Is there a minimum amount of access time for joint custody?

[TODAD]

Is there a minimum amount of access time for joint custody? I've been offered one overnights per week - Friday 6PM to Saturday 9AM. Is that even reasonable? What's the most common amount for those of you not getting 50/50? What's reasonable to expect?

[billm]

I believe the most common when not 50/50 is 'EOW' - every other weekend plus every wednesday.

Sleep over Friday/Saturday - not sure about sleep over Sunday/Wednesday.

[TODAD]

I believe the most common when not 50/50 is 'EOW' - every other weekend plus every wednesday.

Sleep over Friday/Saturday - not sure about sleep over Sunday/Wednesday.

That's it? 52 overnights per year? How do they expect decisions to be made jointly and in the best interest of the child when you can't even get to know the child?

[Mess]

EOW is a 1950's approach to custody that unfortunately hasn't gone away.

Typically it also includes a Wednesday, either dinner and return to the other parent or an overnight. It really reduces the relationship to "visitor".

How do "they" expect decision making? In practice you would be looking at the parent with primary residence to be outlining the options and reasons for decisions, with the access parent being able to make comments and suggestions instead of being out of the loop altogether. It means having say over change of religion, choice of school and medical treatments. More than anything it means being informed. How often does a child change religions?

[TODAD]

Joint custody is still impotant, don't turn it down if you cant get shared custody because it can help you eventually.

Thanks for the support. I won't turn it down. I am trying to find a way to get more, even if I can't get 50/50. Anyone else know of any other common arrangements that is less than 50/50 but more than just EOW?

[danzuchy]

OCL and my lawyer and the Judge all stated the same- Joint and shared are the same. No legal difference between the two. Time is decided seperate from the actual definition of custody. 50/50 is rare unless you both agree. If it's OCL or forbid a Judge, it rarely goes 50-50. You'll see a 60/40 split.
OCl consider Joint and Shared the same. Some investigators use Joint, some use shared.

There is no minimum but the OCL and Judges usually like to have a more or less stable envirornment during the school year (school days) but usually split the holidays evenly.

Most experienced OCL investigators will recommend 70/30 during school year and 50/50 on holidays. This works to 60/40 or 55/45 depending on how the OCl or you wwork it out.

They don't like 50-50 during school year (except holidays).
What IS important, more so than "joint" or "shared" the actual parenting plan that will be agreed to or enforced. It outlines everything including medical, religion etc.

The OCL also recommends tons of stuff. They just don't write a one page report saying "joint". The actual detail what joint means and what time the children will spend with each. Your PP will be the same- it will be a detailed document outlining how this child(ren) will be raised.

Don't knock the 70/30 and 50/50 holiday. It provides time with both parents but also provides stability during school days. The parent taking 70/30 during the school year will eventual see that "primary caregiver" also means they foot most of the load and try to change it to 50/50 once they realize what happened.

My suggestions is do 70/30 or 65-35 during the school days and 50/50 Holidays. This is a good one I find.

Example-
Summer-50/50
March Break- 50/50
Christmas- 50/50
Etc.

[TODAD]

Thanks for the suggestion Danzuchy. I think it's a good one and it's quite reasonable. I assume when you say 70/30 during the school year, you mean Fri 6PM till Sun 6PM with one parent, and all other times with the other? If so, is it easy for the other parent to agree? He/she is losing all the weekends during the school year to the other parent. Having said that, personally, I would not mind if I am the one to give up the weekends, I see how this arrangement is in the best interest of the child. But it's still a tough pill to swallow.

[dadtotheend]

Friday 6pm until Saturday 9am is a total farce.

Thanks for letting me feed my kid and put him to bed.

I'll see you in the morning. And don't be late!! It's Saturday and we have things to do!!

[Gary M]

Is there a minimum amount of access time for joint custody? I've been offered one overnights per week - Friday 6PM to Saturday 9AM. Is that even reasonable? What's the most common amount for those of you not getting 50/50? What's reasonable to expect?

Unless a Judge has ordered this arrangement for some reason or another, this is so far from reasonable as to be funny. Hilarious. Laughable, even.

Thank the other party's lawyer for the giggle and ask them to get back to you with a reasonable starting point.

A typical minimum access arrangement would be 1 night/week and a full weekend every other week. MINIMUM

Did I mention MINIMUM?

You could always counter with the same, in reverse....

The best arrangements divide the time equally, with minimal disruption. I've seen 7/7 with parents who can put their kids' needs ahead of their own, and I've seen 4/3/3/4 work well as well. IMHO, this should be both the goal and the starting point, but there's no money to be made unless "negotiations" can be dragged on and on and on and on.

Cheers!

Gary

[TODAD]

Unless a Judge has ordered this arrangement for some reason or another, this is so far from reasonable as to be funny. Hilarious. Laughable, even.

Thank the other party's lawyer for the giggle and ask them to get back to you with a reasonable starting point.

A typical minimum access arrangement would be 1 night/week and a full weekend every other week. MINIMUM

Did I mention MINIMUM?

You could always counter with the same, in reverse....

The best arrangements divide the time equally, with minimal disruption. I've seen 7/7 with parents who can put their kids' needs ahead of their own, and I've seen 4/3/3/4 work well as well. IMHO, this should be both the goal and the starting point, but there's no money to be made unless "negotiations" can be dragged on and on and on and on.

Cheers!

Gary

Thanks Gary,

In your typical minimum arrangement, are you saying 1 overnight each week (say Wed after school to Thurs drop off at school) plus a Fri after school to Mon drop off at school. In such a case, we are talkling 5 nights of sleepover every two weeks, correct?

[today]

Hey TODAD, why are u looking at this type of access and not a 50/50 split?

[TODAD]

Hey TODAD, why are u looking at this type of access and not a 50/50 split?

Oh, I am looking at 50/50, in fact, I think I will respond back with what danzuchy suggested, child with me during school and 50/50 outside of school.

I just want to know what's the worst case is for me. I can't live with 52 nights a year.

[Gary M]

In your typical minimum arrangement, are you saying 1 overnight each week (say Wed after school to Thurs drop off at school) plus a Fri after school to Mon drop off at school. In such a case, we are talkling 5 nights of sleepover every two weeks, correct?

In the minimum parenting scenario I spoke of, yes - those are the numbers - 4 or 5 nights/2 weeks.

I do not suggest for a second, though, that such a minimal amount of time is sufficient for an involved parent. As someone (Mess?) said (but more eloquently), that arrangement is a holdover from the days when a father's parenting job was done once he has donated some chromosomes.

Cheers!

Gary

[danzuchy]

Thanks for the suggestion Danzuchy. I think it's a good one and it's quite reasonable. I assume when you say 70/30 during the school year, you mean Fri 6PM till Sun 6PM with one parent, and all other times with the other? If so, is it easy for the other parent to agree? He/she is losing all the weekends during the school year to the other parent. Having said that, personally, I would not mind if I am the one to give up the weekends, I see how this arrangement is in the best interest of the child. But it's still a tough pill to swallow.

No. That's not 70-30. Fri- 6pm to Sun 6pm is more like a 80-20 spit. It's only 6-8 days a month depending on the month.

I am speaking of something like:

Thursday pick up from School to Sunday 7pm- Week One
Wed. pick up from school to drop off Friday- Week two

All holidays split 50-50.

I wouldn't take nothing less.

Some guys here are jaded and posting to be a smart ass. Family Law is insanity and there is no such thing as a MINIMUM or what not.

If the two parents can't agree a Judge will "agree" for you. If that happens it can be a disaster for one parent or the other. OCL and other independent investigators like to see stability during the school year and split holidays 50-50 as it is easier for the child during off school time. Ask OCL, a Judge etc. that you want an exact 50-50 split all year round. See how that goes. It won't go well for you.

I could be wrong but show me one case where a Judge ruled down a 50-50 split (i.e one week each) to any warring couple. I never seen it .

[danzuchy]

In the minimum parenting scenario I spoke of, yes - those are the numbers - 4 or 5 nights/2 weeks.

I do not suggest for a second, though, that such a minimal amount of time is sufficient for an involved parent. As someone (Mess?) said (but more eloquently), that arrangement is a holdover from the days when a father's parenting job was done once he has donated some chromosomes.

Cheers!

Gary

Too bad Mess doesn't decide. It's a Judge who decides. A father can "push" all he wants, unless the wife is a total nut job or a real careless parent the odds are , during the school year, that's what one parent is getting. 5 nights/ 2 weeks.

Prove me wrong- but in a contested divorce I don't see any one getting better.