling may also be in order to the family to assist with the child.

[Serene]

Word of caution:

Be careful what type of counseling you choose. Family counseling will look to restore family values (keeping child intact with both parents even if separately). While individual counseling will be "how to achieve child's wishes".

In ideal world/situation parents would never ostracize one another's role, time, access with their child. Many parents have less than ideal situations at hand. This OP did not seek to work through the issues with her ex....she looked at dealing with the symptom which is all too often the case with divorced parents.

We are enabling kids if we take this stance. It's wrong in my opinion. The post the other day with judge's comments states that parents should be promoting to restore relationships with other parent's in these situations. You can't dismiss this. Its abuse in my opinion to do otherwise. Who in their right mind let's a kid walk away from a good parent? Who allows a minor this authority and decision making? They are children, they do not have the capacity to make decisions of this magnitude. And it's parent responsibility to promote both parents in their children's lives. Your hatred for your ex (and I'm not suggesting this poster hates the ex at all, rather a statement in general) should not over power your love for your kids. You should want your kids to have a relationship with their other parent.

[OntarioDaddyMan]

Very good sound advice by these posters. Good read.




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[Straittohell]

My kids are only 5 and 8 and have already, in the last two years, said, on a number of occasions, completely unprompted, and totally at random, things like:

"I don't want to go to mommy's house"
"I want to stay here"
"I like it at your house better"

My response?

"Your mommy loves you, and starting tonight, it is her week to show you how much she loves you, and spend time with you. I love you very much and love it when you are here, but your mommy needs your love just as much as I do. "

Then, they go, the world hums along, and I get to sleep with a clean conscience knowing that I succeeded in my job as a parent, by making sure that my kids respected the roles of both parents in this situation. That stuff comes up every once in a while, and I gently redirect them away. Sometimes, I ask them why they would say such things, and I listen to their answers, tell them that they need to talk with their mom about the things that bother them, and then inform my ex via email what was said, and remind her that I supported her role and didn't indulge any of what they said.

If my kids ever listed anything of grave concern, that would be a different matter, but so much of it is minor preferential stuff. They have more fun at my house, they like the food better, there are more clean clothes, they get to see more of me because my ex works some nights, (which means that on those nights that they are at her house, the boyfriend watches them, which was tough at first, but I got over it).

So much of what drives their preferences and desires at this age can be found in Maslow's Hiearchy of needs. Whichever place best addresses those base needs of shelter, food, routine, etc. is inevitably going to appeal to them more.

I know that my household has more of that, as my ex is a flake with money and is incredibly disorganized. That being said, she loves our kids just as much as me, and does the best that she can. Some day, my kids might get to their teen years and express a very strong preference for either of our residences, and we will both have to deal with that reality, but until that day, they are simply adorable little humans that are driven by very basic needs, desires, and wants, and attempting to cater to their weekly shifts in those factors does nobody any favours.

Unless there was a real concern about my children's well being, I would never encourage any of their efforts to pick one house more over another. That undermines me just as much as it does my ex, because it teaches the kids that parents are disposable and switchable.

[stripes]

MY ex and I have split custody. My children , one 10, one 12.5 want to come live with me. I asked them if they can wait until the older one is 14 but they want it now.

^^ That's the problem. Kids don't get to decide whether to live with mom or dad, any more than they get to decide whether they go to school or not. The OP shouldn't be asking his kids about where they want to live, he or she should be telling them that this is something that adults decide on behalf of children. If you let the kids think they can drive the bus, nothing good is going to come of it.

If there are serious concerns with the other parent's home (health and safety issues), then the OP can start thinking about changing the parenting regime, but if both parents are competent, simply the fact that the kids happen to like daddy more than mommy shouldn't guide decisions about the kids' residence.

As other posters have commented, often this is about superficial stuff - one parent has more toys, or a higher income, or a bigger house, or whatever.

D9 went through a phase when her father remarried when she said she wanted to live only with me because she didn't like the new wife and stepsister. I told her she was going through an adjustment period and she needed to be patient as new stepfamily was coming together. Now things seem to be fine - I think she's made a good adjustment and the stepfamily is functioning.

I'm also aware that there may come a time in the future when D9 is a teenager when she may decide that I have too many rules or not enough toys and her dad's house is more fun or she's just irritated by me as kids get with their parents, and I hope my ex will do what I did in return.

[Serene]

Can anyone dispel these misconceptions of "child's choice for access" versus "input for access" with case law?

[zumoff]

I'm curious why the children's wants are the driver here. The parent they might want to live with my be the easier parent or the one with the bigger tv...why is it that the parent is not promoting the relationship with the other parent?

Simple answer: It's not my job to "promote" a relationship with the other partner. If they don't want to put in the work to spend time with their children I can't do anything about it. I don't say anything negative ever. But I won't lie to them either.


Long Answer: Ex has a new "man" that moved in ....and also brought his parents, another child and a Niece. Kids don't like the arrangement. Also doesn't help that she left the kids with me all summer and went away. She didn't see them for 10 weeks and they talked about 3x. She checked out of their lives and they know it but yet wants them to live with her when she sees fit.

[Serene]

I'm disgusted with "it's not your job to promote". Although I note you have now made a distinction of "partner" whereas your original post refers to issues surrounding "other parent/dad".

It's a distinction without a difference though. You are essentially assisting your children with minimizing their role/bond/involvement with their other parent. And I think it's shameful.

[FB_]

^^ That's the problem. Kids don't get to decide whether to live with mom or dad, any more than they get to decide whether they go to school or not. The OP shouldn't be asking his kids about where they want to live, he or she should be telling them that this is something that adults decide on behalf of children. If you let the kids think they can drive the bus, nothing good is going to come of it.

If there are serious concerns with the other parent's home (health and safety issues), then the OP can start thinking about changing the parenting regime, but if both parents are competent, simply the fact that the kids happen to like daddy more than mommy shouldn't guide decisions about the kids' residence.

As other posters have commented, often this is about superficial stuff - one parent has more toys, or a higher income, or a bigger house, or whatever.

D9 went through a phase when her father remarried when she said she wanted to live only with me because she didn't like the new wife and stepsister. I told her she was going through an adjustment period and she needed to be patient as new stepfamily was coming together. Now things seem to be fine - I think she's made a good adjustment and the stepfamily is functioning.

I'm also aware that there may come a time in the future when D9 is a teenager when she may decide that I have too many rules or not enough toys and her dad's house is more fun or she's just irritated by me as kids get with their parents, and I hope my ex will do what I did in return.

^^^^

Excellent post... Couldn't have said it any better.

YOU are the parent not the kids...

Many see this type of thing as an opportunity for CS though and encourage a move to get more money.