Jargon - Spousal offering

[Where is the Light]

The uneduated mom is wondering if someone can tell me what the following means in the most simple of terms:

1). Spousal support shall be based on an income to the Applicant of 80,000.00 and an imputed income to the respondent in the amount of 25,000.00 as of Jan. 1/2013. The impute income to the respondent should rise automatically with each passing year by 5000.00, to 40,000.00 per year and the Applicants spousal support obligations shall be adjusted so that the Applicant shall continue to pay spousal support of 920.00 per month until Dec. 1/2014. Thereafter, he shall pay spousal support in the amount of 500.00 per month until the termination date he is proposing of June 1/2019.

2). In his offer to settle the applicant states, ''each party shall bear his/her own costs of this application to January 31/2013. Thereafter, the applicant shall be entitled to his costs on a partial indemnity basis.

3) This offer shall remain open until one minute ater the commencement of the trial, unless earlier withdrawn.

Anyone got any really simple explanations to the above?

Thank you and Godbless.

[mom2three]

The uneduated mom is wondering if someone can tell me what the following means in the most simple of terms:

1). Spousal support shall be based on an income to the Applicant of 80,000.00 and an imputed income to the respondent in the amount of 25,000.00 as of Jan. 1/2013. The impute income to the respondent should rise automatically with each passing year by 5000.00, to 40,000.00 per year and the Applicants spousal support obligations shall be adjusted so that the Applicant shall continue to pay spousal support of 920.00 per month until Dec. 1/2014. Thereafter, he shall pay spousal support in the amount of 500.00 per month until the termination date he is proposing of June 1/2019.

2). In his offer to settle the applicant states, ''each party shall bear his/her own costs of this application to January 31/2013. Thereafter, the applicant shall be entitled to his costs on a partial indemnity basis.

3) This offer shall remain open until one minute ater the commencement of the trial, unless earlier withdrawn.

Anyone got any really simple explanations to the above?

Thank you and Godbless.

First order of business: Be your own best friend and DON'T discount your abilities based on the fact you don't have an education. Some of the smartest people I have ever known never made it past grade 8! And the most brilliantly educated people couldn't understand an offer to settle either. Now that THAT is out of the way..................

Paragraph one is confusing to me too. The first part of it imputes an income with that imputed income increasing yearly. It seems the rate of support only changes once, but support will be paid for 6.5 years. I would address this clause to the applicants lawyer.

Dealing with Costs (para. 2 & 3):


What paragraph 2 is stating is this: IF you accept PRIOR to January 31st, then each of you bear your costs of your legal fees incurred up to that date.

AFTER that date (which has happened), if you accept the offer, you are responsible for the applicants costs on a partial indemnity basis until the offer is accepted. Essentially, this is saying that if you do accept the offer prior to trial, you will be responsible for some of his costs (from the date of January 31 until you accept)because you dragged your feet in accepting the offer.

Paragraph 3 is simply the establishment of the necessary criteria an offer must have in order for it to be considered as a valid offer should it be brought up after trial. For an offer to be a valid offer it must be presented 7 days prior to the hearing, it MUST not expire before a hearing begins (hence the one minute after) and it cannot be accepted. Therefore, paragraph 3 is just a clause to establish a valid offer that can be considered when determining costs at a later date.

So, what are the cost implications? The legal system has an interest in having parties settle outside of court (their own time and costs). To encourage settlement it will award costs to a party that had a valid offer to settle that is as good as or better than what is ordered. Sooooooo, if you do not accept the offer and you are only awarded $100.00 per month for 3 years (example), HIS OFFER was mush better than the order so you will be dinged with costs by the courts.

Is that helpful?

[Mess]

1). Spousal support shall be based on an income to the Applicant of 80,000.00 and an imputed income to the respondent in the amount of 25,000.00 as of Jan. 1/2013. The impute income to the respondent should rise automatically with each passing year by 5000.00, to 40,000.00 per year and the Applicants spousal support obligations shall be adjusted so that the Applicant shall continue to pay spousal support of 920.00 per month until Dec. 1/2014. Thereafter, he shall pay spousal support in the amount of 500.00 per month until the termination date he is proposing of June 1/2019.

This is worded strangely.

First it is saying that each of you will have an "imputed" income. That means that no matter what you earn, any calculations will be made as though you earned that amount.

It means this year you "earn" $25,000, next year $30,000, 2015 $35,000, and 2016 $40,000. This is no matter what you actually earn.

But then it says that he will pay spousal of $920 per month until the end of 2014, and then $500 per month until the end of June, 2019. So the imputation doesn't seem to have any point.

The amounts don't seem to have anything to do with either actual income.

2). In his offer to settle the applicant states, ''each party shall bear his/her own costs of this application to January 31/2013. Thereafter, the applicant shall be entitled to his costs on a partial indemnity basis.

That means that neither of you has to pay the other's legal costs. If you reopen the agreement in the future, you will pay his legal costs.

3) This offer shall remain open until one minute ater the commencement of the trial, unless earlier withdrawn.

This means you may accept the offer before the trial. As soon as the trial starts, he has withdrawn the offer. The reason for this is that he expects that the result in court will be a better deal for HIM. That means you should have take him up on his offer, and trial was unnecessary, so you will be paying for his lawyer.

[arabian]

what is the percentage of split between the two incomes?

Income difference now would be 55,000. 50% of that is 27,500.00. Monthly Spousal would be 2292.00 for 2013.

2014 income difference would be 50,000. 50% of that is 25,000.00 Monthly Spousal would be 2083.00.

etc.

Don't know where the 920.00 or 500.00/month comes in.

We had to go back to court to get wording changed for SS due to interpretation.

[Where is the Light]

REally, I am not that bright when it comes to numbers. This is not my strong point. I just noticed on his income tax submission however, that he noted paying me much more in spousal support than he REALLY DID. I guess this is not something I would bring up in court. Maybe if I want to call Revenue Canada. There is lot's of lying I noticed, but is it worth noting in court since our issue is spousal support.....i.e he says he is saving 400.00 a month rrsp's on his f. statement. I notice again on his submitted return, he bought 15K in RRSP's. Do I mention this? Probably not. When were were separated ''legally" he would do his returns saying, "married" vs. separated. I also noticed that he put ''separated' now, finally on this years submission, not living common law, which he is. Again, worthwhile bringing up in court?

He lied in court saying he only uses the company vechile his boss pays for, for business only. WELL, I can call him out on this one, since my friends live across the street from him and see him driving the company paid for vechile/insurance/gas, all the time. Soooooo many lies and yet, I dont know which are worth noting in court (re: spousal support). He would note us as married when we were legally separated. He would tell me he would get a huge return and lovely him.........KEEP IT FOR HIMSELF.

Sorry, I really despise this man!

So, I did not accept what I think is his ridiculous offer by January 31st. I was accepted into College Feb 1st. I was waiting to hear from the college if accepted or not. I haven't been able to get a job

That being said, I will reply goign back to school, blah blah blah and obviously will ask for more spousal, etc. He is paying me under the suggested amount (lowest now).

Am I going to be expected to pay costs for his lawyer because I did not respond to date (before Jan 31st)? Our court TMC is in two weeks. I will reply before seven days prior.

Omg........I am so stressed out. I don't know what I am doing.

[mom2three]

You need to get yourself some legal advice. Separation agreements can be complicated .

You asked about specific clauses but your second part mentions many more aspects to the agreement. You need to get a handle on your finances, his finances, what you are/are not entitled to and what you are willing/not willing to compromise on.

Many people chose to settle and come to agreements despite being lop-sided and many stay the course and go to trial to 'get' what they think they are entitled to; that is something that only you can decide.

With legal advice you can get the answers you are looking for.

[Rioe]

Am I going to be expected to pay costs for his lawyer because I did not respond to date (before Jan 31st)? Our court TMC is in two weeks. I will reply before seven days prior.

You may be expected to pay his costs, IF you go to court and the judge rules that you should receive something worse than his offer was. The idea is that you should have had the sense to accept his offer and avoid court. If the judge rules more in your favour, then you have nothing to worry about except paying your own costs.

You could always prepare an offer of your own. What's the minimum you think you could live on while you attend school? Do you have any loans, grants or bursaries, etc, that would reduce what you need from him? Maybe you can make an offer back that has him paying you more than his offer, but for less time? You could put the length of your program plus six months for job hunting.

[arabian]

Entitlement. Ability to Pay. Length of Support

Those are pretty much the 3 main things to consider.

Prepare a budget and look at what you need to survive.
In the future I'd go through FRO/MEP to receive any support.

How he files his taxes should be of little relevance to you. If he is dishonest that's his problem when he gets audited some day.

I'd quit listening to what others have to say about him, what vehicle he drives, etc. Not relevant.

Definitely get some legal advice. Your future financial well-being is on the line.

[yhm]

He is trying to intimidate you. Get legal advice. It will cost you a couple of thousand dollars for a retainer, but that is small compared to the concessions he is demanding.

[OrleansLawyer]

It means this year you "earn" $25,000, next year $30,000, 2015 $35,000, and 2016 $40,000. This is no matter what you actually earn.

But then it says that he will pay spousal of $920 per month until the end of 2014, and then $500 per month until the end of June, 2019. So the imputation doesn't seem to have any point.

The amounts don't seem to have anything to do with either actual income.

The offer means the OP is accepting a deemed income during those times. The spousal support values either take this into consideration (SSAG depending on number of children), or the ex wants an established income to defend against a future motion to vary when SS drops to $500/mo and OP still has no real income.

2). In his offer to settle the applicant states, ''each party shall bear his/her own costs of this application to January 31/2013. Thereafter, the applicant shall be entitled to his costs on a partial indemnity basis.

To January 31, 2013, everyone pays their own legal fees. All of his legal fees from February 1, 2013 onwards, you will be contributing towards on the partial indemnity scale.

3) This offer shall remain open until one minute ater the commencement of the trial, unless earlier withdrawn.

You can accept anytime until trial starts, although you will pay his costs on a partial indemnity basis from February 1 to acceptance.

[Where is the Light]

What? Because I did not accept his offer, he is asking me to pay part of his lawyers fees? Could I not have put this out there myself? Reverse it?

This just doesn't seem right? I mean, that means anyone can take another to court and say, I am going to make you pay part of of my lawyers costs?

Is this what you are saying? I am trying to sell my engagement right to pay my own lawyer, let alone his. NO, I haven't let my lawyer go. Soon my two young children and I will be out on the street, if things keep going his way. Why should I just accept what he offers by being told if you don't accept by Jan. 31st, I will be asking for costs paid to my lawyer (his) also.

Seriously................

[Where is the Light]

Sorry, me again. I am still in shock of having to pay his cost, just because he wants e to and because I did not accept his offer. I don't have a job for crying out loud. I have a special needs child that I can't leave home alone. This has been the problem with me getting a job. No one has offered me a daytime job. Jobs available are night/weekends.

What am I to do? My life is turning into a nightmare.

I got accepted into school (letter dated Feb. 1/2013) and I was waiting for that acceptance or not, to reply. So, for this, I am punished? What do people do in my situation?

[Rioe]

You don't automatically get slapped with his costs. Only if what the judge decides is worse for you than accepting his offer would have been.

You could make a counteroffer to settle, and get him to pay your costs if the judge's decision turns out worse for him.

[mom2three]

What? Because I did not accept his offer, he is asking me to pay part of his lawyers fees? Could I not have put this out there myself? Reverse it?

This just doesn't seem right? I mean, that means anyone can take another to court and say, I am going to make you pay part of of my lawyers costs?

Is this what you are saying? I am trying to sell my engagement right to pay my own lawyer, let alone his. NO, I haven't let my lawyer go. Soon my two young children and I will be out on the street, if things keep going his way. Why should I just accept what he offers by being told if you don't accept by Jan. 31st, I will be asking for costs paid to my lawyer (his) also.

Seriously................

No, it doesn't mean that if you do not accept his offer, that you will have to pay his costs. You will be required to pay some or all of his costs IF the order made by the judge is as good as or better than the offer he made.

Judges do not see offers UNTIL an order is made. It is then that he will determine costs.

You can make an offer as well. Offers should be what you can 'stomach' versus what you 'want'.