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  • My Intro

    Hi I'm new here.

    My story. Dated someone for a while. Briefly moved in for a while. Not long enough to be considered common law. We broke up. When I was moving out she informed me she was pregnant and presented me with papers granting her sole custody of her unborn child and absolving me of support. The breakup was quite rough on me emotionally. After moving out, I learned from her friend that she had a thing going on with our landlord and someone from our gym.

    So I moved on not looking back, married, started a family. Moved on from my sucky dead-end job into a couple of good jobs. Though on paper I made a decent wage, we do struggle financially as one of my three kids with my wife is disabled and we cannot afford all of the therapy, and have been informed that the wait line for government paid services is 5+ years.

    I was served with papers recently. So after not being in this girls life for 15 years she wants full table support, extra curriculars, retroactive support, and me to pay the kids way through university.

  • #2
    Welcome -- As a newbie myself, I can tell you that the members in here are awesome.
    Are you positive that this child is yours? if not, im sure a DNA test would be my first thing to do....

    Comment


    • #3
      HEY MAN pay for your mistakes....

      She isnt going to get retroactive support probably unless she can prove why she didnt ask earlier.

      What is her income?
      What is yours?

      DNA test is a good idea since there is no in loco parentis. See if you can falsify your DNA results anyways.

      Comment


      • #4
        This sounds like a fishing expedition on the part of your ex. If you've had no contact with her or your daughter for 15 years, a judge is quite likely to ask your ex why she never attempted to obtain support until now. Mom would have been entitled to support earlier if she had sought it (the piece of paper "absolving" you of child support doesn't mean anything - Mom can't sign away a kid's right to be supported by both her parents), but if it's gone on this long, I think a judge is unlikely to order you to pay for the last 15 years, as Mom has evidently been able to raise the child without your contribution, and it's now water under the bridge,

        My understanding is when retroactive support is ordered, it is usually only retroactive to the date at which support was first sought (whether by serving you papers or contacting you in some other way).

        It sounds like you may be on the hook going forward for child support and S7 expenses (assuming this child really is yours). How much this will cost you depends on your income and your ex's. (I assume you know about the federal guideline tables). You may also have a case to claim that meeting your support obligations will cause you undue hardship, if you have three young children and a disabled wife, but my understanding is that the bar for undue hardship is pretty high. There are lots of threads about that on this site.

        On the positive side, this opens up the possibility for you to get to know your daughter and have your wife and children meet their "new" half-sister. Could be awkward, but could be very rewarding.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by stripes View Post
          On the positive side, this opens up the possibility for you to get to know your daughter and have your wife and children meet their "new" half-sister. Could be awkward, but could be very rewarding.
          At the risk of cynically stirring the pot, I would wager that this mom is the kind of person who is more than happy to demand money, but will fight like hell to prevent contact. Also wiling to bet that she has spent 15 years telling this kid that daddy left, daddy never paid a cent, daddy abandoned her, daddy's an asshole, etc. etc.

          Comment


          • #6
            Thanks Everyone. I've made a formal, written request already for a DNA test. The answer was "No. She walks, talks, and acts just like you" My legal response has a formal request for one.

            Her line 150 income is below the poverty line. She has two degrees, and no longer "works". She has held mid-level marketing jobs when we were together. She pulls in 80k in tax-free cash flow that doesn't hit an income tax return. Mine is higher, but I also spend a lot per month on therapy for my one child.

            This is ultimately the issue. Anything I have to pay is going to take-away from my other childs therapy. Consequently, I have to be all Mama Bear to protect his well-being.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Straittohell View Post
              At the risk of cynically stirring the pot, I would wager that this mom is the kind of person who is more than happy to demand money, but will fight like hell to prevent contact. Also wiling to bet that she has spent 15 years telling this kid that daddy left, daddy never paid a cent, daddy abandoned her, daddy's an asshole, etc. etc.
              Okay, based on exactly the same information that you have, I could claim that Dad is a self-centred jerk who dumped his girlfriend when she got pregnant with his child right out of school, and has taken no responsibility for that child, shown no interest in her, and gone on about his life like she didn't exist - but is now crying poor because Mom has wised up and is asking him to share the responsibilty for the daughter he abandoned.

              I'm probably wrong. So are you.

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Stripes - sorry its a disabled (autistic) child. My wife is fine and works.

                I'm aware that the general guideline for back support is up to 3 years. There's also a test on why she's waited for so long, that will temper a request for back support.

                Its bothersome that the guidelines seem to assume that each child exists in a vacuum. There should be a guideline indicated when theres 1 kid over there and three over here then the amount should be X.

                Given how poorly the end of the relationship went. I suspect the same thing as Straighttohell.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by stripes View Post
                  Okay, based on exactly the same information that you have, I could claim that Dad is a self-centred jerk who dumped his girlfriend when she got pregnant with his child right out of school, and has taken no responsibility for that child, shown no interest in her, and gone on about his life like she didn't exist - but is now crying poor because Mom has wised up and is asking him to share the responsibilty for the daughter he abandoned.

                  I'm probably wrong. So are you.
                  Maybe... but if this is true, I don't think she can claim to be all that broken up over the guy:

                  " The breakup was quite rough on me emotionally. After moving out, I learned from her friend that she had a thing going on with our landlord and someone from our gym."

                  Sorry, it just looks like she wanted nothing to do with him, and now just wants money. If she wanted the kid to have a relationship with him, she could have initiated that, and her request for support, a long time ago.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Well, it goes both ways. Either parent could have initiated a request or offer of support or expressed a desire for the father to be in the child's life over the last 15 years. But neither of them did. So now they have to work out the "new normal" for the next three years (at least - there's also postsecondary to think about).

                    I can imagine that this is a big shock to the OP - both the impending financial hit and the emotional stuff, how to relate to a daughter he hasn't seen in 15 years plus reawakening memories of a difficult breakup. I hope he's got some psychological support in addition to legal advice.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      So all along, based on your knowledge of the mother's infidelity and willingness to absolve you of child support, it was reasonable to believe that the child was not yours.

                      Now that this request has come, insist on the paternity test. The more your ex resists it, the more you can believe she's not sure herself and is grasping at straws. But if the child is yours after all, you are on the hook and you must make a family decision from there. My advice would be to try to get to know the teenager as well as start paying some CS, retro to the date you received the request. Offer table CS to start with, then once you get to know the girl, you'll know what is reasonable for section 7 expenses. Going to court to moan about how unfair it is based on your current family is probably just going to cost you legal fees.

                      This girl deserves to know that you didn't abandon her, that you want to love her, and that she has siblings to meet. She's probably going through a lot, if her mother has told her about approaching you.

                      Having this come out of the blue feels unfair to you, but try to get over feeling like a victim. The true victim in this is a teenager who has been denied a proper father figure and a father's affection and support by her mother all her life.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Rioe View Post
                        But if the child is yours after all, you are on the hook and you must make a family decision from there. My advice would be to try to get to know the teenager as well as start paying some CS, retro to the date you received the request. Offer table CS to start with, then once you get to know the girl, you'll know what is reasonable for section 7 expenses. Going to court to moan about how unfair it is based on your current family is probably just going to cost you legal fees.

                        This girl deserves to know that you didn't abandon her, that you want to love her, and that she has siblings to meet. She's probably going through a lot, if her mother has told her about approaching you.

                        Having this come out of the blue feels unfair to you, but try to get over feeling like a victim. The true victim in this is a teenager who has been denied a proper father figure and a father's affection and support by her mother all her life.
                        ^^^ Once again - we don't know this to be true. Maybe Mom deliberately kept Dad away from Kid. Maybe Dad made no effort at all to see Kid or support her in any way. Maybe both parents should have done better or done differently over the past decade and a half. Maybe there is no villain. It's pointless to attribute motives based on third-hand accounts from parties who have big investments in something that happened fifteen year ago.

                        What matters is that Dad has an obligation to financially support Kid (if Kid is indeed his, based on paternity), and that Kid should have the chance to get to know her biological father - in whatever way makes sense to her and her parents.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by stripes View Post
                          I can imagine that this is a big shock to the OP - both the impending financial hit and the emotional stuff, how to relate to a daughter he hasn't seen in 15 years plus reawakening memories of a difficult breakup. I hope he's got some psychological support in addition to legal advice.
                          Thank you. I have some divorced friends who have been divorced who have given me advice along the way. I found its tough to get a family lawyer in the city where she and the kid reside, a few werent willing to talk to me because I'm not local.

                          I haven't really spoken to a mental health professional about the whole scenario. I've spoken with friends but that's it.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Rioe View Post

                            Now that this request has come, insist on the paternity test. The more your ex resists it, the more you can believe she's not sure herself and is grasping at straws. But if the child is yours after all, you are on the hook and you must make a family decision from there. My advice would be to try to get to know the teenager as well as start paying some CS, retro to the date you received the request. Offer table CS to start with, then once you get to know the girl, you'll know what is reasonable for section 7 expenses. Going to court to moan about how unfair it is based on your current family is probably just going to cost you legal fees.
                            .
                            Not to be rude, I'm sure you're well meaning, but why would I offer to pay Table CS right off the bat? That's not negotiating. Table is a guideline, and my understanding is that less than half of all payors pay table amounts. Among my divorced friends only one of them pays or receives table, the rest see way less. The one who pays table has also has an extenuating arrangement with his ex.

                            Since the break up, she moved to another city within the province. Factor in that getting to know the kid involves me driving 6-7 hours each way for a weekend visit and running up hotel bills between gas hotel, and food a visit is going to cost $300-$400. To my lawyer, that's a case for reduced table, or I'd never be able to afford a visit. That's why my lawyer asked that my ex be held liable for costs of denied visits.

                            The section 7 expenses being requested, for extra curriculars exceed what we pay for extra-curriculars for all three of my children with my wife combined.

                            My lawyer believes that a judge will deny post-secondary or delay making a decision until the child is ready for post-secondary. I paid my own way through university. My ex ran up student loans and defaulted on them.

                            Part 2 is every dollar of CS will be coming out of money that is currently paying for my autistic son's therapy. So its taking from one need to pay for another. I have to live with my son's angry outbursts. I have to deal with his classroom issues - not my ex. The therapy has been helping him. I haven't had to pick him up early from school due to behaviour so far this year, he will sometimes present in class now.

                            My own expenses are not extravagant. We have 9 and 2 year old cars, live in an older house that needs some TLC, our grocery bills are higher than the normal family due to dietary needs within our household. We have had 3 family vacations in the 13 years that we've been together.

                            To be honest, if someone would say - ok the respondant has 4 kids. Table amount for 4 kids is $X. So support would be $X/4. I could live with that amount. Its more than I'd want to pay, but factors in the fact that I have other kids in the equation.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              nfcrever: In your first post you say that the mother "absolved you of support" - what exactly does that mean? Legal document drawn up and signed by both of you and filed in court somewhere?

                              I think it would be prudent of you to start a savings account and sock some money in there in the event that your lawyer is incorrect. I would strongly urge you to get a second legal opinion on this one because I find it hard to believe that a judge would tell you to intentionally ignore child support. I have no personal experience with child support matters whatsoever. However, I believe your lawyer should have told you that everything is always about "the best interests of the child."

                              Comment

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