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  • #16
    Originally posted by slughead10 View Post
    male domestic violence is ontario family court
    All courts do this to men.

    And there are many stories where a man who called the police because he was abused ends up getting arrested.

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    • #17
      My story, easy - I was emotionally falling apart and the pressurejsut increased over time. Pressure to me is the intense result of a series af actions with the sole intent to break me, to cause as much.... I did not understand that what she was doing was far deeper than lashing out at me and when I finally really had no where to turn after telling every support system/asking for help, sympathy and encouraging words to hang in there sadly is not help, I called the police.

      That Sunday morning I finally fell so low that I just didn't know what else to do. Today I see that it was not the system but very specifically one constable who acted and reported that this was my fault, twisted and turned anything I had to say to fit his perception that not only did I not get any support from this senior officer bbut he would create a report that implied it was all my fault and I was the "risk". Two weeks later, when he walked in the door I knew what my fate was.

      What I have learned is the front line people in the system see this injustice everyday and it sickens them. They do not have the ability to change anything. The blindness of that police officer, the indifference of the prosecutor and the judge who just wanted to get out of there. So my help was jail. Jail was just one more indignity that I have had to endure for so long and the judge - she has effectively cut off my ability to maintain any real form of relationship with my children. All this when the facts according to the duty council "is a joke - there is nothing". Well the system says that they do not have to consider the facts or what is fair ir even what is right - that is what our day in court is for! And my day in court will be put off untill next year because two of the three judges have resigned their position.

      Help for a male victim of spousal abuse? Please, if one is in Toronto perhaps. Help - beyond being astonished at what has transpired does not bring any help to me what so ever. All training is based on female abuse - not the other way around. Right or wrong, this is what I have experienced. Was there any abuse - well the final decision came in yesterday - YES. The evaluations carried out here and the reports and any documentation was forwarded onto "the higher authority" who I have found out as of yesterday by mail. So maybe, just maybe it was not all in my head but I will get my day in court...... sometime next year.

      Is the "system" working towards correcting some of these wrongs - not from where I sit today.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Rioe View Post
        Ugh, so the equivalent of a shelter for men is really jail? That's just wrong on every level.
        Well, not really... They are homeless shelters (i.e. Salvation Army) etc... Or shelters for men who are mentally disturbed. But, in situations of intimate partner abuse there are no shelters for men and their children in Canada.

        But, as PH has pointed out... Men should be working on communicating this problem and establishing this service.

        Comment


        • #19
          I must apologize, my previous post was quite negative starting with the one police constable ending with a judge that Was just going through the motions.

          To the exact opposite, my time with the crisis team I had the opportunity to spend time at two shelters, I interacted with some of the people there and these were not for the mentally disturbed. In fact many were not much different than anyone here, they are just down on their luck and need a chance to get out from under the situation they found themselves. Some I spoke with offered me encouragement! I have learned so much in so little time. Things I once took for granted I will never again.

          When I needed help, the immediate crisis people gave me the help I needed to have during a period of time that total despair was guiding my reasoning..... Angela was a full shelter manager - this is one where if a bed is available it was yours until you got back onto your feet and for me she was my Angel through all of this when I needed one the most. There are many people I can't thank enough.

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          • #20
            Its kind of embarrassing for a man to call police about women abusing them....so a 40 yr old man calls 911 because his 15 yr old daughter chased him into a room and he locked it...he can not defend himself without risking hurting the 15 year old....I would assume the cops would have a laugh! Maybe I am wrong....but I think most men would be too embarrassed to phone police or 911.
            Same with a 40 yr old woman threatening a 40 yr old man day in and day out screaming at him and the kids all the time....If its was the man threatening and screaming at the woman and kids all the time I imagine its looked at a whole lot more as threatening.

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            • #21
              There need to be a few breakthrough cases before this situation is taken seriously. I have not read the other posts in this thread.

              Meanwhile, I still believe that dv - especially involving extreme physical attack - is more often man against man or woman.

              It's just that if a man is a victim - whether it's a heterosexual relationship or not... it's really bad that he feels there is no place to turn for support and a way out.

              Also, I feel a measure of contempt for people who cry wolf... e.g. the woman reported in the post from earlier this month (April 2013) - apparently, she falsely accused her male partner of abuse and he was thrown in jail for a stretch.

              Comment


              • #22
                any men reading this post

                #1 find youself a lawyer that another father recommends has done right

                i don't post a lot so to save myself replying to every nasty comment that might follow here is some advice

                " look up and down your street , at friends, at family , see who has the kids and who is fighting to see them "

                that's where the truth is my friends

                a lot of you know my story - for those that do and have spit and cursed me at me on this site my daughter has run away from her mother - fvck you , she will some day make her way back to her father.

                to those fathers out there don't give up your struggle

                god bless you

                love u all
                pokeman
                Last edited by pokeman; 05-14-2013, 09:56 PM.

                Comment


                • #23
                  I reported 3 cases of domestic violence to the police. They were not extreme situations but there was no other way out of the situation other than self defense which probably would have been turned against me. The police took none of them seriously and the three police reports confirm just as much. One of the incidents I had recorded on video the police would not even look at it.

                  So far since we have reached a settlement my ex has completely relaxed. There was no history of violence in our relationship until we were involved in an in home separation.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by FB_ View Post
                    I reported 3 cases of domestic violence to the police...

                    ...The police took none of them seriously and the three police reports confirm just as much. One of the incidents I had recorded on video the police would not even look at it...
                    I've requested the "freedom of information" records, on the occurances, involved in my situations, as I'm curious to see what, if anything was recorded, during those times. I highly doubt they will have any info, that corresponds with what happened.

                    I know I have run into the same situation(s), where the police wash their hands of incidents, considering it "he said, she said". I was once attacked in my basement at the very start of seperation (I was sleeping downstairs at the time, when she was still in the house). The police did nothing, because I didn't allow her to beat me. That was before, I started using an audio recorder.

                    Another more recent incident, I had the audio recording, of her hitting my vehicle, and swearing at me, while I was in the vehicle, getting ready to leave (leaving without child, when I was denied child at access exchange), and they also did nothing. She didn't damage the vehicle, so they let it go, and they were not interested in the audio recording - perhaps, because it was just audio?

                    If I had a video recording, like you did, I would have complained, and somehow looked into an official complaint/follow-up process, to have the video viewed.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by dad2bandm View Post
                      Another more recent incident, I had the audio recording, of her hitting my vehicle, and swearing at me, while I was in the vehicle, getting ready to leave (leaving without child, when I was denied child at access exchange), and they also did nothing. She didn't damage the vehicle, so they let it go, and they were not interested in the audio recording - perhaps, because it was just audio?
                      Yes, it is because it was an audio recording but, more importantly because it doesn't show the full scope of the communications.

                      Here is an example why recording are rarely ever used when taken by a party other than an expert (e.g. PI) or the police.

                      1. Person A calls Person B (recording off) and tells Person B and says something nasty. Hangs up the phone.

                      2. Person A calls back Person B immediately and then tries to discuss some matter about the children acting like they didn't just do Step #1.

                      3. Person B is still outraged at what Person A said to them, which is not recorded, and says something inappropriate but, influenced by the conduct of Step #1.

                      4. Person A has a recording of Person B from phone call #2 but, not from phone call #1 and provides to the police.

                      5. Police investigate and contact Person B but, are given new evidence of the Person A calling Person B in phone call #1.

                      6. Police's hands are now tied. What they do see is two people behaving incredibly badly. What are they to do?

                      That is why many of the learned posters to this site advise that the recording are for defence in a criminal proceeding of assault and to defend against false allegations. The recommendations to record are made to defend against a "Shaw v. Shaw" situation basically.

                      Good Luck!
                      Tayken

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Tayken View Post
                        Yes, it is because it was an audio recording but, more importantly because it doesn't show the full scope of the communications...
                        Yeah, I get that...

                        Which is why I use it, because in the few times police have been involved, the ex claims that I "started it", or I was "out of control". The audio recording, at least would show, that is clearly not the case, and I'm simply trying to, in this case, pickup child.

                        The time, she started hitting my vehicle, I had the audio start before I even pulled up to her place, so it was complete in that sense.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by dad2bandm View Post
                          Yeah, I get that...

                          Which is why I use it, because in the few times police have been involved, the ex claims that I "started it", or I was "out of control". The audio recording, at least would show, that is clearly not the case, and I'm simply trying to, in this case, pickup child.

                          The time, she started hitting my vehicle, I had the audio start before I even pulled up to her place, so it was complete in that sense.
                          Exploring it from another angle...

                          What benefit is it to the children, the primary concern (Rule 24) of a family law proceeding for the parent in question to be criminally charged for an emotional outburst?

                          Were the children harmed from the conduct? Did the police even call the CAS if the children were present? What did the CAS, if involved, even do about the incident?

                          It may have been a single incident. It may even be multiple. But, it takes more than someone slamming their hand on a car to get a charge against them. Also, it takes way more than that to get a conviction.

                          How do we apply the incident to Rule 24 and namely 24.(4) "Violence and Abuse" which explicitly states:

                          Originally posted by CLRA
                          Violence and abuse
                          (4) In assessing a person’s ability to act as a parent, the court shall consider whether the person has at any time committed violence or abuse against,
                          (a) his or her spouse;
                          (b) a parent of the child to whom the application relates;
                          (c) a member of the person’s household; or
                          (d) any child. 2006, c. 1, s. 3 (1).
                          Does the incident fit what is the court's view of "violence" and "abuse" against you? Remember, the court's view is rather different than that of the "domestic violence" advocates. Justice Brownstone provides some judicial insight in his book "Tug of War" if you haven't read it yet.

                          Good Luck!
                          Tayken

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by dad2bandm View Post
                            Yeah, I get that...

                            Which is why I use it, because in the few times police have been involved, the ex claims that I "started it", or I was "out of control". The audio recording, at least would show, that is clearly not the case, and I'm simply trying to, in this case, pickup child.

                            The time, she started hitting my vehicle, I had the audio start before I even pulled up to her place, so it was complete in that sense.
                            But you are using the recording to get your ex in trouble. The use of recordings is for your protection against false statements that it the only good use for it.
                            If she then wrote in an affidavit that on that one occupation that you threatened her, then you could use the recording to show that you didn't. That's all the recordings are generally good for.

                            Let your ex sink his/her own boat. Be emotional Teflon.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by involveddad75 View Post
                              But you are using the recording to get your ex in trouble. The use of recordings is for your protection against false statements that it the only good use for it.
                              If she then wrote in an affidavit that on that one occupation that you threatened her, then you could use the recording to show that you didn't. That's all the recordings are generally good for.

                              Let your ex sink his/her own boat. Be emotional Teflon.
                              Excellent observation from InvolvedDad75. If you are recording just to bring negative evidence justices (in family law proceedings) don't generally like it. But, in defence to an allegation it is helpful. But, be prepared to have the whole conversation transcribed into a written record.

                              As InvolvedDad75 suggests. Let the other party hurl mud.

                              Don't lead with negative evidence if you absolutely don't have to. Also, you have to really, as ID75 points out, check the "relevance" of the evidence. Just because you have it doesn't mean it is helpful at times. Let the other party make it relevant in defence to a false allegation.

                              Good Luck!
                              Tayken

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by involveddad75 View Post
                                But you are using the recording to get your ex in trouble. The use of recordings is for your protection against false statements that it the only good use for it...

                                ...Let your ex sink his/her own boat. Be emotional Teflon.
                                When I, or my transportation with which I'm sitting in, are assaulted, in what is supposed to be a simple act of picking up our child, the police will be called. I don't deserve to be assaulted. The ex's actions, alone, are what get her in trouble.

                                Comment

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