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  • #31
    Should I be interpreting that as;

    1. She's not your friend, no need to ask, go see your kids.
    2. She's not your friend, don't go see your kids.

    Comment


    • #32
      On second thought, no need to intrude on the walk... I can always go see our child in the playground before school begins. I'm sure she'll be there too with our other child so it works itself out. This certainly doesn't border on friendship.

      Comment


      • #33
        Ask yourself this, if the roles were reversed, would you want your ex showing up on your days to interfere in your time?

        Getting kids up and off to school is a process and adding any other things to it could create complications. You could ask if you could walk them to school a couple times a week and document the response. Showing up will just create animosity and further difficulty. Once you have set days in place you will be able to have that time to yourself with them.

        Youre walking a fine line between reasonable and bullying. Tread carefully.

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by rockscan View Post
          Ask yourself this, if the roles were reversed, would you want your ex showing up on your days to interfere in your time?

          Getting kids up and off to school is a process and adding any other things to it could create complications. You could ask if you could walk them to school a couple times a week and document the response. Showing up will just create animosity and further difficulty. Once you have set days in place you will be able to have that time to yourself with them.

          Youre walking a fine line between reasonable and bullying. Tread carefully.
          You're 100% right. I think visiting at the school playground before start would be better, even just for a few mins to say hi. They're fenced off and I would stay outside of that.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Whoknew View Post
            ensorcelled, thanks for chiming in. What you added was great and a nice alternative.

            I do have a question about access, today was our child's first day of JK so I went over the house (as agreed with my STBX) to walk over with them to school. It's about a ten minute. It felt awesome to be a part of this and our child definitely enjoyed it too.

            On the way back, I suggested that I come over in the mornings twice a week to do the same and was met with resistance and avoidance and later an email saying I was being angry. The email has other items of discussion and did not address her accusations in my reply.

            Can I reasonably show up anyway? I know our child would love it and quite frankly, myself included.
            Google Gray Rock method of communicating. Saved my sanity.

            Not sure if you can do this but I do at-home lunches with my boy once a week. I work from home on those days and I go to school and get him and we lunch at my place for 30 minutes and I bring him back for recess. MUCH easier than dealing with my Ex on these issues. Try as much as possible to steal 'extra' time while on neutral (in this case, school) territory.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by ensorcelled View Post
              Google Gray Rock method of communicating. Saved my sanity.

              Not sure if you can do this but I do at-home lunches with my boy once a week. I work from home on those days and I go to school and get him and we lunch at my place for 30 minutes and I bring him back for recess. MUCH easier than dealing with my Ex on these issues. Try as much as possible to steal 'extra' time while on neutral (in this case, school) territory.
              Thank you for the rec on GRMOC.

              Lunches would be tough to do because she brings him home everyday to eat but that's brilliant and glad it works for you.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by rockscan View Post
                Youre walking a fine line between reasonable and bullying. Tread carefully
                Ahh .. the wonderful land of family law .. where wanting to walk with your child to school is considered bullying LMAO.

                Somebody earlier wrote that you should ask (in writing) to join in walks as your child enjoys it (it's about the kids .. your ex doesn't get that yet. It's okay .. a judge will force her to get it). I think it was Rock who suggested it. Do that! Keep asking for extra time and document denials. That's a huge goal right now. Judges despise parents trying to minimize other parents involvement .. and that's precisely what she's been doing.

                See as little of your ex as humanly possible. I know it hurts and I know you still have feelings. It sucks .. but needs to be done. Find yourself a nice lady down the road.

                I work in schools so I know first hand that a parent can not just pick a child up mid day if there is no order permitting them to do so on the other parents time. Schools look at custody orders (at least the 3 I've worked in). Too many abductions now-a-days .. schools are very careful with that.

                Keep asking for overnights .. keep asking for extra time. Go over the benefits for the child in your correspondences. Rack up the denials and then get sole custody. Judges dont give custody to gatekeepers .. they give it to resolution-oriented parents who want to involve the other one.

                Collect the denials pal .. they make superb exhibits and they will make you successful in court.
                Last edited by LovingFather32; 09-05-2017, 09:08 PM.

                Comment


                • #38
                  My lawyer drafted up a letter today for increased parenting time that I spent the weekend on crafting, basically what I proposed in an earlier reply. I do not send directly to her because they go nowhere.

                  My lawyer advised not to reveal my full fledged plan of 2-2-3 just yet, just covering the next eight weeks split in four week increments.The reasoning is that my STBX is having trouble giving up anytime with our kids and to ease her into it. She also said her lawyer is probably aware that this is where we are headed anyway and I agreed. I will be going to visit at the playground on Tues and Thurs mornings before heading inside regardless.

                  As for seeing my ex, we only see each other during exchanges. They're civil. But then I get an email afterwards saying I was this and that and the other thing. As of today, email only for us so she won't be able to fabricate this any longer.

                  I would never even attempt to take our child away on her days but I can see the apprehension about it and glad it is being recognized.

                  Since you're a teacher, I would like your opinion on setting up a brief introduction/meet with the teacher. Would it be wise to let her know of the situation? Or would that be alarming? I would also like to request that I be included on any communications from her or the school regarding our child and events etc. What do you think?

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    My point was that she does not want you around all the time, kid or no kid.

                    Pick your battles.

                    Her time is her time....yours time is your time.

                    And yes, put yourself in her shoes and re-look at things....and vice a versa.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Whoknew View Post
                      My lawyer drafted up a letter today for increased parenting time that I spent the weekend on crafting, basically what I proposed in an earlier reply. I do not send directly to her because they go nowhere.

                      My lawyer advised not to reveal my full fledged plan of 2-2-3 just yet, just covering the next eight weeks split in four week increments.The reasoning is that my STBX is having trouble giving up anytime with our kids and to ease her into it. She also said her lawyer is probably aware that this is where we are headed anyway and I agreed. I will be going to visit at the playground on Tues and Thurs mornings before heading inside regardless.

                      As for seeing my ex, we only see each other during exchanges. They're civil. But then I get an email afterwards saying I was this and that and the other thing. As of today, email only for us so she won't be able to fabricate this any longer.

                      I would never even attempt to take our child away on her days but I can see the apprehension about it and glad it is being recognized.

                      Since you're a teacher, I would like your opinion on setting up a brief introduction/meet with the teacher. Would it be wise to let her know of the situation? Or would that be alarming? I would also like to request that I be included on any communications from her or the school regarding our child and events etc. What do you think?
                      There should be a class email list that you should get yourself on, as well as a general email list for school notifications. Almost nothing is paper anymore, but I always send a 'Nice to meet you!' email to the teachers at the beginning of the school year. When we split, I let the teacher know in person and the followed up by email with our parenting plan and contact info.

                      Can I ask why you're so keen on 2-2-3?

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Thanks for the suggestion ensorcelled.

                        I think 2-2-3 would work best because they won't go longer than three days without seeing myself or my ex. I also like that over a two week period, the days remain the consistent.

                        What alternatives did you consider when you were at this point?

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Whoknew View Post
                          Thanks for the suggestion ensorcelled.

                          I think 2-2-3 would work best because they won't go longer than three days without seeing myself or my ex. I also like that over a two week period, the days remain the consistent.

                          What alternatives did you consider when you were at this point?
                          We just fell into it, to be honest. My child's father has a lot of activities towards the end of the week and my work is always busy on Monday and Tuesdays and I'm there until 8pm somedays. Our child's homework assignments always are due on Fridays and well, he's not the best at getting those done

                          In our agreement we have a bunch of things that we flout all the time. I remember reading somewhere that if you go to court people are more likely to be 'strict to the letter' of their agreements and that would drive me batty. I was pregnant this summer and not able to take a vacation with our son so I will do so in November and homeschool him for two weeks while we are away. Life (for me) just isn't that structured but I think it's easy for me to say that as I'm a very organised person. My ex needs more structure and boundaries. He changed jobs, for example, and 'forgot' to tell me. When I tried to reach him for something his old admin assistant was like 'Ughh...he doesn't work here anymore!' I had to (gently) remind him of the line and paragraph of our separation agreement which we agreed to disclose those and that we need certain amounts of information in case of emergancy and he was like, 'Oh yea..sorry, slipped my mind'

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            There are two kinds of parents:
                            • involved parents who put in serious effort to look after their children's welfare
                            • uninvolved parents who have other people to look after their children's welfare

                            There are two kinds of exes
                            • reasonable exes who want the break to be clean and fair to everyone
                            • unreasonable exes who want to have everything

                            Obviously it's more of a spectrum than a black/white division, but let's go with extremes to illustrate my point.

                            Upon a split, they combine in different ways.

                            Two involved parents who are reasonable exes want 50-50 and will cooperate well to achieve it, without seeing court.

                            Two uninvolved parents who are reasonable exes will probably also end up with 50-50.

                            Involved parents who are unreasonable exes want 100 or as close to it as possible. Unless the other parent is a reasonable ex / uninvolved parent, this won't happen.

                            Two unreasonable/uninvolved people will fight to the bitter end and the children will suffer terribly caught in the middle.

                            There are more combinations (10 total, says math) but you get the picture.

                            Clearly, you have an involved/unreasonable ex to deal with.

                            What is going on in your case is that you were an uninvolved parent when you were the breadwinner with a stay-at-home partner. Now that you no longer have the stay-at-home partner, you are trying to switch to being an involved parent, and your ex is having none of it. Possibly because she's built her whole identity around being a stay-at-home parent, possibly because she's lazy and doesn't want to switch to being a breadwinner as well, possibly because she's unconvinced of your sincerity, who knows?

                            If you can guess her reasons, that may help with your negotiations though.

                            If she doubts your sincerity about suddenly becoming an involved parent, pointing out that you have support people to help you out will not be very useful. She'll just feel you want to take the children away from her to give to other people.

                            If she's built her whole identity around being a stay-at-home parent, that's her own psychological problem to deal with, and shouldn't affect your desire to spend time with your own children. The graduated schedule would be to help HER adjust, not the children, so you need to find things to promote that she could do with her time. You could suggest she take a retraining course to help her return to the workforce and that your parenting time would be the days she has classes.

                            The important point here is that things change upon a relationship breakdown. The children's time must be divided, as the parents are no longer experienced together. A stay-at-home parent must return to the workforce and young children will likely need daycare. It's unreasonable for your ex to expect her life to remain the same except with no longer seeing you evenings and weekends.

                            I'm wondering, however, if you may keep in mind something like 50-50 time for overnights, so CS is offset, but she gets two years of SS and looks after the children during the daytime when you are working. So you would bring the child who is not in school to her as though she was a daycare. Then, when both children are in school, you have perfectly normal 50-50, SS ends, and she presumably finds employment. It approximates the plan you both had, had the relationship not ended.

                            It's not equal, it's not fair, and it's not great, but the total cost might be less than going to court, which could take a couple of years until both kids are in school anyways.

                            See if you can get her to cave in first, but keep this option in mind as a last resort.

                            Another thing to keep in mind - whoever lives near the school has a HUGE advantage, even bigger in your case since you work from home. The kids could come to your house after school, you would likely be the one to go get them if they got sick, the friends they make will likely live in your neighbourhood, etc. Moving near the school NOW will be a tremendous help to your case. Plan long-term too; pick a house between the current school and the future high school.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Absolutely insist on 50/50. My kids were not as young as yours when I separated, but it was not 50/50 at first. Even though the SA stated the intention was to get to 50/50, when that time came it was like pulling teeth. Save yourself the struggle and get 50/50 from the start. And it is definitely healthier for the kids that way.

                              2-2-3 certainly works for the kids, but I have also seen kids that resulted from week-on/week-off, and they are also very well adjusted, socially active, doing well in school, etc.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                The proposal we sent yesterday was rejected. Down but not going to stop fighting.

                                2 children, 4 and 2

                                CURRENT:
                                M+W - 4 to7 PM
                                SATS - 9 to 7 PM

                                PROPOSED FOR NEXT FOUR WEEKS
                                M+W - 12 to7 PM
                                SAT 9 AM to SUN 9 AM

                                PROPOSED FOR FOUR WEEKS AFTERWARDS
                                M+W - 12 to 7 PM
                                SAT 9 AM to SUN 7 PM

                                When we settled our last proposal which was informal but between our lawyers, we stated that this it would only last four weeks (we are entering week four on Saturday), we said we will be serving court materials for regular non-emergency proceedings within the next few days.

                                We served the application on September 1.

                                If STBX agreed to med/arb, we would stop the process.

                                If we could't agree on a parenting plan beyond these four weeks and until the case conference, we would ask STBX to attend before a DRO.

                                It was also added...

                                For clarity, the interim w/out prejudice Agreement to be signed would read that in the event the parties do not come to agreement as to the parenting time from the four week mark until the case conference, they will either attend the DRO (available every Wed to assist while waiting) or serve the urgent motion. (No acquiescence.)

                                But here's the thing, now that I re-read the emails being sent back and forth, there was no agreement on their end to us.

                                Was there supposed to be an agreement signed or it is implied based on agreement to the informal proposal.

                                What next?

                                Also, I communicated with my lawyer today about this and said in court, talk tomorrow. I thought it would be a good time to ask for future court dates she'll be in on so I could attend. I was told she cannot do this to her clients but can send me judgements if I'd like.

                                I am not questioning ability, I wanted to get a feel for the process because I feel that's where this is headed.

                                Thoughts on that?
                                Last edited by Whoknew; 09-06-2017, 09:40 PM. Reason: typo

                                Comment

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