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Temporary Reduction of Spousal Support - am I being played for a sucker?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by randomjohndoe View Post
    So... Just because it is the law and appeared by court, it is moral? Yes, it is a trick question.
    Was it moral for two married people to sneak off behind their long time spouses back and do the nasty? Was it moral for him to go start a new business while bankrupting the company and leaving her to deal with it all?

    RandomJohnDoe, maybe look at it this way - the SS is a salary paid by her ex to deal with the hassle of closing the business. If your employer decided he didn't want to pay your wage, you could go and find another job. She doesn't have this option.

    Lastly, we aren't discussing a 5 or 10 year marriage. We are discussing 30 and 32 year marriages. In both marriages, the cheated on spouses had a very realistic expectation that their lifelong marital contributions were towards their retirement with these people in the near future. So in this case - yes I think it is moral for her to receive spousal support for the remainder of his life.

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    • #17
      Originally posted by TiredOfTheDrama View Post
      Was it moral for two married people to sneak off behind their long time spouses back and do the nasty? Was it moral for him to go start a new business while bankrupting the company and leaving her to deal with it all?

      RandomJohnDoe, maybe look at it this way - the SS is a salary paid by her ex to deal with the hassle of closing the business. If your employer decided he didn't want to pay your wage, you could go and find another job. She doesn't have this option.

      Lastly, we aren't discussing a 5 or 10 year marriage. We are discussing 30 and 32 year marriages. In both marriages, the cheated on spouses had a very realistic expectation that their lifelong marital contributions were towards their retirement with these people in the near future. So in this case - yes I think it is moral for her to receive spousal support for the remainder of his life.
      I couldn't agree more. I am not a huge supporter of ss, but this situation screams the need for it.

      Comment


      • #18
        Keep in mind we are just hearing one side of the story right. Some people stretch the truth alot. I think in some of these cases we have to read between the lines and find the truth somewhere in the middle.

        Sorry Arabian but you were married to this guy a very long time. You ex did not become this way overnight and its takes 2 to tango so stop blaming everything on him.

        I would think from the way u speak here that had the situation been reversed u would have done everything u could to protect yourself before leaving your ex as well.

        Comment


        • #19
          Originally posted by Lainar View Post
          Keep in mind we are just hearing one side of the story right. Some people stretch the truth alot. I think in some of these cases we have to read between the lines and find the truth somewhere in the middle.

          Sorry Arabian but you were married to this guy a very long time. You ex did not become this way overnight and its takes 2 to tango so stop blaming everything on him.

          I would think from the way u speak here that had the situation been reversed u would have done everything u could to protect yourself before leaving your ex as well.
          Lainar, I agree with what you are saying but the op is asking for advice based on what she is telling us. So only the op knows the truth, but based on what she is saying, ss makes sense.

          My sister was with a guy for 13 years, I always thought he was a goof, but I also thought he would always respect the law and take care of his kid. When everything went down he did some pretty dirty things to my sister and their child. And NOBODY would have seen that coming, so yes sometimes people do surprise you when they turn on you.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by randomjohndoe View Post
            So... Just because it is the law and appeared by court, it is moral? Yes, it is a trick question.
            The answer is YES--it is very moral, and legal and well deserved!
            !!!!!

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            • #21
              I am going to throw my 2 cents in for what it's worth...

              I think everyone has to remember that when the OP and her husband were married, it was common practice for the wife to stay home and care for the house and children...in this case the business. Times changed over the decades, but the OP and her husband were engaged in what I would call an old fashion marriage. Now a days it is not as common to have a stay at home spouse, it still happens, however you have a mix of men and women and you have many women who return to the work force after having children. For the OP she was in the norm for their time frame... nobody gets married expecting to get divorced. I am sure if she could go back and do it all over again, things would be different, but that fact is, the ex supported her through their 30+ year marriage, he was clearly in it for the long term and in this case, it should continue.

              I personally feel the guidelines for SS, need to be a bit stronger, as it seems strange for someone who is young and was married only 5 years, be entitled to SS for 10+ years, but in the case of long term marriages, where one simply fell into the norm for their day in age, SS should be awarded.

              People need to stop getting so fired up about SS and look at why it was awarded.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by Berner_Faith View Post
                I personally feel the guidelines for SS, need to be a bit stronger, as it seems strange for someone who is young and was married only 5 years, be entitled to SS for 10+ years, but in the case of long term marriages, where one simply fell into the norm for their day in age, SS should be awarded.

                People need to stop getting so fired up about SS and look at why it was awarded.
                That makes a lot of sense, Berner.
                Start a discussion, not a fire. Post with kindness.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Berner_Faith View Post
                  I am going to throw my 2 cents in for what it's worth...

                  I think everyone has to remember that when the OP and her husband were married, it was common practice for the wife to stay home and care for the house and children...in this case the business. Times changed over the decades, but the OP and her husband were engaged in what I would call an old fashion marriage. Now a days it is not as common to have a stay at home spouse, it still happens, however you have a mix of men and women and you have many women who return to the work force after having children. For the OP she was in the norm for their time frame... nobody gets married expecting to get divorced. I am sure if she could go back and do it all over again, things would be different, but that fact is, the ex supported her through their 30+ year marriage, he was clearly in it for the long term and in this case, it should continue.

                  I personally feel the guidelines for SS, need to be a bit stronger, as it seems strange for someone who is young and was married only 5 years, be entitled to SS for 10+ years, but in the case of long term marriages, where one simply fell into the norm for their day in age, SS should be awarded.

                  People need to stop getting so fired up about SS and look at why it was awarded.
                  Very well put. It is refreshing to have it stated in an objective and fair perspective. As the recipient of SS, I do believe it is still my obligation to work towards independance and I am doing so. I have gone back to take refresher courses in accounting and software, and I am employed, that said, after 29 years of marriage I have absolutely no hesitation for "his" monthly cheque to be deposited in my account.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by arabian View Post
                    30 yrs marriage. Divorce in 9 months. Business partner with ex who upon my kicking him out moved business money into g/f's bank account. Got interim order and subsequent substantial SS orders. No minor children/no CS issues. Ex has taken me to court at least 2 x a year on individual and failed attempts to have SS eliminated. Ex left me with business debt and went bankrupt so I was left to deal with closing business which has taken me over 3 yrs. Ex in contempt of court for not providing business documents and still refuses to comply.

                    Recently ex (now on 3rd lawyer) sent letter directly to my lawyer who forwarded it on to me, threatening to "retire" unless I reduce SS immediately as he has large business expenses. Ex only recently complied to provide business information. Needless to say we know he cannot threaten to retire - not an issue. Issue is ex always taking us to court so lawyer wants to now go to Superior Justice to have remedy against ex so he doesn't waste court & my time on senseless litigation.

                    I communicated with ex and eventually met with him and his g/f. He has since provided all documentation regarding "recent" business expenses that he considers urgent. My lawyer who has represented me in court for past 3 yrs is now a certified collaborative lawyer, in other words, anything my ex and i can agree out of court will save everyone money. My lawyer and I agree that we could give the ex a "break" financially so he can deal with his immediate business issues.

                    Lawyer will write up anything we agree to in "legalese" but I sense my ex is stalling.

                    Does anyone have any opinion as to if I am giving up any legal position by agreeing to a temporary relief of his SS responsibilities? I wouldn't be agreeing to excuse everything but I'm considering not implimenting the annual review which would make a 1500.00/month increase be tabled indefinitely. It makes a huge difference to my standard of living but I feel that I should be flexible and look at the big picture.

                    I'm sure that he never disclosed all of his business income. Can't prove it and really don't want to go down that road

                    Any thoughts?

                    Don't do it. I gave him a break and switched lawyers (other one was bullyish as hell). It is very hard to get it out of reduction/suspension and it takes forever to get back into Court. Trust me I am frustrated as hell.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      When I started posting on this forum, I got a nice welcome from Arabian, and some advice. Included in that advice was to request SS.

                      I've been married (separated almost one year) to a violently abusive man for 43 years, and taking care of him, the house and kids, along with a real estate business with 7 rentals properties, well it almost did me under, but I survived. No help with the house work, cooking, kids, and very little help with the business.

                      Today I told my lawyer I want SS. I want to thank you again Arabian for your advice. Not many people have the guts to tell it like it is with such compassion.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Thanks for the comments everyone. To update you on my situation this past weekend I received two emails from ex's g/f. She wanted me to know that my ex went to his lawyer and that my lawyer should expect a proposal which I am to "take very seriously." She went on to say that it would be best for all concerned if we were to keep things out of court.

                        My response was immediate. I sent my ex an email expressing my displeasure in receiving 2 emails from his g/f basically telling me I should wait and see what they had up their sleeve.

                        Two months ago my ex sent my lawyer a letter pleading to meet with me to discuss his current financial situation. I did nothing until my ex's g/f emailed me and told me she wanted to meet with me as she was very concerned about my ex's health, etc. I agreed to meet with her and then later my ex. Prior to that I had met with my lawyer. I told my ex and his g/f that I was prepared to continue to defer the increase in SS but that we would need to agree on the calculations and that once that was completed we would have my lawyer draw up an amendment and enter it into court. As my ex has a very poor lawyer who just tries to run up bills and who is quite frankly STUPID, I had offered to assist my ex to find a new lawyer so he could get proper legal advice.

                        We have been divorced for over 2 yrs now. My SS is supposed to be adjusted yearly, according to a formula in our divorce judgment. As my ex kept me busy taking me to court to have SS overturned for the past 2 yrs, there have been delays (on his part) in providing me with his financial information. I have been more than patient.

                        So now I'm pissed off and regretting ever talking to him in the first place. By not having the SS adjusted annually, a conservative estimate is that I am receiving approximately 1,300.00 LESS than I should be receiving. I think I've been more than patient and understanding.

                        Enough is enough. I have sent my lawyer instruction to proceed with the request for: case management with the Chief Justice; order that my ex must pay a deposit of $1,500.00 for each and every time he wishes to take me to court in the future along with a review and approval from case management judge that he has merit in doing so; the immediate and complete recalculation of my SS in accordance with the divorce judgment.

                        I have sent my ex and email stating that we have an agreement in place ie. divorce judgment. I have no desire to "negotiate" or discuss anything with his lawyer. I expressed my disappointment that we were unable to save some legal fees on agreeing on a simple mathematical calculation for the determination of ongoing SS.

                        Since that email went to ex, the g/f emailed me back to say she is sorry that I got the impression that my ex was going against our agreement to try to resolve some issues out of court. Go figure eh?

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by arabian View Post

                          We have been divorced for over 2 yrs now. My SS is supposed to be adjusted yearly, according to a formula in our divorce judgment. As my ex kept me busy taking me to court to have SS overturned for the past 2 yrs, there have been delays (on his part) in providing me with his financial information. I have been more than patient.

                          Just my opinion, but I think you should cut off ALL contact with the ex and his girlfriend.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            @SH: Then why don't you petition the Courts to outlaw SS if it's so 'wrong?'

                            SS (and entitlement to it) is one of the issues to be established in Court, and obviously there is good reason for that and a myriad of circumstances for which it is decided.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Originally posted by hadenough View Post
                              @SH: Then why don't you petition the Courts to outlaw SS if it's so 'wrong?'

                              SS (and entitlement to it) is one of the issues to be established in Court, and obviously there is good reason for that and a myriad of circumstances for which it is decided.
                              Not the least of these is the matter of taxpayers funding the spouses who need financial help. So I'm guessing some proponents of outlawing SS would rather have a hefty increase in their taxes to fund the myriads of spouses who are left without SS.

                              Vengeance feels good, doesn't it? Rather be broke than contribute to my ex's financial welfare.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                ^ ok, "resourceful" - whatever you say.. Keep your blinders on. Wouldn't want to interfere with your little corner of heaven by discussing reality.

                                Comment

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