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Offsey child support , tax law , how do I defend myself ?

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  • Offsey child support , tax law , how do I defend myself ?

    I have been trying to get CRA to recognize my role as an equal and supporting parent for a few years now and am now just weeks away from my tax court date.

    Background is separated since 2012 , joint and equal custody of 2 boys under the age of 16 . They do a 1 week at my house, 1 week at her house arrangement. Our third and oldest son (FT in school age 21 ) lives with me exclusively since 2015 .

    Our lawyer prepared separation agreement is riddled with vague phrases and omissions.

    One section says we each get to claim 1 child as an eligible dependent and we each get to claim 6 month’s worth of child tax credits each and every year.

    Another section says since I make a little bit more than she does, I pay her the net difference in child support ( a couple of hundred bucks a month )

    CRA says NO, since I pay , I get no CT credits and no EDC.

    I argue that we both pay, I just pay a little more. They don’t care .


    They site

    Verones v. Canada, 2013 FCA 69 (CanLII)


    So I go back to Family Court to try to get the agreement amended properly. Ex puts up a fight .

    For the last 14 months I have been trying to get my separation agreement changed in Family court , but there always seems to be something that gets in the way. ( i.e. : first opposing counsel not up to speed yet, then the financials get faxed to me are so dark, they cannot be read, then opposing counsel is no longer on the case because of non payment and holding the files hostage, lastly , we will do it in mediation sessions but of course it doesn’t get done and I am still waiting )

    I am now trying a procedural motion to try to get it heard last minute but no guarantees that will happen .

    If I do not get my motion to change heard in time , does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can defend myself in tax court ?

    Can I argue that my EX is purposely dragging this out because she knows I have to go to tax court as well ?

    If I get a decision from Family Court, 2 months after my tax court hearing , can I go back to tax court and re-open my appeal ?

    Surely the courts have run across this sort of thing before ?


    Is there a contrary argument to Verones v Canada ?

  • #2
    Search my threads... I posted it a while back.

    Comment


    • #3
      See: https://www.pushormitchell.com/2014/...port-payments/

      All answered there.

      Comment


      • #4
        Thank you for your reply. I did print your link and have read it many times . I do understand the premise but just am not sure exactly how I am supposed to go about dealing with the ammendment. I know I have to show money going both ways, I know not to reference the Federal guidelines and I know not to use the word offset.

        I guess I am concerned that even if Family Court allows my motion to change, if I do not write it up exactly correct that CRA will do whatever they want anyways and I will not get a second chance to " right the wrong ".
        From the research I have done it doesn't seem like CRA wants to give anyone paying child support the EDC benefit , no matter what .

        Comment


        • #5
          The separation agreement or court order should contain provisions requiring each parent to pay support to the other, and the parents should make separate payments even if there is overlap. This will ensure that section 118(5.1) of the Act is triggered and that both parents are eligible, even though only one parent may claim the credit.

          So each parent pays other through fro ?

          Comment


          • #6
            Parent A pays parent B $600
            Parent B pays parent A $500
            As a matter of convenience, parent A will transfer the amount of $ 100 to parent B.

            I believe this has been recommended in the past.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by blinkandimgone View Post
              As a matter of convenience, parent A will transfer the amount of $ 100 to parent B.
              .
              can someone confirm this works as opposed to each parent paying their full share? in terms of CRA

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by trinton View Post
                can someone confirm this works as opposed to each parent paying their full share? in terms of CRA
                It works. I helped two parents with the same issue. Its all technicalities in how the agreement is written. What was done was a separate agreement just for the purposes of tax filings was reached. But, there was no fight between these parents. Both had gotten denied to claim the child. Problem is now resolved with proper wording.

                As well, when both parents file they have to file what they are paying and getting in full. Not the difference on the offset. The agreement states that they will do this too.

                Other than stating the residence pattern (not the schedule in full) and the child support obligations and how they were paid. Nothing more and nothing less. Minimal information. Don't file the whole bloody agreement or court order.

                I am of the opinion that there should be 3 agreements and orders to simplify making changes.:

                1. Custody and access (pure no CS or Section 7 in there)
                2. Child Support and Section 7 for FRO/Other stuff.
                3. Tax Filing Agreement (For CRA)

                Good Luck!
                Tayken
                Last edited by Tayken; 11-09-2017, 09:36 AM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'll second Tayken on it's working. That wording is similar to how mine is written. Several times now CRA has denied me being eligible for the credits, but each time I dispute it with them, and they back down.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I too have been denied each year since 2013 and of course my ex and I didn't actually exchange payments to each other. I merely paid her the net difference.

                    Even though I have appealed each year , Revenue Canada always says " no , only you made payments , so you get nothing"

                    On another note, my agreement specifically says we are to split the child tax benefit with 6 months worth for her and 6 months worth for me .

                    Since I never received anything , can I sue her for half of what she received each year ?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      You don't sue her. It's not her mistake its CRA. you have the wording of your agreement adjusted so that it reflects the proper requirements, dated back to whenever the change took effect. You forward that to CRA with your application for retroactive benefits.

                      Its up to CRA to apply the benefits to you and adjust her account accordingly. They will recoup the money directly from her.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        they get child tax benefits and claim they need child support too. How much does it really cost to raise a child ? Apparently a percentage of your ex's income . so ladies,, the richer the guy you have a child with, the more child support you'll be able to collect if you guys seperate - and maybe spousal support too!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          so i just got off the phone with a free lawyer supplied thru work and she tells me that it doesn't matter anyways because the CRA only started to recognize that both parents might be able to claim the eligible dependant starting last year ?

                          she says even if i was able to go to court and get the original agreement changed to say that we both paid each other rather than offset , i could not get it to be retro back to 2013 because the tax law didnt exist back then.

                          can this be true or did i basically get what i didnt pay for ?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by excel View Post
                            so i just got off the phone with a free lawyer supplied thru work and she tells me that it doesn't matter anyways because the CRA only started to recognize that both parents might be able to claim the eligible dependant starting last year ?

                            she says even if i was able to go to court and get the original agreement changed to say that we both paid each other rather than offset , i could not get it to be retro back to 2013 because the tax law didnt exist back then.

                            can this be true or did i basically get what i didnt pay for ?
                            CRA can go back to collect money rightfully owed to you. I think there is a time limitation on it.

                            Both parents could claim it before last year, something changed last year,I think it was

                            The new Canada Child Benefit program replaced both the Universal Child Care Benefit (UCCB) and the Canada Child Tax Benefit (CCTB) programs, effective July 1, 2016.
                            Are you sure the lawyer you spoke to wasn't biased against moms ? It was a she wasn't it? I had a female lawyer before and .. man.. just please don't get me started on female lawyers representing dads.. the ones I have ran into anyways. They like to relate to your ex in the sense that they are a mom themselves... (puke)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanks, Trinton, for the entirely unhelpful posts.

                              Originally posted by excel View Post
                              so i just got off the phone with a free lawyer supplied thru work and she tells me that it doesn't matter anyways because the CRA only started to recognize that both parents might be able to claim the eligible dependant starting last year ?

                              she says even if i was able to go to court and get the original agreement changed to say that we both paid each other rather than offset , i could not get it to be retro back to 2013 because the tax law didnt exist back then.

                              can this be true or did i basically get what i didnt pay for ?
                              Try speaking with an accountant or a tax lawyer about the specifics if needed. But no, you can claim the eligible dependent before then. You may only be able to go back 13 months retroactively for CCTB, however someone in the field will be able to answer your question with more authority. It sounds like the person you spoke with either did not understand the situation and order or was not fully educated in the area. But hey...you get what you pay for

                              Comment

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