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Old 05-29-2017, 08:55 PM
otttawa_dad otttawa_dad is offline
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Default Do I meet the criteria for 40/60

Here's my access schedule

Every Wednesday after school, over night and Thursdays prior to school.

Every second Friday after school, overnight. Saturday full day and Sunday until 19:00

Also have 2 full weeks in summer.

4 days during Xmas

Just curious. Not sure how to calculate this.

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Old 05-29-2017, 10:27 PM
trinton trinton is offline
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The method that makes the most sense is the hourly method. Case law is in this method's favour.

There are a total of 8760 hours a year
You will need 3504 hours to have 40%

assuming you have kids from 3PM until 9AM next day) you have them for 18 hours. 18 hours * 50 weeks in a year (there are 52 weeks a year but you can't double dip on your summer weeks. You should also take our any Wednesdays that she would have her ). = 900 hours

Every other weekend
asssuming you have from 3pm until sunday 7PM) 52 hours x 26 weeks = 1352 hours. if any weekends fall on your summer access then you should subtract that as well.

2 weeks = 7 days x 24 hours x 2 weeks = 336 hours

4 days x 24 hours = 96 hours

You have total 2684 (assuming the times are right) = 30.64 %

DO you have any access on March Break ? Do you have any extended weekends for long weekends and PA days ? Do you get any time on Halloween?

Can you get more time on summer, Christmas, and for your weekends ? If you get Sunday overnights (as you do with Wednesdays) , March break, half of summer, half of Christmas, long weekends, etc, then you would be at 40%.

Last edited by trinton; 05-29-2017 at 10:34 PM.
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Old 05-30-2017, 12:43 AM
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Rioe Rioe is offline
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Watch out though, because he doesn't get a whole two weeks more during summer, since he already has some of that time. Same with Christmas, depending on where it falls in the normal schedule.

Most judges still count overnights, I'm told. Doing it that way:

You have every Wednesday and every other weekend,which doesn't extend to Sunday night, unfortunately. So that's four every two weeks.

4x26 = 104 overnights.

Add on 10 - 12 nights for the two extra weeks he gets in summer, depending on which type of access week those would normally have been. 106 to 108 overnights.

Add on the four nights over Christmas, which might be 4 nights, or only 2, depending on where the holiday falls across his usual access. Now he's got 108 to 112 overnights per year.

108 overnights would give him 30%
112 would give him 31%

This is surprisingly close to what Trinton's hourly calculations give. No wonder judges don't bother going by hours.

My first suggestion would be to negotiate with your ex to get Sunday overnights on your weekends. If you can get the kid to school on Thursday mornings, you can get the kid there on Mondays too. This makes the kid's life simpler, because there's one less transition to go back to your ex's house, makes your life simpler because it's one less exchange at which you have to see your ex, and lastly, it opens up more weekend travel to you.

Then you'd at least have normal EoW schedule, too.

The next step would be to negotiate for every other Thursday nights that segue into your weekends. Less stress on the kid than to have to go back to your ex for only one night before being back with you for your weekend.

Then, negotiate for the other Thursday nights as well. Less stress on the kid to wonder which house to be at on Thursdays, when it could be consistently yours.

Presto, 50-50.
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Old 05-30-2017, 02:05 AM
trinton trinton is offline
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hehe. Reminds me of those last-page math test questions from the good ol' school days.

I did mention he must subtract any weekends that would fall on the holidays. We don't know whether his summer weeks would cross his or one of the mother's summer weekends. I know in some cases father gets to pick his weeks in odd/even years and mother in the alternate year. Father could pick his weeks on mom's weekends and mom will pick on father's weekends.. only fair solution would be to average out the 2 years..

Seems overnight method is yielding higher percentage in his situation.

By giving him an overnight on Wednesday's you're basically counting Wednesday visits as a 24 hours visit when really, he is only getting 18 hours. Ultimately, you are giving him a "free" 6 hours every week which adds up to 312 hours in 52 weeks or 13 free overnights.

You are however, taking 4 hours every other week by taking Sundays away completely as they are not "overnights". Friday 3pm to Saturday 3pm would be 24 hours and Saturday 3pm to Sunday 3pm would be the other 24 hours. Child goes back on Sunday 7pm so there's that 4 hours of lost time. In the end, you are giving him an extra 312 hours and you are taking 102 away ultimately giving him an extra 208 hours or 8.6 or 9 overnights. 9 overnights in a year is an extra 2.5%.

If I took out the weekend hours from his summer access in my calculation (the hourly method) then he would be at approx. 28%.

This is the first time I'm hearing about the overnight method. Rioe - are you aware of any case law w.r.t the overnight method?

I have been aware of the "daily" method. With that method, depending on your schedule, one method could yield more hours. I think this was recently discussed here:

[25] Let me offer this example from the parenting arrangement I ordered in respect of FB to show why an hourly calculation – and not, for example, a daily calculation – is more fair. In circumstances where a child is dropped off at school or (as here) at day care by one parent (let’s say “Dad”), and picked up from school or day care by the other parent (“Mom”), a daily calculation might be unfair and unreflective of the allocation of true parental caring and responsibility between the parties. Depending upon the child’s age, Dad may well have made an important contribution in preparing the child for her day, including waking her, ensuring that he or she is appropriately washed and dressed, and preparing breakfast and perhaps lunch. When the child reaches school age, Dad may have also had to help her with last-minute issues like locating homework and seeing to her on-time departure for and arrival at school. Should that time not be recognized in calculating time for the purposes of Section 9? I think it should. Yet, a daily-based calculation in favour of Mom for that day would undervalue Dad’s important parenting time that morning.
In a situation similar to my present situation (i.e., Wednesday day access but no Wednesday overnights), the overnight method would literally wipe out all non-overnight access.

I second Rioe's suggestion with respect to extending Thursdays, etc and 50-50. Check out this page regarding 2-2-5-5 shared custody schedules Of course, this is under the assumption that you haven't agreed to that access schedule (i.e., 4 days on Christmas school break, etc) on a final basis.

Last edited by trinton; 05-30-2017 at 02:38 AM.
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Old 05-31-2017, 09:55 AM
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Janus Janus is offline
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Originally Posted by trinton View Post
Can you get more time on summer, Christmas, and for your weekends ? If you get Sunday overnights (as you do with Wednesdays) , March break, half of summer, half of Christmas, long weekends, etc, then you would be at 40%.
Before you fight too hard to get up to the 40%, you should be aware that fathers at 40% are routinely forced to pay full table CS. 40% is just the threshold at which a judge can consider ordering less than table. If the schedule during the year is clearly less than 40%, then the makeup time in the summer and such to creep up to 40% might not impress the judge at all.

If your goal is to reduce CS, then you need 50%. Even if that is not your goal, you should be pushing for 50% anyway unless you suck as a parent and in life.

I think Rioe was on the ball, so I won't reiterate what she said.
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