Access?

[Unevenplayingground]

Hi everybody, looking for some advice please.

My husband used to have shared custody of his son. Last year was posted (military) out of the province, so it changed to joint. He has a court ordered agreement with his ex regarding access.

Every year they are to come to an agreement in May (this is in the court order), for the summer access. The reason May was chosen was because my husband is in the military and that would be the earliest time he would know when his vacation time would be. Verbally, in front of all lawyers, he told his ex that it would usually fall in the August time frame.

The issue is, 2 days ago his ex told him that on the 24th of August 2012, she was getting married and their son will be there.

It is a very important day for her and she wants her son there, understandably. The problem is, my husbands leave falls from (we think, and won't know for sure until, at least, May 2013) aprox the 10th of August until the end of the month.

What does a person do in this situation? We had no idea she was getting married until 2 days ago. The vacation time was supposed to be discussed and worked out, and now she is saying she already booked everything for her wedding and that is the absolute only time they can get married. If she keeps this date for her wedding it means we only get him for 7-8 days, instead of a little over 3 weeks.

We agree her son should be there for her special day, but he should also have time to visit his father.

Help please?

[Berner_Faith]

I guess my question would be... why does the son have to be there for almost 2 weeks? Is this a destination wedding?

From my point of view, I would not put up too much fuss about it, as it may be in the child's best interest to be present. That being said, is there an opportunity for make up time, prior to this? Unfortunately, this may not be possible because without knowing Dad's exact vacation time, it is hard to say how much, if any, of Dad's time may be missed.

From a wedding perspective, it would most likely be next to impossible to wait until May to plan a wedding for August.

Has Dad spoken to Mom about this? Expressed his concerns or asked about make up time in advance of the wedding?

[Unevenplayingground]

Berner_Faith,

The wedding is smack in the middle of the 3+ weeks he would normally have with his son. So he basically will have to pick the week before or after the wedding.

It is an important day for the mother, for sure, but my husband only gets to see his son 2-3 times a year. And there is no time to make up before or after. He is in a teaching position and there is no other time he can take vacation.

We appreciated her giving us tons of time, but the biggest reason the court order stated May was because he wouldn't be able to work out dates until then, at the earliest.

Now, we always confirm with her before making any decisions, and that is what the court order says, basically that the times are confirmed between both parties. She just went and did the bookings and told him.

She is extremely high conflict so we walk on egg shells when working things out. And it is an extremely important event, but when you see so little of your child, we just think she could have talked to him first and maybe we could have come up with a better compromise.

He has emailed her back, politely asking if she could even pick their son up mid-week at the airport, as she refuses to do pick up or drop off unless it is a weekend.

He definitely wants to try to accommodate her but if we agree to it, he loses over 2 weeks of visitation, that doesn't seem acceptable, even under the circumstances. If he was able to take him more that would be great, but flights are around $600-800 a pop, and we are on an extremely tight budget.

If push comes to shove and she absolutely won't budge, what do you think the best option would be?

[arabian]

You cooperate - hell if she's paying the airfare who cares? Assuming the mother is going on a honeymoon your son would only be there a day or two anyhow. How old is the child?

You state that there is only a 3 week window of time when your husband can take vacation. Then you go on to say that you won't know the actual vacation time until May. Which way is it?

[standing on the sidelines]

I think she means that he has a chunk of three weeks in a row he can take but he doesnt find out until may when he may take those three weeks.

The main thing is that he told his ex that it would always most likely fall in August so she should have planned her wedding for maybe June July or Sept and kept august free.

[arabian]

That makes sense ^ and if that's the case then she messed up with her planning. Not his problem. I'd be gracious and say that the 2-3 days that the child is away is fine and they would be amiable to make-up time at Christmas or add on to the following year.

High conflict individuals have a crafty way of pushing their issue and expecting everyone around them to 'bend over.' For that reason, and to curtail it from happening again, I would be firm. We spend money, time and energy to go to court to get court orders. Wouldn't it be nice if people would simply follow them?

[Unevenplayingground]

I think she means that he has a chunk of three weeks in a row he can take but he doesnt find out until may when he may take those three weeks.

The main thing is that he told his ex that it would always most likely fall in August so she should have planned her wedding for maybe June July or Sept and kept august free.

Yes, that is right, we have a good idea (we think) that it will be the last three weeks in August.

[Unevenplayingground]

That makes sense ^ and if that's the case then she messed up with her planning. Not his problem. I'd be gracious and say that the 2-3 days that the child is away is fine and they would be amiable to make-up time at Christmas or add on to the following year.

High conflict individuals have a crafty way of pushing their issue and expecting everyone around them to 'bend over.' For that reason, and to curtail it from happening again, I would be firm. We spend money, time and energy to go to court to get court orders. Wouldn't it be nice if people would simply follow them?

She did mess up with the planning, but we don't want to start a war with this whole thing, but he wants to see his child. She definitely does not contribute to the purchase of the plane tickets.

You are very right about high conflict individuals, it always shocks me with the reaction we get from her. Even when we are doing something that benefits her. I will never understand, but I do know we have to approach all situations with caution.

Would it not be reasonable to say, sure you can have him for that weekend, but you have to pay for the airfare to fly him back to mom and then return him back to us?

We even asked if she could move the wedding to either the first weekend, or the last weekend of his leave. In all fairness we were just told about this 2 days ago, we don't know how long she has been planning this (it could have been weeks/months). We didn't even know she was engaged, so it was kind of a surprise to receive an email saying the date she is getting married and that their son will be there. Good for her, but I think it all could have been worked out much better if she had of communicated before making all the bookings.

[arabian]

She sounds like a control freak.

Confrontation isn't pleasant but then being a doormat is even worse.

She wants the kid, and agrees to have him return within a reasonable period of time (3 days or whatever works for you) then she definitely should be paying the airfare.

Weddings can be expensive - flowers, dress, venue, bridesmaids ..... airfare for child to attend should be at the top of the list. Really not your problem.

[Unevenplayingground]

She sounds like a control freak.

Confrontation isn't pleasant but then being a doormat is even worse.

She wants the kid, and agrees to have him return within a reasonable period of time (3 days or whatever works for you) then she definitely should be paying the airfare.

Weddings can be expensive - flowers, dress, venue, bridesmaids ..... airfare for child to attend should be at the top of the list. Really not your problem.

I completely agree.

For years my husband just put up and shut up to avoid confrontation. I joke and say to him that he really didn't give me fair warning on her personality type. We laugh but it really is hard to deal with. We just never know the reaction we will get from her, and she also has a huge issue with telling the truth. This is why all correspondence is email, she refuses to even look at the option of myfamilywizard.

If she refuses, because I know she will, to pay for the flights related to her wedding, what recourse does a person have then?

Can we legally do anything about it, or is it put up and shut up?

[Rioe]

Tell her that unfortunately you will not be able to afford to interrupt your time with the child to send him back to her for one weekend, and it's too bad she was unable to schedule her wedding for a date that did not occur in the father's usual access time.

Then soften the blow by saying he will be able to tell her in May if he has been able to make other arrangements for his vacation schedule, and trusts that she will therefore make no other plans that involve her son in July or early August.

[dinkyface]

When it comes down to the wire ... once your husband has his kid, SHE will have to be the one to bend (on airfare) if she wants him there for 2 days for her wedding.

I'd guess that she'll be quick to hand him back after the wedding, since they will likely have honeymoon plans.

[Unevenplayingground]

Thank you everybody! Very helpful.

[firhill]

When it comes down to the wire ... once your husband has his kid, SHE will have to be the one to bend (on airfare) if she wants him there for 2 days for her wedding.

^^^ This....but,

Who arranges (and pays for) the flights the child takes, in order to head to and return from Dad's, for his summer access?

Do you think if Mom doesn't get what she wants, there's a possibility that she may "hold onto" the child until after the wedding and send him to Dad then?

[Unevenplayingground]

^^^ This....but,

Who arranges (and pays for) the flights the child takes, in order to head to and return from Dad's, for his summer access?

Do you think if Mom doesn't get what she wants, there's a possibility that she may "hold onto" the child until after the wedding and send him to Dad then?

Unfortunately we arrange/pay for the flights, putting us in a bad position because she is going to want a copy of the itineraries. If we dare book a return for after her wedding date, she won't send him on the plane. I definately think she will hold onto the child until after the wedding, with all my heart.

In the end, I know she won't co-operate. She will say it is in the child's best interest to be at the wedding, and that she gave us a lot of notice.

We do believe that their son should be there, but not at such an "expense".

We are going to try and reason with her, but we are at her mercy at the end of the day.