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  • Postsecondary costs

    Hi, I have a question regarding postsecondary costs for my stepdaughter. My husband and his ex signed a legal agreement this past summer and my stepdaughter started college in Sept. In the agreement my husband, his ex and their daughter are to split postsecondary costs 1/3 each as the daughter has a part-time job and has been working there for 3 years making appr. $900/month. My stepdaughter lives at home with her mom, has no expenses at all, and mom recieves full guideline child support. My stepdaughter has about $3000 saved in her bank account and also applied to OSAP for a loan. She recieved $3400 in OSAP and just over $2000 in grants. Total college costs are $4800 for the year. Mom wants us to split the total college costs of $4800 3 ways. But my husband and I feel that we should apply the grants to the costs first ($4800-$2000) and split the result ($2800) 3 ways. Mom feels that her daughter should be able to use her grants for whatever she likes. Obviously we would love to contribute as much as we could but unfortunately it is going to be hardship to come up with any amount given our low income. Between what we are proposing to pay ($930 each from mom and dad) and her savings and osap and grants that leaves daughter with $10260 and her total schooling costs including transportation cost $4800 (plus we already bought her a brand new computer). That will leave her $5460 in her bank account plus ongoing salary from her job and zero expenses for her. So money won't be an issue, she shouldn't even have to dip into her OSAP loan. Anyway, who is right, should the grants be deducted first and THEN the remainder split? The separation agreement doesn't specify and yes, they probably should have included these things in the agreement but they didn't.

  • #2
    I think this is the clause you are looking for:

    Family Law Act - O. Reg. 391/97

    (3) Subject to subsection (4), in determining the amount of an expense referred to in subsection (1), the court must take into account any subsidies, benefits or income tax deductions or credits relating to the expense, and any eligibility to claim a subsidy, benefit or income tax deduction or credit relating to the expense.
    Not to mention the tax credit the child would receive.

    Comment


    • #3
      Is there any wording anywhere that specifically mentions postsecondary costs and deducting grants/scholarships/bursaries first before the total expense to be shared is identified? I would like to have something to copy and paste and email to her, otherwise she just argues and argues and threatens court. I'm sure I read it somewhere specifically before but just can't find it now. I have a very hard time believing a judge would allow the daughter to just keep her grants and NOT use them to pay down tuition. I mean, that's what they are FOR, right? Obviously school isn't costing $4800 anymore it is only costing $2800 after the government grants.

      Comment


      • #4
        You'd likely have to find caselaw through CanLii on that.

        Comment


        • #5
          One case I found stated...

          [36] I calculate the respondent’s contribution to the costs of Maciej’s education to be 75% of the total amount not covered by OSAP and his own summer employment. The shortfall being $3,000, the respondent’s portion is $2,250 for the 2002-03 school year. This figure assumes no effect on Maciej’s OSAP eligibility and that the tuition fees remain the same. In the event that Maciej receives less from OSAP or the tuition costs are higher, the amount shall be adjusted accordingly for the 2003-04 and 2004-05 school years.
          Whole case is here
          Date: 2004-01-06
          Docket: 600/97 URL:CanLII - 2004 CanLII 12571 (ON CJ)

          Many more cases are available...

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks, I will search through!

            Comment


            • #7
              Here is another case:

              [30] If both boys remain at home Tablesupport shall continue and post-secondary education expenses shall be paid as follows:
              (e) Tuition, books, supplies, commuting costs totalled and disclosed on or before May 31. (with documentation as may be available, estimates)
              (f) Deduct government contribution to RESP and interest earned by RESP
              (g) Deduct scholarships, grants, bursaries received
              (h) Deduct imputed income of student
              (i) Divide remainder 77/23


              [31] If one boy attends university away from home Table support is reduced from support for 2 children to support for 1 plus 1/3 the difference between one and two. This amount is to be paid monthly throughout the year but reflects that one child is only home for 1/3 the year.
              (j) Tuition, books, supplies, commuting costs totalled and disclosed on or before May 31. (with documentation as may be available, estimates)
              (k) Residence or other accomodation and living expenses
              (l) Deduct government contribution to RESP and interest earned by RESP
              (m) Deduct scholarships, grants, bursaries received
              (n) Deduct imputed income of student
              (o) Divide remainder 77/23
              CanLII - 2005 CanLII 4441 (ON SC)

              Comment


              • #8
                I have been through this issue already with lack of specific wording in an agreement over post secondary costs... we have gone the legal route 3 years back and the cost to be split in our case was/is the balance after all grants and subsidies are deducted ..that includes OSAP grants ( she can't use them for what she wants they are given to lessen the cost of education) plus don't forget to include the 30% tuition grant which $770 a year for college student if you haven't included that already- plus the income tax refund which will be anywhere from $400-$1200 depended on costs and program. Plus we pay our portion directly to the school when fees are due,not the other parent. Also we get a copy of the OSAP forms the mother/daughter submitted to see exactly what the break down will be as far as grants/loan ratio.
                Also the cost of the computer should be split between all 3 of you as well since it is a college expense.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by sundaysmom View Post
                  I have been through this issue already with lack of specific wording in an agreement over post secondary costs... we have gone the legal route 3 years back and the cost to be split in our case was/is the balance after all grants and subsidies are deducted ..that includes OSAP grants ( she can't use them for what she wants they are given to lessen the cost of education) plus don't forget to include the 30% tuition grant which $770 a year for college student if you haven't included that already- plus the income tax refund which will be anywhere from $400-$1200 depended on costs and program. Plus we pay our portion directly to the school when fees are due,not the other parent. Also we get a copy of the OSAP forms the mother/daughter submitted to see exactly what the break down will be as far as grants/loan ratio.
                  Also the cost of the computer should be split between all 3 of you as well since it is a college expense.
                  Agree with everything, except the bold portion. A computer/lap top is not necessary for post secondary (unless it specifically lists this in course material). The school with have computer labs that the child can access for computer related assignments. If the child decides she want a lap top/computer, that is her prerogative, but not necessarily something either parent has to pay for.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Berner_Faith View Post
                    Agree with everything, except the bold portion. A computer/lap top is not necessary for post secondary (unless it specifically lists this in course material). The school with have computer labs that the child can access for computer related assignments. If the child decides she want a lap top/computer, that is her prerogative, but not necessarily something either parent has to pay for.
                    I'm in school right now and cannot disagree more. Unless you are able to access the school library or computer labs 24/7 (and in some schools you can but it's not always practical) then a student needs a computer and internet access of their own. I would agree that if they have a full desktop computer at home, they don't necessarily need a laptop as well, but one or the other is definately needed. You can't research, write, study, collaborate with groups properly without a computer and internet access at home. I would recommend to anyone to have laptop rather than a desktop unless you are studying video editing or something equal resource intensive. The option of doing homework on a break in the cafeteria or Tim Hortons or on the bus or the train is a huge advantage. But even apart from the advantage of working on the bus or wherever, it is an absolute necessity to have a computer at home. You can't stop working or studying just because it's 1am on a Sunday.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Mess I can agree that having their own lap top or desk top computer is handy, but it is certainly not necessary... what about the kids in post secondary who cannot afford computers/lap tops? They utilize that ones provided by the school.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Ok thankyou, the computer we bought her was a laptop, split 3 ways between the two parents and the student. Yes, the school has a computer lab, and there is a computer at home, but we did agree that most of her homework would be done in the quietness of her bedroom and a laptop would be best. This was never an issue.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You can buy a netbook for $200. I'm not saying you need a $1200 laptop, but you need to be able to do your work at home. If you can't do homework you won't get very far in school.

                          If a student can't afford it, if they are that bad off, then they qualify for full OSAP. The amount loaned is to cover needs like books and laptops. If a student "can't afford it" they are just guilty of bad budgeting. But yes, it is a necessary expense and if you are splitting the expenses then it has to be included.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Mess View Post
                            You can buy a netbook for $200. I'm not saying you need a $1200 laptop, but you need to be able to do your work at home. If you can't do homework you won't get very far in school.

                            If a student can't afford it, if they are that bad off, then they qualify for full OSAP. The amount loaned is to cover needs like books and laptops. If a student "can't afford it" they are just guilty of bad budgeting. But yes, it is a necessary expense and if you are splitting the expenses then it has to be included.
                            I managed to finish high school and university without a lap top, wihout a computer, in fact. Not sure what you mean by not getting far in school withou a lap top.

                            Ridiculous premise, lots of people don't have access to computers. University libraries, common areas, etc. have access to computers.

                            20 years ago Phd students did not have lap tops, they still completed their studies...it had nothing to do with owning a lap top.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Mark1968 View Post
                              I managed to finish high school and university without a lap top, wihout a computer, in fact. Not sure what you mean by not getting far in school withou a lap top.

                              Ridiculous premise, lots of people don't have access to computers. University libraries, common areas, etc. have access to computers.

                              20 years ago Phd students did not have lap tops, they still completed their studies...it had nothing to do with owning a lap top.
                              Did you graduate last May?

                              I am in post sec right now, half my course material is only accessable online via Blackboard.

                              If I have to write something, which I do approximately 6 hours a day, I have to do it on a word processor. I can do it in the library at school until 6 pm weekdays. I guess in your days getting your Phd you didn't need to write anything on a weekend, or at 1 am?

                              I am required to submit my essays to an online site that checks for plagurism. Many of my professors also prefer that we email assignments or submit them through Blackboard. Again, yes I can do that in the library - up until it closes. My assignment deadlines are generally midnight.

                              I'm sure, according to you, that I should have them done days early and submit at 3 in the afternoon. Unfortunately at least half my major projects are collaborative and I can only complete work when I get my teams' submissions. Guess what? They email them at 11 pm.

                              There are a thousand other reasons why I need a computer and internet access. This isn't 1980s any more. Computers are expected to be used and course material, assignments, group work, required submission formats, are all built around the assumption that students will be using computers with internet access.

                              I'm glad you were able to get through your degree with a pencil and paper. A few generations earlier they were using quills and ink bottles. You had it pretty slack. I suppose you want me do spreadsheets by hand too, using 17th century tables? Or am I allowed to use a slide rule? Have you ever taken a course that uses autocad? Or media arts? Relied on electronic databases for research material? Probably not from the way you imply you did your homework.

                              Comment

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