Are these signs of Parental Alienation?
Here is some background: My SO was in a serious car accident in 2009. As a result he suffered a brain injury. He can still function well enough although slower and he has some need for order (like his desk and schedule) so he can manage effectively. At the time he had joint/shared custody (50/50) of his two children.
Becuase of the 2009 accident, my SO had to stay in hospital for nearly a year. He saw his children maybe a half dozen times during that year. They wouldn't visit us at our home as they said that they didn't like me becuase I took up too much of his time before the accident. His ex moved away with the children months before he was released. I discovered there was no Separation Agreement but found records of his trying for years.
Since 2006 his ex has said to him and everyone else that he was verbally abusive to his children and wanted to move them to another city to be closer to her parents saying that the children need to spend more time with them. He never agreed saying he was worried that he would never see his kids. I had never witnessed him being abusive to his kids during our time together - I wouldn't allow it in any case - and encouraged him that he was a good father. He did many things with his kids, on the school board, soccer coach, he hosted all their birthdays with their friends, but he was a bit stricter than his ex. He expected a little more structure from the kids.
He just got an agreement signed in January of 2012 and it took two years of debating over dumb things like pick up time. He had to finally put a stop to it by setting a date where they would apply to court. He has paid child support since the accident and a significant amount for extra-ordinary expenses which we never get evidence of but that's not in dispute if it goes to the kids. The agreement is for joint custody and allows acces (at least) every other weekend, one week at Christmas and 3 weeks in the summer. The children are 12 and 14 now.
Here's the issue: the mother texts, emails, phones at least 10 times per day if we allow them access to the phones/emails. The younger one gets anxious if he can't get in touch with her constantly. They are required to tell her everything they do at all times. The younger one was texting his mother yesterday while we were going out for dinner and he asked us how long until he goes home and I asked why and he said because Mommy is counting the days until I can see her. So I asked, "Does that make you miss Mommy?" and he said "No, but Mommy gets lonely when she doesn't have us or friends to keep her company."
I've had to make a rule that phones and computers are off by 10pm and TVs by 11pm. Otherwise, the younger one cries all night texting with his mother. We were told by family that the kids can't sleep because we asked them to close their bedroom doors when we got a new kitten so it wouldn't pee on the bed. This kids didn't say anything. We communicated the rules to the EX and she told everyone we took all their stuff and are not listening to the kids because it was about closing a door. Obviously when we discovered from the family member the door issue, we made arrangements with the kitten so they could sleep with the doors open. The thing is that the family members think that things are so bad, they make arrangements to get the kids behind my EX's back because they feel so bad that the kids hate it so much. But when we sit down and talk to the kids, even with that family member present, because we don't want them to feel unhappy, they don't say they are unhappy. I'm confused.
On scheduled weekends, there are almost always activities (sometimes theirs, sometimes hers) scheduled during our regular visitation and the children are ALWAYS told it's their choice to see their dad. If we've planned a family birthday function or something and we push back on the mother to ensure they come, the mother says we don't listen to the kids and don't care about them. She does this in front of the kids.
She tells friends and extended family that the kids hate being with us so of course they try to encourage making plans during our weekends too. That we buy their affection because we usually take them away during long visits so that we can have quality time without interruption. That gets expensive but I don't know how else to make sure the children can have healthy time with their father.
Another example is that we asked the kids for Father's Day and she said it's their choice but scheduled a garage sale that day to sell the kids old toys so of course they wanted to be there and didn't spend the day with their dad.
She goes away for weeks for work and leaves the kids with her parents and doesn't inform my SO until the last minute and when he asks why, she asks if he has a problem with her parents? This sort of messaging is confusing to someone with a brain injury who needs to understand what's going on in a clear way.
When we share our travel plans, there is aways a negative that comes when we pick up the kids. For instance, we were going on a Disney Cruise but the children were afraid to go at the last minute because of sharks in the ocean, or sea sickenss, or seeing people they don't know, etc. There is always something we have to address at the last minute.
This is just a drop in the bucket and I realize it almost sounds unreal and that we are bitter and making it up but it wears on a person. Since my So doesn't drive we go together to pick up the kids an hour away (half way) with him and I'm happy to do it but only to discover how unhappy they seem to be to "be forced" to come with us. Within 10 minutes in the car, they are calm, happy and talking. Then the texts, emails and phone calls start...
He has in the agreement the usual clauses of uninterrupted time, sharing information, etc. but as I've discovered, Separation Agreement are not worth the paper they are written on.
My own children are 21 and 30 now and I didn't experience this. They visited their father regularly. We had an agreement and we stuck to it or negotiated changes as adults and now they have their own relationship with their father and they are happy. No drama.
Am I overreacting? Is this the new way of raising children in split families?
We are going to see a child psychologist today to see if we can set up counselling sessions with my SO and his kids. I want to get to the bottom of things and try to help mend the damage but am I overstepping? We asked the ex if she would agree to counselling but of course she said to ask the kids.
The only other option I can imagine is to just to give up. But would that be supporting alienation of their dad?
Here is some background: My SO was in a serious car accident in 2009. As a result he suffered a brain injury. He can still function well enough although slower and he has some need for order (like his desk and schedule) so he can manage effectively. At the time he had joint/shared custody (50/50) of his two children.
Becuase of the 2009 accident, my SO had to stay in hospital for nearly a year. He saw his children maybe a half dozen times during that year. They wouldn't visit us at our home as they said that they didn't like me becuase I took up too much of his time before the accident. His ex moved away with the children months before he was released. I discovered there was no Separation Agreement but found records of his trying for years.
Since 2006 his ex has said to him and everyone else that he was verbally abusive to his children and wanted to move them to another city to be closer to her parents saying that the children need to spend more time with them. He never agreed saying he was worried that he would never see his kids. I had never witnessed him being abusive to his kids during our time together - I wouldn't allow it in any case - and encouraged him that he was a good father. He did many things with his kids, on the school board, soccer coach, he hosted all their birthdays with their friends, but he was a bit stricter than his ex. He expected a little more structure from the kids.
He just got an agreement signed in January of 2012 and it took two years of debating over dumb things like pick up time. He had to finally put a stop to it by setting a date where they would apply to court. He has paid child support since the accident and a significant amount for extra-ordinary expenses which we never get evidence of but that's not in dispute if it goes to the kids. The agreement is for joint custody and allows acces (at least) every other weekend, one week at Christmas and 3 weeks in the summer. The children are 12 and 14 now.
Here's the issue: the mother texts, emails, phones at least 10 times per day if we allow them access to the phones/emails. The younger one gets anxious if he can't get in touch with her constantly. They are required to tell her everything they do at all times. The younger one was texting his mother yesterday while we were going out for dinner and he asked us how long until he goes home and I asked why and he said because Mommy is counting the days until I can see her. So I asked, "Does that make you miss Mommy?" and he said "No, but Mommy gets lonely when she doesn't have us or friends to keep her company."
I've had to make a rule that phones and computers are off by 10pm and TVs by 11pm. Otherwise, the younger one cries all night texting with his mother. We were told by family that the kids can't sleep because we asked them to close their bedroom doors when we got a new kitten so it wouldn't pee on the bed. This kids didn't say anything. We communicated the rules to the EX and she told everyone we took all their stuff and are not listening to the kids because it was about closing a door. Obviously when we discovered from the family member the door issue, we made arrangements with the kitten so they could sleep with the doors open. The thing is that the family members think that things are so bad, they make arrangements to get the kids behind my EX's back because they feel so bad that the kids hate it so much. But when we sit down and talk to the kids, even with that family member present, because we don't want them to feel unhappy, they don't say they are unhappy. I'm confused.
On scheduled weekends, there are almost always activities (sometimes theirs, sometimes hers) scheduled during our regular visitation and the children are ALWAYS told it's their choice to see their dad. If we've planned a family birthday function or something and we push back on the mother to ensure they come, the mother says we don't listen to the kids and don't care about them. She does this in front of the kids.
She tells friends and extended family that the kids hate being with us so of course they try to encourage making plans during our weekends too. That we buy their affection because we usually take them away during long visits so that we can have quality time without interruption. That gets expensive but I don't know how else to make sure the children can have healthy time with their father.
Another example is that we asked the kids for Father's Day and she said it's their choice but scheduled a garage sale that day to sell the kids old toys so of course they wanted to be there and didn't spend the day with their dad.
She goes away for weeks for work and leaves the kids with her parents and doesn't inform my SO until the last minute and when he asks why, she asks if he has a problem with her parents? This sort of messaging is confusing to someone with a brain injury who needs to understand what's going on in a clear way.
When we share our travel plans, there is aways a negative that comes when we pick up the kids. For instance, we were going on a Disney Cruise but the children were afraid to go at the last minute because of sharks in the ocean, or sea sickenss, or seeing people they don't know, etc. There is always something we have to address at the last minute.
This is just a drop in the bucket and I realize it almost sounds unreal and that we are bitter and making it up but it wears on a person. Since my So doesn't drive we go together to pick up the kids an hour away (half way) with him and I'm happy to do it but only to discover how unhappy they seem to be to "be forced" to come with us. Within 10 minutes in the car, they are calm, happy and talking. Then the texts, emails and phone calls start...
He has in the agreement the usual clauses of uninterrupted time, sharing information, etc. but as I've discovered, Separation Agreement are not worth the paper they are written on.
My own children are 21 and 30 now and I didn't experience this. They visited their father regularly. We had an agreement and we stuck to it or negotiated changes as adults and now they have their own relationship with their father and they are happy. No drama.
Am I overreacting? Is this the new way of raising children in split families?
We are going to see a child psychologist today to see if we can set up counselling sessions with my SO and his kids. I want to get to the bottom of things and try to help mend the damage but am I overstepping? We asked the ex if she would agree to counselling but of course she said to ask the kids.
The only other option I can imagine is to just to give up. But would that be supporting alienation of their dad?
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