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  • Curious question

    I am currently having a debate with a friend at work about lottery winnings. Let's say a couple is separated for 2 or 3 years and one wins the lottery, is he or she entitled to half of the winnings or any part of the interest while separated? Even if divorced? Leave out the details while one is in arrears. I know that one. Any input is appreciated. No I did not win the lottery!

  • #2
    Originally posted by Baffled_Dad View Post
    I am currently having a debate with a friend at work about lottery winnings. Let's say a couple is separated for 2 or 3 years and one wins the lottery, is he or she entitled to half of the winnings or any part of the interest while separated?
    Very possibly yes. Not until the divorce is final and all matters are settled. The income from the lottery in my opinion would be considered as part of the equalization prior to the divorce.

    Originally posted by Baffled_Dad View Post
    Even if divorced?
    All depends. Are children involved?

    Comment


    • #3
      Separation date is valuation date for assets. Any money that comes in after separation shouldn't be valued for equalization. The couple should be truly separated though; there may be an argument that they didn't mean it, it was a trial separation, etc.

      Why would lottery winnings be any different than the paycheques you receive after separation? You get paid, you save some of your money, your investment account builds up, why isn't that money matrimonial property? Because you are separated.

      The Family Law Act spells it out:
      “net family property” means the value of all the property, except property described in subsection (2), that a spouse owns on the valuation date, after deducting,
      (a) the spouse’s debts and other liabilities, and
      (b) the value of property, other than a matrimonial home, that the spouse owned on the date of the marriage, after deducting the spouse’s debts and other liabilities, other than debts or liabilities related directly to the acquisition or significant improvement of a matrimonial home, calculated as of the date of the marriage; (“biens familiaux nets”)
      “property” means any interest, present or future, vested or contingent, in real or personal property and includes,
      (a) property over which a spouse has, alone or in conjunction with another person, a power of appointment exercisable in favour of himself or herself,
      (b) property disposed of by a spouse but over which the spouse has, alone or in conjunction with another person, a power to revoke the disposition or a power to consume or dispose of the property, and
      (c) in the case of a spouse’s rights under a pension plan, the imputed value, for family law purposes, of the spouse’s interest in the plan, as determined in accordance with section 10.1, for the period beginning with the date of the marriage and ending on the valuation date; (“bien”)
      “valuation date” means the earliest of the following dates:
      1. The date the spouses separate and there is no reasonable prospect that they will resume cohabitation.
      2. The date a divorce is granted.
      3. The date the marriage is declared a nullity.
      4. The date one of the spouses commences an application based on subsection 5 (3) (improvident depletion) that is subsequently granted.
      5. The date before the date on which one of the spouses dies leaving the other spouse surviving. (“date d’évaluation”) R.S.O. 1990, c. F.3, s. 4 (1); 2006, c. 19, Sched. C, s. 1 (2); 2009, c. 11, s. 22 (1-4); 2009, c. 33, Sched. 2, s. 34 (1).
      An issue that could come up, was the lottery ticket bought before separation? Or, did the couple have a longstanding agreement where they bought a ticket each week and played the same numbers? This kind of arrangement also comes up in disputes when a group of people buy tickets regulary, but perhaps one forgot to put in their dollar that week. So in separation agreements you would often see a release of any claim to lottery winnings, to avoid any later claims like that. It's not that the lottery winnings are family property, but there might be a contractual claim made.

      Comment


      • #4
        This is what were discussing. See, how can u call it equalization especially if u have been separated for 2 or 3 years? Its after the fact. To me, it's no different than if it were an inheritance or a loved one handed a gift of money or property. If it were me, I'd be handing that ticket over to my mother in a card there's no way my greedy ex would be seeing anything that don't belong to her.

        Comment


        • #5
          I'm not sure what you are arguing. Equalization is done on the valuation of net family property on separation date. If they are separated, then nothing after that is valued. Your example is that they are separated, so there is no issue.

          Comment


          • #6
            If my ex won the lottery and is refusing to pay SS you bet his lotto winnings will come into play. Separation/divorce agreement is valid. Some divorces have "review" dates where everything (need, ability to pay) is reviewed. Yes it comes into play just depends upon the circumstances.

            Comment


            • #7
              If you "cheaped out" and didn't get ILA (independent legal advice) and you win the lotto you could be in for a very big surprise.

              Comment


              • #8
                Thanks for posting that section. I couldn't find it. It makes total (cents) to me but, as mentioned, I'm sure the opposing lawyer would try to find some loop holes to get around it.

                Comment


                • #9
                  If you've won a lotto recently and you like women around 55 ya wanna hook up? I don't have much baggage - just a potential for indefinite litigation from the ex LOL. I'll even do your laundry!LOL

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Trust me! If I really won the lottery I wouldn't go and dig another grave and I like to do my own laundry. My dirty stuff is long gone.
                    Why would CS or SS have to change if it's being paid in good faith. As mentioned, she isn't entitled to investment earnings after separation and divorce from stocks or mutual funds once equalization has been determined.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Mess View Post
                      Separation date is valuation date for assets. Any money that comes in after separation shouldn't be valued for equalization. The couple should be truly separated though; there may be an argument that they didn't mean it, it was a trial separation, etc.
                      Although lottery winnings are non-taxible it would be hard to say if the court would not consider it under the rules for the determination of child support etc... This is where all the Rules where they state it can be changed by the judge in an evaluation of the circumstance...

                      Also, if someone won the lottery after it would probably become a hotly contested issue. It is a very "hypothetical" situation. I haven't heard of any cases like this and couldn't find anything in CanLII similar...

                      The friend in question probably doesn't have to worry about lottery winning as the probability of winning is so damn low that it would be best to worry about when you actually do win the lottery.

                      Originally posted by Mess View Post
                      Why would lottery winnings be any different than the paycheques you receive after separation? You get paid, you save some of your money, your investment account builds up, why isn't that money matrimonial property? Because you are separated.
                      Then they come for it as SS and CS... Hypothetically speaking, I think most people if they won say 10+million would shave off a million to give to the other parent just to keep the peace and not waste time and money before the court trying to find out if any of our theories would be correct.

                      Originally posted by Mess View Post
                      The Family Law Act spells it out:An issue that could come up, was the lottery ticket bought before separation? Or, did the couple have a longstanding agreement where they bought a ticket each week and played the same numbers? This kind of arrangement also comes up in disputes when a group of people buy tickets regulary, but perhaps one forgot to put in their dollar that week. So in separation agreements you would often see a release of any claim to lottery winnings, to avoid any later claims like that. It's not that the lottery winnings are family property, but there might be a contractual claim made.
                      Another way to look at it... If that much money comes into play all the lawyers will come out of the woodwork looking for their cut in a situation like this...

                      Good Luck!
                      Tayken

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        There was an news article 2 or 3 years ago where a guy won the lottery and his ex wife suddenly wanted to get back together. I'll see if I can dig that up...

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Mess View Post
                          There was an news article 2 or 3 years ago where a guy won the lottery and his ex wife suddenly wanted to get back together. I'll see if I can dig that up...
                          Ya that one was interesting. I think that he had the lottery ticket prior to separation in that one. I think he fled to somewhere in the tropics or something like that. It was a really weird story from what I recall. Big legal battle etc...

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Laurain v. Clarke, 2011 ONSC 7195 (CanLII)

                            Date: 2011-12-02
                            Docket: FS 10 2356 00
                            URL: CanLII - 2011 ONSC 7195 (CanLII)
                            Citation: Laurain v. Clarke, 2011 ONSC 7195 (CanLII)

                            [26] Dalton v. Craig reflex, (2002), 33 R.F.L. (5th) 63, [2002] O.J. No. 4686, 2002 CarswellOnt 42 (Ont. C.A.), But see Waese v. Bojman reflex, (2001), 19 R.F.L. (5th) 220, [2001] O.J. No. 2009, 2001 CarswellOnt 1813 (ON. S.C.) The proceeds of a lottery win are not “income”: Szpytko v. Szpytko 2001 CanLII 28134 (ON SC), (2001), 20 R.F.L. (5th) 186, [2001] O.J. No. 2888, [2001] O.T.C. 566, 2001 CarswellOnt 2565 (ON. S.C.)
                            Helmy v. Helmy, 2000 CanLII 22452 (ON SC)

                            Date: 2000-11-10
                            Docket: C38999/96
                            Parallel citations: 12 RFL (5th) 68
                            URL: CanLII - 2000 CanLII 22452 (ON SC)
                            Citation: Helmy v. Helmy, 2000 CanLII 22452 (ON SC)

                            [1] The Helmy family has been torn apart by this dispute over money. The amount involved is 2.5 million dollars won in a Lotto 649 draw on February 23, 1991. The family extends to four siblings in Canada and five others in Egypt, three of whom have died in the meantime. The web of deception among the family members stretches between the two countries and over nine years.

                            [2] The plaintiff, Rose Frieda Helmy, is the defendant Mohamed Gamil Helmy’s former wife. They were married in 1971, separated on March 30, 1991 and divorced on June 27, 1992. Rose has sued Mohamed, all his brothers and sisters, or their estates, some of their spouses and their mother for conspiracy to defraud her of her share of the 2.5 million dollars. Mohamed says he won the lottery, and admits he hid it from Rose. He says he arranged to have his brother, the defendant Ashraf (Andrew) Helmy, claim the winnings on his behalf so he could hide the money from Rose. Andrew and his wife Jolanta claim that Andrew was the real winner of the lottery; they allege that Rose and Mohamed have been conspiring against them since 1994 for their own joint gain. The defendant Foutna Thakib is Mohamed and Andrew’s sister. She and her husband Mourad Thakib, claim she and Mohamed were joint purchasers of the winning lottery ticket, and therefore joint winners of the 2.5 million dollars.
                            (CanLII is such a powerful tool.)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I would imagine that the lotto Winnings would not come into play, but any interest you make off it would be considered earnings and that would be where would you have to pay.

                              Comment

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