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  • Finally receieved babysitting receipts

    Ex and I settled out of court with lawyers for babysitting expense issue. Original separation agreement from 2008 stated that there were no Section 7 expenses, when such were to occur, such as child care, that ex was to notify me, provide me with receipt, in which I had 20 days to pay.

    2011 ex told me she wanted me to start paying babysitting expenses---I said ok, give me the receipts.

    She refused to give me receipts, ended up getting a lawyer/fighting with no receipts. I got a lawyer. 7 months later ex came up with a receipt for babysitting for the 2011 year---so I have to pay back pay on that.

    Amendment states again that she will pay the babysitting, provide me with a receipt on a monthly basis, in which I have 20 days to pay.

    Ex never gave me a receipt for January, February or March. She was just e-mailing me amounts. She was trying to charge me for pd days/school holidays that I said I was available to care for the kids and she would deny me.

    I gave her cheques for the months and I deducted the pd days/school holidays. I gave her cheques in good faith that she'd give me the receipts.

    In March I told her it would be the last cheque until I started receiving receipts.

    She wrote me an e-mail saying that her lawyer said I had to pay her for the pd days or they will file a motion of contempt.

    Her lawyer called my lawyer about it----my lawyer wrote her a letter explaining that her client hadn't even been giving me receipts and that I was available to care for the kids on the pd days/ex was denying me.

    Yesterday ex finally gave me receipts for January, February and March.

    She addressed them to me, labelled the monthly date just as "January 2012" "February 2012" "March 2012" labelled it as being for babysitting, but NO signature as to who the receipt is from.

    The receipts are for the exact cheque amount I gave her. (Her doing it in this manner is beneficial to me right?)

    How on earth could she file a motion of contempt now if the babysitting receipts she is providing match the exact cheque amount I gave her.

    Would a judge not look at her and say your babysitting receipt matches the exact cheque amount he gave you.....how does he owe you money?


    It's clear that she can't get receipts from the babysitter as proof for the amounts she e-mails me. The amounts she e-mailed me are higher then these receipt amounts. (I think the babysitter doesn't claim it as income on her taxes.....but ex claims it as an expense on her taxes....this is illegal right?)

    For April she sent me an e-mail and is trying to charge me for Good Friday----this is a statutory holiday, she did not work. She is also trying to charge me for Easter Monday---I offered to have the kids/ she denied me......so I will not be paying for those days. I will give her a cheque for her regular work hours/days the kids were in school.

    If she gives me a receipt for April in the same manner---matches the cheque amount I gave her------she does not have any issue to file a motion of contempt on me right?

    As I am to pay based on the babysitting receipt----the babysitting receipt and my cheques match for the amounts!

  • #2
    are the kids with a babysitter in someone's home, or are they in a child care facility (daycare, or even a licensed in-home daycare)....

    the reason I ask is the charge for PD days and holidays could be legit.....

    My girls are in a licensed daycare centre (not a home). They bill for all weekdays in a month - regardless if it is a holiday. When I asked about this, it was explained as the staff still get paid holiday pay on those days - just as the employed among us get stat holiday pay..... the option was to charge parents a lower per day fee for all days, or a higher daily rate based on attending days.... either way it all pans out in the end.... So while I was off on Good Friday with my kids, I worked Easter Monday (it's not a Stat Holiday) and my kids were in daycare....

    Now if they are being cared for the lady down the street who is doing some extra babysitting on the side, any fees/charges are much more subjective.

    My suggestion would be to strongly "suggest" they be cared for in a licensed facility - either an in-home daycare, or separate centre.... The benefit of a licensed facility is you KNOW they will provide receipts when asked, and can probably send them right to you as well. Depending on her income (and where you live) your ex may also qualify with the City for a subsidized rate for a licensed facility.... it would benefit everyone around....

    just my two cents.....

    Best wishes!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by cbarker78 View Post
      are the kids with a babysitter in someone's home, or are they in a child care facility (daycare, or even a licensed in-home daycare)....

      the reason I ask is the charge for PD days and holidays could be legit.....

      My girls are in a licensed daycare centre (not a home). They bill for all weekdays in a month - regardless if it is a holiday. When I asked about this, it was explained as the staff still get paid holiday pay on those days - just as the employed among us get stat holiday pay..... the option was to charge parents a lower per day fee for all days, or a higher daily rate based on attending days.... either way it all pans out in the end.... So while I was off on Good Friday with my kids, I worked Easter Monday (it's not a Stat Holiday) and my kids were in daycare....

      Now if they are being cared for the lady down the street who is doing some extra babysitting on the side, any fees/charges are much more subjective.

      My suggestion would be to strongly "suggest" they be cared for in a licensed facility - either an in-home daycare, or separate centre.... The benefit of a licensed facility is you KNOW they will provide receipts when asked, and can probably send them right to you as well. Depending on her income (and where you live) your ex may also qualify with the City for a subsidized rate for a licensed facility.... it would benefit everyone around....

      just my two cents.....

      Best wishes!!
      Two cents worth but, the return on investment on following your 2 cents is thousands saved in legal fees!

      All sound advice!

      Good Luck!
      Tayken

      Comment


      • #4
        Although you were in the right to demand receipts, you are slowly creeping into the wrong just because you don't know how daycares usually operate.

        1. They generally charge a flat rate every day, even for holidays, PD days or days where the child is sick.

        2. All the ones I've dealt with issue ONE receipt per year at tax time. Your ex hasn't produced monthly receipts because the centre doesn't do business that way. Quoting amounts in email is borderline acceptable. Better would be of she could also send you pictures of the cashed cheques if you are dead set on confirming that she is paying, providing she is paying that way.

        3. Get the name of the daycare centre and confirm their policies and arrangements yourself.

        It seems ridiculous to spend 7 months on lawyers to see receipts that don't exist. You could have just called the centre and asked for an account statement.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by winterwolf7 View Post

          2. All the ones I've dealt with issue ONE receipt per year at tax time. Your ex hasn't produced monthly receipts because the centre doesn't do business that way. Quoting amounts in email is borderline acceptable. Better would be of she could also send you pictures of the cashed cheques if you are dead set on confirming that she is paying, providing she is paying that way.

          side note - if you ask the centre to issue monthly receipts they will..... at the end of the month my centre will hand me the bill for the next month. It is also a statement that shows prior month billings and payments (billed $400 on June 1; next line would show chq $400 and the date it was deposited)

          Licensed centres are accustomed to dealing with separation and divorce issues, and will work with you if you ask nicely!!

          When I left ex, I made sure the daycare teachers knew exactly what was going on at home, so that they could also watch for any behavioural issues with the girls!! They are the ones with your kids and can spot things like that! A great Centre is worth it's weight in gold!!

          ((my girls have been at the same daycare for 5-6 years now - since oldest was just over a year old!!))

          Comment


          • #6
            Good advice. I think lawyers weren't necessary at all, your child attends the daycare, you are being asked to pay for it, so you should have been proactive in finding the billing information yourself when your ex didn't seem to be cooperating.

            Some daycares support divorce/separation better than others. In the end they are a business and want to make money, not deal in divorce politics. They will bend a little but in the end the parents have to follow their policies.

            Comment


            • #7
              Amendment states again that she will pay the babysitting, provide me with a receipt on a monthly basis, in which I have 20 days to pay.
              Your amendment sucks. It neglects that the receipt should be FROM THE BABYSITTER, not from the ex. The EX should show you the receipt from the sitter showing the date paid, the amount and containing the sitter's name and signature. (and her SIN if it's a private sitter - this is required to claim it on your taxes)

              THAT is a proper receipt, not one that the ex hand writes for you. Ask for a proper receipt, or make a formal request to pay your share directly to the sitter, given your ex likes to play games.

              Comment


              • #8
                The kids are not going to an actual day care centre. They go to a lady's house. I do not know whether the lady is licensed or not. I have asked and it has never been answered to me.

                When the ex was refusing to give me receipts after the amendment...I sent a letter and receipt book by register mail to the babysitter explaining the situation and asked if she could give me the receipts directly...she ignored me. The ex returned the receipt book to me and told me not to get the babysitter involved--that she does not get monthly receipts from her.

                I know the way the lawyers worded it in the amendment is vague and sux. Which is why I've been having the issues obviously.

                I can tell by the writing that it is the ex writing the receipts to me.

                Comment


                • #9
                  OH and I asked to pay the sitter directly at our 4 way meeting to settle this. Ex said "Oh the babysitter won't like that" and it was left at that.

                  *Frustrating*!!!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    so let me see if I'm understanding this...... your agreement is that you will pay your portion of child care, based on % of income, with receipts..... the receipts you were given were for the amount you paid to ex and not for the actual babysitting ((so this "appears" like you paid 100% of cost))....

                    Why not bank the money in a separate account, so that it's there and available, and stick to the letter of the agreement - while trying to get it firmed up.... You will gladly pay your portion of costs ONLY when she is able to hold up her side of the agreement and provide the required documentation. If she (or her lawyer) start threatening to take you to court, that's fine - you can show that you've been saving for it, and **assuming** you have been documenting everything, can show that she's not been following the same rules she expects you to.....

                    Who gives a flying fudge if the babysitter likes it or not.... if the lady down the street doesn't like it, "suggest" to have them attend a licensed centre that will provide proper documentation!!

                    Above all, best wishes!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      This is word for word the amendment

                      Commencing in January of 2012, the parties will share the child care expense proportionately to their incomes. "Bob's" amount shall be 42.4% and "Mary's" portion shall be 57.6%. Mary will pay the child care expense and provide Bob with a receipt on a monthly basis. Bob will reimburse her within 20 days upon being advised of the amount owing. The parties will obtain their own separate receipts for the amounts they have each contributed. If Bob does not reimburse Mary within the 20 day period for his portion of the child care expense, Mary will be able to deduct all amounts paid by her and pursue Bob for payment of the arrears in child care.

                      I get that it sux the way they worded it...too vague. "The parties will obtain their own separate receipts for the amount they have each contributed" Who am I supposed to obtain this receipt from if the babysitter has already refused to provide me with the monthly receipt.

                      Should I just stop paying all together now.......and bank the money until she files against me again and we get a new amendment made that actually makes sense---stating that I receive a receipt from the actual child care provider?

                      The whole reason we got lawyers involved in the first place is because I refused to pay because she wasn't giving me receipts----and that is the amendment the lawyers came up with for us regarding it. I don't think it has solved anything!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by knackered View Post
                        The whole reason we got lawyers involved in the first place is because I refused to pay because she wasn't giving me receipts----and that is the amendment the lawyers came up with for us regarding it. I don't think it has solved anything!
                        ....it would seem that way!

                        but as for waiting to be taken back to court.... think about what it will cost in lawyers - is it worth the cost (financially, emotionally)?


                        Don't really know what to do.... but best wishes!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yeah....I know, it is a mess!

                          So far I think I will just continue paying her during her regular work week, while the kids are in school.

                          I do not believe I should pay for the pd days/school holidays, as we have a right of first refusal clause in our agreement---our right of first refusal basically says that we both agree it is in the best interest for the children to spend time with either of us rather than a third party. If one of us is unavailable to care for the children, we are to notify the other, if the notified is not available, the other is to make child care arrangements at their own expense.

                          So as far as I'm concerned on those pd days/school holidays---If I am available, I get the kids, she saves the babysitting fees. If I'm not available---she pays for the baby sitting fees solely herself.

                          What's happening currently is I tell her that I want the kids those days---I tell her I will pick them up/ask if she'll pick them up when she's done work---She refuses/denies me the kids/ takes them to the babysitter and then tries to charge me for it.

                          When I've given her the monthly cheques---I just deduct those days that she did that off and explain that I was available to care for the kids to save her babysitting fees---she denied me and chose to put them in child care at her own expense.

                          Now if finances were not hard for me, I would pay her whatever the hell she wanted just to shut her up and stop this nonsense. But that's why my finances are so bad now....because I did that in the past with her!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            You've already spent more money on lawyers than in a year of child care over this.

                            The fact is, your child is being looked after and you will have to pay for the daycare. Arguing about receipts and wording on the amendments is great for your lawyers and utterly worthless for both you and your ex. Keep in mind the spirit of the agreement, especially as it follows family law.

                            If the lady looking after your child seems shady, is working under the table and not giving tax receipts, and seems to be on your ex's "side" then cease using her immediately and report her to CRA would be my suggestion.

                            Speaking as the parent of a victim of child abuse at an unlicensed daycare that cost me thousands in legal fees, mental anguish, depression, anxiety and loss of access to the children for over 7 months, be very careful who you allow your children to be with.

                            Our unlicensed daycare provider was physically and sexually abusing the children, and successfully played off the drama involved in the divorce to deflect blame away from themselves and onto one of the parents, then quietly moved away to another city.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The amendment says you'll pay upon being advised of the amount owed, not upon receiving the receipt. Thus why your ex has been e-mailing you the amounts.

                              But obviously she is still expected to provide the receipts eventually as well.

                              The way this SHOULD work... especially since daycare needs to be paid in advance.

                              1. Mary pays the daycare bill up front (via cheque)
                              2. Mary provides proof of payment to Bob (ie cashed cheque)
                              3. Bob pays Mary his portion (via cheque)
                              4. Mary provides Bob with a receipt for his portion.
                              5. At end of year, or end of month it honestly doesn't matter, both parties receive a copy of the total daycare expense for that period from the sitter.
                              6. Each party claims on their taxes the amount they paid for the daycare.

                              At this point each party has sufficient documentation to claim their portion of the daycare, everyone has seen proofs of payment and receipts. The daycare can produce her receipts on whatever schedule she wants and all parties already have the documentation of paying their share.

                              Comment

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