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  • Disorganized/Obstructionist ex - options?

    Folks - my STBX (separated 2 1/2 years)and I wrapped up mediation and both received our memorandum of understanding. That was a month ago. As suggested by the mediator, we both forwarded our respective copies to our lawyer. I did immediately, and assumed my ex did as well.

    I then was asked to sign off on the Form13-Financial Statement, and my lawyers office sent copies to the lawyer that my ex listed to both the mediator and I. The following Monday I get a call from my lawyers office stating that the lawyer she listed is not even retained by her. When I called my ex about this, she claimed surprise at the cost and concept of a retainer, and sought other options like Justice.net as well as a family layer her brother deals with.

    She said she'd emailed a lawyer for retainer cost (Tuesday , I believe), and when I suggested Thursday that she should follow up, she blew me off and hung up on me. All through the entire process, she has had no sense of urgency or any desire to be knowledgeable on the process. It's been a half-*ssed effort to say the least, and everything's taken much longer than it should.

    I honestly don't know if she's being deliberately obstructionist, or simply disorganized. I'm not asking for anyone here to tell me which, but I'm trying to get a feel for my options.

    As I understand it, once the financials are sworn and exchanged by each party, one of our lawyers will draw up the separation agreement (we agreed to share the cost), then we file for divorce. This is the path I prefer, as it keeps costs down.

    However, I do not want this dragging on. I just want it done so I can move on with my new relationship. I've been cooperative, generous and agreeable in negotiations thus far, but am frustrated by her delays. Should she be putting up roadblocks, I'm thinking of my plan B.

    That Plan B would be to ask my lawyer to draw up the separation agreement based on the memorandum of understanding, and file for divorce. How would that work procedurally? I know she'd be very hard pressed to afford a legal battle, and I'm not keen on it myself, but I just want this over.

    Thoughts....? Other options?

  • #2
    The path you are considering looks like it will just increase time, legal costs, and frustration.

    Your ex will not take steps to complete the process unless she wants to, or has serious motivation to.

    If she wanted to end this, she would have.

    Having your lawyer draw up documents and send endless letters is just causing you more expense. Your ex will likely just ignore them.

    I hope you are not making these "suggestions" to her in conversation. She is feeling pressured and is shutting down. I do suggest you back off for a couple of weeks.

    In a couple of weeks, I suggest a polite, low-key, business-like email stating that it is time to wrap up the separation agreement and can she provide a date for signature. Period.

    If she does not respond, you cannot force her to sign anything. Sending endless letters from your lawyer will just add up to thousands of dollars. If it were me, I would send one letter, about 3 weeks after the first, stating that if she is not willing to settle, then you have no recourse other than to go to court. I know you don't want to do that, but she will need a push.

    Comment


    • #3
      Thank you, Mess, for your reply. And no, I have not discussed any of this with her, though she is aware I'm frustrated.

      I would have thought her motivation to be clear, as her spousal support portion would rise significantly after the agreement is in force, as opposed to the interim amounts I'm giving her now. I can't help but wonder however, that her demotivation has something to new with my new relationship.

      Regardless, should she continue to ignore/stall, and I have to go with plan B, how does that process typically play out?: I was under the impression that once filed, she had 30 days to respond, otherwise the divorce is deemed uncontested and granted.

      Comment


      • #4
        Remember that once SS is established, it is not uncommon for it to be retroactive back to the date of separation. If you short-paid her, she could be entitled to the difference. Unfortunately delaying matters won't help either of you, but it certainly will benefit the lawyers.

        I'd recommend trying to put things in a simple spread sheet, outlying both of your costs since separation. She very well might be 'star-struck' by her lawyer and merely doing what he has recommended, promising her a big settlement if she does what he tells her to do.

        Always try to look at things from her perspective, keeping in mind the sort of information and guidance she possibly is receiving.

        If the two of you have assets then you can be assured that there is someone out there that has designs on these assets (billable hours).

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by arabian View Post
          Remember that once SS is established, it is not uncommon for it to be retroactive back to the date of separation.
          Only if it is indefinate. I understand that this was your situation and you see it from that perspective.

          In a short to medium marriage there is no reason whatsoever to expect that SS will be indefinate. For a 10 year marriage it may likely be 5 years.

          5 years is 5 years. If it it is retroactive to the separation date, it is still 5 years. If it begins from the settlement date, or date of a court order, it is still 5 years.

          Comment


          • #6
            I'm referring to calculating arrears and not length of term.

            If one "dogs it" and avoids paying the correct amount, the arrears do not get excused or go away. SS is calculated from separation date. A simple example would be:

            Mary and Joe file separation in April 2013. Mary pays Joe 3k/month. Trial, 2 years later, determines SS to be 5k for the next 5 yrs. SS is calculated from date of separation so Mary has to pay Joe 2k x 24 months in arrears on top of 5k monthly SS.

            In this case, Mary should have put aside money for arrears.

            SS is negotiated and not automatic like CS. Judge's order stipulates how, when, how much arrears will be awarded.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Javaddict View Post

              Regardless, should she continue to ignore/stall, and I have to go with plan B, how does that process typically play out?: I was under the impression that once filed, she had 30 days to respond, otherwise the divorce is deemed uncontested and granted.
              From my experience, not quite. I did this self-representing (in Alberta). After having papers (the Statement of Claim for Divorce) served on my ex (and obtaining an affidavit of service from the person who served the papers), he then had 30 days to contest the divorce. At the end of the 30 days, I had to complete a document called a "Noting in Default". This doesn't mean the divorce is granted - it just meant that I was now free to proceed with requesting a divorce from the court. I then had to complete an Affidavit of Applicant (basically establishing that I had standing to request a divorce, i.e. that I was legally married, that my ex and I had been separated for over a year, etc) and a Divorce Judgment (there were also a few more documents, but I can't remember what they were now). If kids are involved, you'll also need to complete child support worksheets and (in Alberta) confirmation that you've completed a Parenting After Separation course.

              This last document is what you have to hash out with your ex, basically transposing the elements of your separation agreement that you want to keep in the judgment and adding other items covering everything from equalization to support to custody. This is what takes up all the lawyer time. If both you and your ex can agree on what should be in the judgment, you both sign it and it goes with all the other documents go before a judge, who can either grant the divorce by signing the judgment, or send the documents back if s/he believes there's something either procedurally or substantively wrong. Judgments can go back and forth with judges several times.

              If you and your ex can't agree on what should be in the divorce judgment, I believe you can spend a lot more money asking a judge to decide for you. Fortunately I didn't have to go that far as I was able to hash out an acceptable divorce judgment with my ex, though not without a lot of time and misery.

              So the short answer is - if you serve her with papers and she doesn't respond in 30 days, the divorce is not automatically granted. It just means you are cleared to go ahead applying for the divorce, which could still take months/years to be granted.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by arabian View Post
                I'm referring to calculating arrears and not length of term..
                Spousal support is not an automatic entitlement, the way child support is an entitlemetn of the children.

                If 5 years of support are owed, they may be paid when the amount is ordered, in a lump sum, or year by year. 5 years is 5 years.

                If the amount is indefinate, then arrears are owed. if it is not indefinate, then it begins when the order is made. That shouldn't be too hard to understand.

                Comment


                • #9
                  It all depends on what is negotiated my friend. Nothing is automatic when it comes to SS.

                  No it's not too hard to understand.

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                  • #10
                    Thanks all for your input and support. I've drafted an email to her to ask for an update. All she needs to do is retain a lawyer to review the Memorandum of Understanding, and to quote her on drafting the separation agreement. This isn't rocket science.

                    My fear is that she's deliberately dragging her feet, in order to hurt me, and all I want is for this to be DONE.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Unfortunately, it will probably take a lot longer than you expect. Coming to agreement on what should go into the divorce order can take months, even with two motivated parties; getting from a MOU to a separation agreement to a divorce order can involve many detours along the way, to say nothing of the administrative time it takes for the order to be issued once everyone's in agreement. It took me well over a year from having a signed separation agreement to being divorced.

                      Your ex probably doesn't have the same sense of urgency about finishing it up that you do, and why should she? She has no obligation to make this a priority in her life. If you are patient and stick with it, you *will* have your divorce eventually, it will just take longer than you want.

                      If your new relationship is putting pressure on you to finalize this (consciously or not), you may want to have a frank talk about his/her expectations.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Assuming she starts to play ball, what are the specific steps that get me to the divorce decree?
                        I've done my Form 13.1 and my lawyer's reviewed the MoU.

                        I assume her's will eventually do the same, then one of our respective lawyers will do up the Separation Agreement...

                        ...and then what happens?

                        Is it possible to go from a MoU to a decree without the separation agreement in the middle?

                        Comment

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