Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

D7 getting hit hard w garbage from mom: ideas?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • D7 getting hit hard w garbage from mom: ideas?

    BACKGROUND: We split 6mo before D7 was born. Only child. Short-lived relationship - she's a volatile personality who felt she was entitled to my support of her hobby-business (which is her 'Identity') which she persists in even now after 13 years of failure (she is the youngest and only unmarried in a wealthy and very proud middle-eastern family).

    Access is 2.5 overnights per week, plus StatHols/PD days that fall on my weekends, plus half holidays/summer (averages to exactly 40%).

    Until 1 yr ago, mom was pretty good at keeping conflict away from our D, only minor blips (the worst one was an apparent self-pity attack causing D to break down in tears because she felt that she had to go back and look after mommy because she was all alone, and mommy just sits at home crying on the phone).

    Mom used to come out on school field trips with D7 and me, and it was cordial - and D loved having both of us with her, but mom has decided she won't do that anymore. She gets more sympathy mileage out of telling everyone that she can't attend field trips because I do. It balances because she is involved in occasional in-class activities, which I cannot do because of school's French language barrier.

    Recently D7 is getting hit hard, stuff like 'why didn't you tell me that you and mommy went to a judge to decide everything', and 'when you make a baby with someone you are supposed to get married and stay together', plus mom is involving her in our negotiations about changing her last name (which I've been attempting via courts for the past 4 yrs), and encouraging the 'I love one parent more than the other' thoughts, and 'girls only' secrets, plus possibly creating attachment-anxiety by talking about 'mommy's mommy left the family&country and died'.

    I've so far only told her that these are discussions between adults, and that mummy and I agreed that we would not talk to D7 about these.

    QUESTION: Any thoughts on how to be a bit less doormat-ish about this?

    Our relationship is otherwise very strong, and apart from some short-lived hostility from D7 after time with mom, and some sad questions from D7, we are doing great. But I'm worried this may be getting out of hand.

    Perhaps some kids' fiction/movies in which a separated parent is behaving poorly to their kids? (there was a great MadMen episode on this). Getting involved with other 'amicably split' parents/kids so she can see other 'split-family' patterns?

    Other creative ideas PLEASE??

  • #2
    You could say to her:

    "I am sorry that you have been hearing things from mommy. The reason that I never told you about mommy and I going to a judge is that it is something that kids are not supposed to hear about. Our job as parents is to take care of these things and not let you worry about it. A lot of the things that mommy is telling you are things that should be handled by just me and mommy. I don't think mommy should be telling you any of these things. As for mommy being alone, I am sorry to hear that she is alone and sad, but you need to understand that mommy being happy is mommy's job, not yours. She is the adult, you are not."

    My daughter is now 8, and was 6 when her mom and I split. My son was 3, now is 5. Things have mostly been good, but there has been the odd occasion where mommy has said things that the kids shouldn't hear. Not about me, mind you. She would tell them that she didn't have enough money, or enough food, and then they would inevitably come to me asking me to give mommy money (one time it was 'more money'), and help her have food in the house. I tried to ignore it, but eventually had to deal with the matter on two different fronts.

    First, after the fifth time that the kids asked me to give money to their mom, I told them that it is mommy's job to figure out her money, and that I already helped her with a certain amount of money per month, and that if I gave her any more, then I wouldn't have the money that I needed to make sure they had food clothes. This is a highly contentious thing, because I loathe the notion of the kids being aware of things like child support, but it had gotten to the point where it was ridiculous. I kept the emphasis on mommy being responsible for her household and money, and divulged no further details about the child support (amounts, timing, duration, etc.) I basically told her that mommy already gets help, and that she needs to figure the rest of it out herself, and shouldn't be sharing that information with them.

    Then, I emailed my ex and told her about the things the kids were saying. At first, she was furious, but I reminded her that I was merely relaying what the kids were saying about her house, and that it was unfair that the kids would be burdened with those details. She didn't really have a rebuttal for that. (that, and the fact that there were barely any clean clothes)

    You can tell your daughter that you don't approve of mommy talking with her about those things, and also indicate that by email to your ex. In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with that. You are not insulting or slagging the mom, and you are not engaging on the specifics of those topics, you are simply making sure that your daughter understands that some things are not appropriate for parents to discuss with children.

    I don't know if there is much else you can do.

    Comment


    • #3
      I don't think you're being doormat-ish. Mom is sharing information inappropriately, and you need to resist the temptation to respond by doing the same things yourself (which it sounds like you're doing, so good for you).

      When my kid was your kid's age and was bringing home similar stories about "daddy said". Here are a couple of possibilities for your situation:

      "Hmm. That's kind of odd. I don't know why mommy said that. Maybe she was just having a bad day".

      "Mama and daddy both love you very much, so we made an agreement that we would do our best to co-operate taking care of you. The judge helped us write down our agreement, so we both understand how we're going to look after you. That's what judges do, they help people make agreements".

      "I'm glad you love mommy so much, and she loves you too. You've got two parents you can love, me and mommy".

      "Grownups sometimes feel sad when they miss someone they love, but they have ways to help themselves feel less sad. I know mommy misses you when you're with me, but she also has lots of stuff she can do so she doesn't feel so sad".

      Concerning the "just girls" stuff: some of that is developmentally appropriate at D7's age when she's trying to figure out gender identity and what it means that she's a girl. My daughter at the same age declared that our home was "girls only, no boys allowed, not even a boy cat", and had a lot to say about how she only liked girl things, not boy things, and "you and me are both girls, mama". She got over it in due time. As long as the "just us girls" behavior is confined to superficial stuff like clothes and makeup and sparkly things, I think it's harmless. If it's used as an excuse for keeping secrets from you or "your dad won't understand because he's a boy", then it can become a problem.

      Curious - why are you trying to change her name? If she's expressing attachment or anxiety issues, being told to use a different name (different from her mother, I presume) may not be the best thing for her right now. Her name is part of her self, so I'd lay off that one. (When my daughter was going through her "girls only" phase, she wanted to use only my last name and not her father's - I told her she could change her name when she was grown up, but she needed to keep the name she was born with for now).

      Final thought - is there a Rainbows programme in your city or area? This is a ten-week evening programme for kids (with parents meeting separately in their own group) to help them process family change, mainly divorce but also kids whose parents have passed away or had other disruptions. There's a structured curriculum, and it's great for enabling kids to meet others in similar situations. My daughter did it when she was your daughter's age and it was really beneficial for her to see she wasn't the only one, and giving her ways to talk about her feelings. Kids can do the programme at any time, and can come back more than once if they're going through difficulties. (I thought the parent group was pretty lame, to be honest - we made collages out of magazines to show our sad days and our happy days - but it was worth sitting through it because the kids' group was so beneficial).

      ETA - I also endorse Straittohell's suggestion of letting your ex know what D7 is saying. I did the same thing. I framed it as "I'm a bit concerned because our kid has been telling me xyz. I think she must have misunderstood something that she overheard. I wonder if you know where this came from. I don't want kid to be feeling anxious or worried because of xyz". Ex got mad at first, but he got the message and the inappropriate overshares decreased after that.
      Last edited by stripes; 09-05-2014, 12:10 PM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks all for suggestions so far. Will see if Rainbow programme can be done by NCP+child alone (somehow I doubt it).

        Now that court stuff is done, perhaps I can risk communicating with mom directly/carefully on the 'oversharing' stuff.

        I'm hoping to have her last name include both of ours (as it would have been done if I had been able to attend at her birth) -- as does her close maternal 9yo female cousin. First tried thru OC (which took 2y), who indicated they did not have jurisdiction, and referred it to SC without prejudice once other issues settled (which took another year). Do it too early, and it is 'irrelevant', too late and it is 'confusing'... can't win!

        It's SOO hard not to descend...

        Comment


        • #5
          I like Stripes' ideas as well. Stripes' probably doesn't agree with my approach, and it is understandable, because it can be considered pushing the boundaries of assertiveness. It is a tough balance to strike, as you can either risk as being perceived as sinking to her level, or get side-swiped by a slow, inexorable brainwashing process that gradually turns your daughter against you.

          There are a couple of users on this board here who have had it happen to them slowly over time, and a number of them have noted that they might have leaned too far in the direction of being 'the better person', only to get walked over.

          Keep your focus on having a good relationship with your daughter, but I highly recommend being very assertive in pointing out to her that you are choosing to NOT talk about those things with her because you don't think it is appropriate. When she asks why mommy DOES like to constantly talk about such things, all you have to do is say:

          "I don't know why, it is a question you will have to ask her. All I know if that I believe these things shouldn't be discussed with kids."

          By pointing out your disagreement with the very concept of such things being raised by mommy, you are avoiding the mess of engaging every single little toxic point that is being raised, and will hopefully be seen in a better light by your daughter.

          Yes, I would definitely raise it with your ex. However, I suggest that you supply the transcripts of the conversations with your daughter, and avoid any commentary about the content. Simply say:

          "Hey, (ex's name), I just wanted to let you know about some of the things that D7 has been saying to me" Then, list what was said, and only state at the end.

          "I told D7 that I did not think it was appropriate for mommy to share that kind of stuff with her, and did not discuss anything else. I hope that you will agree that we need to keep her out of this, and protect her from our problems. Thanks"

          Here is one more personal example. One day my 5 year son wanted to speak to his mom on the phone. We were driving, so I put it up on speaker phone. My ex was delighted to hear from him, and he said that he missed her, which was understandable because it was day 6 of the usual 7 day rotation. Then, she said:

          "Oh, buddy, I miss you too. Don't worry, you only HAVE to be at your daddy's for one more day, and then you GET to come over to my house."

          I let the call wrap up, and then sent her an email indicating that, regardless of her intention, I didn't appreciate her using the word "Have to", because it implied obligation. I reminded her that when I send the kids over to her house, I remind them that they are "getting" to go to mommy's house, and that I am happy that they get to see her. Naturally, she ignored the email, but I never heard that kind of language used again. I have no idea if she intended for it to come out that way, but it was a good reminder of how little things like that can matter.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Straittohell View Post
            Keep your focus on having a good relationship with your daughter, but I highly recommend being very assertive in pointing out to her that you are choosing to NOT talk about those things with her because you don't think it is appropriate. When she asks why mommy DOES like to constantly talk about such things, all you have to do is say:

            "I don't know why, it is a question you will have to ask her. All I know if that I believe these things shouldn't be discussed with kids."

            By pointing out your disagreement with the very concept of such things being raised by mommy, you are avoiding the mess of engaging every single little toxic point that is being raised, and will hopefully be seen in a better light by your daughter.
            ^^ Great approach. The OP's kid may be a little young now, but soon she will be appreciate that grownups have different opinions and see things in different ways. "There's kids' stuff and there's grownup stuff and I think that's grownup stuff, so we're not going to get into it". Then change the subject. And "I'm not sure why mommy does xyz" is a very good line to use, as long as you don't dwell (or let the kid dwell) on how strange it is that mommy is doing xyz. Just note it and move on.

            Comment

            Our Divorce Forums
            Forums dedicated to helping people all across Canada get through the separation and divorce process, with discussions about legal issues, parenting issues, financial issues and more.
            Working...
            X