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Old 09-30-2014, 12:19 AM
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Default What Constitutes Abduction / Kidnapping Charges In Canada?

Ok, so I need some help / advice.

On the night of April 2nd, 2014, my outstanding wife had my oldest daughter bring me ten dollars, to send me out to get doughnuts, when I came back, my wife had taken my two girls and fled without consent, and at the time, my youngest was four years old.

Thankfully, my daughters are in the same city, but now they're on welfare, their mother can't even afford to take care of my daughters financially, and she won't even admit that she messed up, and that she can't afford to take care of my daughters, almost every two weeks, she contacts me, asking me for money for groceries, like i'm supposed to help her survive, when she abducted my daughters, and has caused so much turmoil.

For almost five nights, I didn't know where my girls were, and I started calling the police and C.A to get some help to have my daughters returned.

I have since retained a family lawyer, and he seems to be not very interested in getting my daughters back, going so far as to tell me that since it was the mother who had taken my daughters from our habitual residence, she can do what ever she wants, and that she doesn't need consent to abduct a fathers children.

After finding some cases that were held in Ontario, where a judge ruled that a wife who took off with the daughter, the mother committed abduction.

I brought this to my lawyers attention, and he literally blew a gasket, and told me that this is Canada, you can't say that in front of a judge, unless you want her to throw the book at you.

I have reached out to the police multiple times, asking what charges I could bring, either kidnapping, or abduction, and for some reason, those laws are not on the books in Canada, and because the mother did this, she can do what ever she wants.

My question is this, what recourse do I have as the father, to not only get my daughters back, but to have some sort of charges brought forward, for the actions that their mother committed?

As a father, I am at the end of my rope, and I'm having a very hard time coming to terms that any parent can commit abduction / kidnapping, and not be charged with something, and the fact that the Canadian judicial system actually allows a mother to do this to children, and a father.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:19 AM
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Theres a number of threads in here on this topic. Including a case currently underway with LovingFather32.

Im sure more senior members with more knowledge can make suggestions. However, what is your lawyer doing? A motion for custody? An emergency motion to return the children? If youre not happy with the way your lawyer is approaching it, you dont have to keep them. The police wont do anything without a court order and CAS will investigate to a point.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:40 AM
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how old is the oldest? Its been since april so you maybe SOL for getting an emergency motion to have the kids returned. That should of been done ASAP when this happened.

Forget about the charges for kidnapping etc, all you will be told that its a family court matter. Focus on getting 50/50 and be prepared to pay offset CS. If you have been giving her money, I hope you have some sort of record of it.
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Old 09-30-2014, 08:12 AM
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Unfortunately I was going to say the same thing as SOTS. Focusing on how to best punish your ex or how to have her charge is not going to get you anywhere. The police have already decided (you say you called them several times) that there are no charges to be laid.

Do you have any parenting time now? You should be working with a competent lawyer to ensure 50/50 access. If you ex had gone about the proper legal channels and not left with your children, likely the most time you would have gotten is 50/50.

Focus on that goal and put your time, effort, energy and money into achieving that.
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Old 09-30-2014, 08:55 AM
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Is there more to the story? Police called? Abuse? A big fight? In my case none of that. In fact no police involvement for the entirety of our 8 year relationship.

1. Police won't do squat. BUT, hopefully you filed a missing persons report.
This is an attachment on my affidavit. Hopefully you called 911 that night.

2. She asks for money? My opinion? GIVE it to her. Record somehow that
are giving her money. No matter what you owe money now. You will
owe from the day she left. Believe that. Arrears will need to be paid later
anyways and a judge will like to see you are being reasonable.

3. Do you know where she is? Does she let you talk to the kids? Are you
certain they're safe? If she's calling to say she needs groceries and
they're starving that's concerning. But also means not much planning on
her part. Which again makes me wonder .... are we missing something?

4. The word abduction .. you will catch a boatload of flack using that word
here. Basically, I use this definition. https://missingkids.ca/app/en/parental_child_abduction
Call them. They knew all the details and called it abduction for sure. Once you KNOW where your kid is and is SURE they're safe .. abduction is out the window. This is what I get from the word.

5. You have contact with her it seems. Get her denial of access in writing. If no luck go for an emergency motion with all the facts. DONT let a lawyer tell you no. You have messages that your child is not eating. That's an emergency. (In my books anyway).

6. In the emergency motion perhaps you can have the judge set an early case conference date. Show that she is denying access for no reason (if there is no reason) and the judge may order that both parties must make offers before the case conference for access. (Mine did .. that's how I began access).

7. DONT WAIT!

8. Keep emotion out of it and don't contact her. You don't want a restraining order or to sound mad or unreasonable. This will work in only her favor. Be patient, honest and reasonable and let the courts handle it from here.
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Old 09-30-2014, 12:38 PM
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Something also very important:

Quote:
As a father, I am at the end of my rope, and I'm having a very hard time coming to terms that any parent can commit abduction / kidnapping, and not be charged with something, and the fact that the Canadian judicial system actually allows a mother to do this to children, and a father.
Take your rope and stretch it - this is at the best the beginning of a LONG drawn out battle. Forget about abduction, when you get in front of a judge one day you mention it as part of your proof for her bad judgement and it'll be noted but probably nothing will come of it.

Also I want to introduce you to your new enemy: STATUS QUO
What people often do is they create situations illegally, unethically (or via interim orders) that replicate the situation they would like to have in the future and the opposing party (you) now has to climb the mountain of undoing that. Although the status quo in this case isn't too firmly established you need to CONTEST her move immediately and ask for shared custody or access rights.

You have no rights. No rights to your children, no rights to your money. Nothing really.... just the right to liberty really (but it gets meaningless when you are an indentured servant). Everything you thought about your rights as Canadian are meaningless as a divorced father.

________________

Your ex might be an idiot, she could have been probably getting child and spousal support from you all this time rather than living on welfare (unless you are poor yourself).

Once you go to court you will:
-fight for your life to get shared custody if you want it (which will take 1yr + ) not shared custody = you are an uncle
-ordered to pay child support and spousal support (immediately)
-probably fight a DV charge and whether you win or not you'll be haunted by the accusations of it.

_______________
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Old 09-30-2014, 02:14 PM
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As we advise all new posters, when children have been removed from the family home, the first course of action is for an applicant to file an emergency motion and have them returned -- particularly when the applicant has been an involved parent prior to the move and the children are established in their family home with neighbors, friends, school, etc.

I think you should be paying cs to your ex, so if you aren't setting aside the table amount from the date of departure, I would recommend you do so.

What is your lawyer doing for you at the moment? Do you have 50/50 access at the moment and/or has your lawyer advised you how he/she intends to get you there?
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rockscan View Post
Theres a number of threads in here on this topic. Including a case currently underway with LovingFather32.

Im sure more senior members with more knowledge can make suggestions. However, what is your lawyer doing? A motion for custody? An emergency motion to return the children? If youre not happy with the way your lawyer is approaching it, you dont have to keep them. The police wont do anything without a court order and CAS will investigate to a point.
My lawyer filed an emergency motion, we've been to court a few times to this point.

I filed right away, and my daughters mother had to reply, and the judge has allowed this woman to keep my children.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SadAndTired View Post
Unfortunately I was going to say the same thing as SOTS. Focusing on how to best punish your ex or how to have her charge is not going to get you anywhere. The police have already decided (you say you called them several times) that there are no charges to be laid.

Do you have any parenting time now? You should be working with a competent lawyer to ensure 50/50 access. If you ex had gone about the proper legal channels and not left with your children, likely the most time you would have gotten is 50/50.

Focus on that goal and put your time, effort, energy and money into achieving that.
She didn't go about taking the proper legal channels, her, and my oldest daughter planned to have me leave, to go and get doughnuts, when I came back home, my family was gone.
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Old 09-30-2014, 07:26 PM
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What kind of access do you have, if any?
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