Help - I found my new lawyer - need to release the current one.

[ddol1]

This may sound like an odd request; My question is if anybody had any words of wisdom in regards to releasing a lawyer and more so do do it without losing the ability to have my file reviewed or assessed at a later date. This something that was strongly suggested but I did not think of this to ask this at the time. I know the past can't be undone but, if having some of the fees/costs that I incurred as a result down the road will only help me down the road as I know, "Whatever I do manage to get returned, if anything at all, would be rolled over to what will be my new lawyer.

I have really worked hard at just understanding how we ended up where we are at today; I was fortunate, and perhaps the luck of the Irish was with me as I was given the chance to have my file reviewed "by the right people" who as far as I can tell, had no problem evaluating my file after reading the documents submitted and the judge's notes. I now understand enough now as to what was happening and I was very much right to have raised the red flags.

On the "I can't believe it is true - after all of this....." My new lawyer is a younger one, has been a member of an organization that for several years now has offered help to low income individuals that need some help and fair to say, "I really needed some help as I was not getting much up to now. At least I know for sure this lawyer has helped more than a few in my position even if each was different with different details to resolve.

My issue today really is about falling inbetween the first and second lawyer, I must release the first one before signing on my new lawyer in the next couple of days. He did explain that he would be able to help me with any unresolved issues once he has a chance to understand my file but he was limited at this point in how much he should say while being retained by another lawyer.

[Tayken]

On the "I can't believe it is true - after all of this....." My new lawyer is a younger one, has been a member of an organization that for several years now has offered help to low income individuals that need some help and fair to say, "I really needed some help as I was not getting much up to now. At least I know for sure this lawyer has helped more than a few in my position even if each was different with different details to resolve.

This is an elevator pitch commonly given by new lawyers looking for files to work on. A great way to get new business but, I would question the motives of the lawyer in question.

Also, the lawyer, hopefully has reviewed your entire file, orders and other materials exchanged already on this file. Be very careful of the new lawyers who blow smoke to get clients and build their practice. This lawyer may be saying this to win any file, to have work, and to build experience more than to help you as a client.

I would be very suspicious of any lawyer who made blanket statements, especially ones with little experience before the SCJ and litigation experience, that they can get you better than what the other lawyer has done.

Good Luck!
Tayken

[arabian]

Congratulations. Hope this works out for you. To have confidence in one's lawyer sure makes those bills easier to swallow.

[hadenough]

It can be exciting (I experienced this recently) to retain fresh/new eyes and knowledge to deal with our cases. It gives us hope.

I understand the cautionary tale that Tayken has advised you to be mindful of, and it would be wise to balance your elation with this cautionary in mind.

Ddol: I have emailed you a form for Notice of Change in Representation. Good luck to you.. You're not going to get everything you want, but if you can get this resolved sooner, and with some of your goals achieved, that would be great to hear

[mcdreamy]

You seem to think it is personal.
It is not.
Send written notice of your notice of change to the old firm, advising of your new lawyer, pay your o/s bill, and request your entire file(s), box(es) be moved.
And it will happen. Expect to pay for p/c charges.

[mom2three]

To get your file released from your previous lawyer to your new lawyer you will have to make full payment of the bill. Your previous lawyer is under no obligation to release your file until full payment.

If you haven't paid the lawyers bill in full you can request an assessment under s. 3 of the Solicitors Act. However, if it has been paid in full you must make the request under s. 11 of the Solicitors Act but you must show special circumstances why an assessment ought to be completed; this must be by an oder of the court.

It certainly is a catch 22:
1) If you give notice to your previous lawyer and he sends you a final bill, you can make the request under s. 3 and the Registrar will assess the bill (this must be done within one month from the date the final bill was rendered).
2) However, if you pay that bill so that it can be released to your present lawyer, it must go before a judge (costly and can well negate any credit that might be awarded on your behalf) and an assessment will only be granted in 'special circumstances'.

So before you go running to the new lawyer, have your ducks in a row is all, and know what you can do on your own (asking for assessment) versus a court date by the new lawyer asking for the bill to be assessed (court date).

Check this case out respecting what constitutes 'special circumstances':

CanLII - 2009 CanLII 40559 (ON SC)

[hadenough]

I guess I've been lucky. Who woulda thunk it? While there does seem to be a procedure involved, I've never had to do any of the above, and I've had a few lawyers.

One that I had was just glad to get rid of the file b/c it's so document heavy and he was solo (no legal clerk) - we still chat from time to time, and he notarized some of my documents for FRO (well after I was no longer his client).

I will soon need a small flat-bed truck to pick up documents from my latest round in court. That lawyer (from a large firm) asked that I give him a day's notice and he'd have it ready for me. I do owe them some money. He not only reduced my bill (by over half) but advised that I could pay the amount owing over a proposed amount of time. So, perhaps this is not the 'norm' - but it does happen and nobody wants all my docs in their space. It's quite voluminous. I personally think they are happy to see it "go"

[ddol1]

This is an elevator pitch commonly given by new lawyers looking for files to work on. A great way to get new business but, I would question the motives of the lawyer in question.

Also, the lawyer, hopefully has reviewed your entire file, orders and other materials exchanged already on this file. Be very careful of the new lawyers who blow smoke to get clients and build their practice. This lawyer may be saying this to win any file, to have work, and to build experience more than to help you as a client.

I would be very suspicious of any lawyer who made blanket statements, especially ones with little experience before the SCJ and litigation experience, that they can get you better than what the other lawyer has done.

Good Luck!
Tayken

This I would agree whole heartedly, which is why I spent time asking very specific questions for at least what I think are my main concerns and he answered them not in generalities but using facts, a few times he pointed out the specific sections and in the end the only thing he admitted to was not having to deal with so much in the way of my medical file and the WCB damages.

And yes, he actually read through quite a bit of the court files while I was there, I also picked up the copy, sorry don't know what it is called but the big file left at the court house - they printed out all the judges notes for me which I wasn't sure if they were allowed but they did. So I also know he was very clear on what he thought today and he to brought up the boundry that existed as I was still represented by a lawyer. I believe the time I got to spend with a Toronto lawyer last weekend who had absolutely nothing to gain or lose aside from offering reasonable advice based on the "court documents alone" as he put it - he was the first to make what I think was full and frank disclsure of what he read and what it meant to him.

I shall admit I am slow at times but he even explained the winks I got from two of the duty council lawyers (the first one asked me to return to the duty council the next day she was on - she was the first to actually speak to what she read after spending almost an hour reading the big file at the court house and as she said, I have probably broken more than a half dozen rules with me that day and with nothing to lose or gain and a simple response of all she did say was, "It is very good that I was seeking another lawyer, or at least their opinion and I urge you to stick with it. Time will tell if what many have said to me, and each was very similar which even tonight I am a bit surprized on how similar the comments were. As a hard of a time I had in doing this, I have no doubt in my mind today - something I could not have said a month ago, even a few weeks ago.

Too much came my way and I did my best to have the file reviewed by the "non interested" parties who as respected lawyers themselves I would hope the consistancy in their reactions and words means something in its own right - I have been told by several people here (lawyers) the last few weeks that sometimes the change is required.

[ddol1]

You seem to think it is personal.
It is not.
Send written notice of your notice of change to the old firm, advising of your new lawyer, pay your o/s bill, and request your entire file(s), box(es) be moved.
And it will happen. Expect to pay for p/c charges.

In a way I do.... always been my issue (the guilt when I needed to let somebody go never got smaller)

I may not have mentioned that at least for me, I have made a point of staying ahead on the retainer - just a personal issue I have with making sure things are taken care of or I become obsessive..... I will admit this particular lawyer is not one of the one's people complain about - even the comments made went to , "What I see here does not make sense for this "my lawyer" as I know his work".... but you don't here it seams was my response - I really do not have an answer for that one nor do I want to try.

It is like today, for the last month actually, I have had my entire set of files with me (there was a reason, the files at the lawyers got mixed up bad enough and it has taken again so long - but is was done last week. Clean happy and I can't wait to get rid of them.... But the thought came accross my mind this weekend, what copies will my lawyer want? That I will give my lawyer if he needs/wants something for his records - I did not remove the files to change lawyers.

[ddol1]

To get your file released from your previous lawyer to your new lawyer you will have to make full payment of the bill. Your previous lawyer is under no obligation to release your file until full payment.

If you haven't paid the lawyers bill in full you can request an assessment under s. 3 of the Solicitors Act. However, if it has been paid in full you must make the request under s. 11 of the Solicitors Act but you must show special circumstances why an assessment ought to be completed; this must be by an oder of the court.

It certainly is a catch 22:
1) If you give notice to your previous lawyer and he sends you a final bill, you can make the request under s. 3 and the Registrar will assess the bill (this must be done within one month from the date the final bill was rendered).
2) However, if you pay that bill so that it can be released to your present lawyer, it must go before a judge (costly and can well negate any credit that might be awarded on your behalf) and an assessment will only be granted in 'special circumstances'.

So before you go running to the new lawyer, have your ducks in a row is all, and know what you can do on your own (asking for assessment) versus a court date by the new lawyer asking for the bill to be assessed (court date).

Check this case out respecting what constitutes 'special circumstances':

CanLII - 2009 CanLII 40559 (ON SC)

First off if I am to understand it has to do with the last bill which I have asked for billing in November in person, (which his law clerk was confused as to what was a detailed bill (not just lawyer spent 3.75 hours @ $X.XX) but as I understand today, the bill should indicate what was accomplished for this time billed. So yes I asked for the billing in Nov, then in writing twice, maybe three times in December - last was maybe two weeks ago with an acknowledgement by the lawyer. So I really do not know how I stand given I have not recieved a bill since the previous Retainer amount (I asked for my billing when I was asked to feed the retainer more money, like I did after the first retainer was used, I asked and did recieve what I thought was a complete "normal" billing)

If this makes sense - I have always given him the retainer, I do understand and agree to his term right off that I would cover the cost for him to relieve himself of my file at the courthouse. He still has something left of the retainer I hope, and given it has been a full month, if the billing is not really up to date or something else??? I don't know...

This information you posted here I had absoluely no idea... (and I had not come accross anything that suggested this either!!) This was my first inquiry when I was at the courthouse the first time. Admittadly I was, ok a basket case that day, I normally would not have left my room with th eamount of paiin I was in that day but it was during the days of the holidays (Christmas and New Years). I was told about the rules for "costs" #24 of th efamily law rules, I told the lawyer that I had no clue how, what, when, we discussed why i thought this might be reasonable - and then she did get bent when she did ask the question, do I have a lawyer? Told her yes, that is why I am here! To learn of these costs and I am being that unreasonable given what did go down?

Actually, I went back a different day, explained the previous visit and she was the one who made such an effort going through the court file and I am thankful for what was my first "enlightenment" she wouldn't directly answer the what, how, where I could get more information on this or where I could go that obviously was not my current lawyer. Like your example, and maybe most??? I just can't see taking your lawyer to this level of disagreement as to billing, or work done or not done as the case may be when that person is still your lawyer. So it is a catch 22 of sorts for sure.... thanks for the great info!