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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 03-16-2012, 01:28 AM
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Originally Posted by hadenough View Post
Thx Tayken. I've never been sent a stamped copy of order by court or lawyer. Just a lot of vague bs in the way of answers. The only thing that worries me, is that if I go to the clerk's counter, they are going to tell me exactly what the Judge's Secretary told me "you have a lawyer/you were represented - call him." Well as far as I'm concerned, I don't have a lawyer. The last email I got from the lawyer said "I expect to have it soon and will forward you a copy of same" (??) Where is it?? Like, where's it coming from, that he's waiting for it - and where the hell has it "been" ALL this time? I pretty much said that in my email the other day, that I don't understand WHY this delay, and that FRO has NOTHING, and I have yet to recv a response. If I go to Courthouse, the girls will probably call my "favorite judge's secretary" and I just fear at this point, I look like a rogue client/wingnut. The secretary has been rude w/me on 2 occasions and I've only called her 3x.
You have the court file number and know the court it is filed with correct? You can get a service provider to go and get the record for you. They will know what to get and can work with you to get the right materials.

Your lawyer is being lazy as the decision is posted on CanLII.org. Or the lawyer has it lost on their desk like many do.

I posted some links to service providers that self represented litigants can use to get court records in another thread. If you do a search on the board you should be able to find it. The Yellow Pages (canada411.com) should list ones close to the court house too. You can call them and see what they can do for you to get the records. They do it all the time and know the clerks personally generally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Berner_Faith View Post
Also, thx! Great to know that CanLii will change the typos and other errors. It bothers me that even the date is wrong. Seems pretty sloppy to me, but to be honest I haven't searched CanLii and read other orders. I plan to soon.
I see a lot of miss matches when I find something in CanLII that I want full research material on. When my service provider sends a copy of the court record it is amazing to see how the decisions get entered. I report them and provide the true original copy. Not sure how the decisions get actually put in... I assumed they were OCR'd in but, based on what I find here and there it looks like someone types them in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Berner_Faith View Post
The above convo lol re: emergency motions is totally going over my head so I don't have a comment on that and admittedly, to some degree I've pulled this thread a little off-topic, Sorry.
Emergency motions are incredibly complex. The rules around them are very tight. Lots of requirements to bring one forward and a lot of risk. That is why I am calling the OP out on it. You don't just waltz into the court and file them. They require a judge to even consider. Generally, they are only considered if children are at risk of serious emotional and/or physical harm. Or when children have been removed from their primary residence.

Suffice to say, this would be the first example before the courts and would have been a posted decision should what the OP claim is true. Furthermore, due to the rare nature of "emergency" motions, they are marked on the dockets and easy to find.

What a lot of people don't realize is that when they use the court to resolve a dispute they are going to a public system. All matters are part of the public record. So, if you claim you did something in the public system and provide simple facts like the date range (before Christmas), jurisdictions (from past correspondence Newmarket or Toronto), key identifiers like "emergency" and "grandparents" it isn't hard to find.

Service provider has confirmed that they are sending representatives to the court house in Toronto and Newmarket to search the "before Christmas" dockets.

Furthermore, the busiest time for the courts is Christmas. People can't get a normal motion or case conference scheduled at that time for motions regarding Christmas access... It is highly unlikely that an emergency motion filed by "grandparents" would be heard unless there was some serious danger to the children involved.

Furthermore, if there was a danger to children, the first thing would be to call CAS... Not file an "emergency" motion. The resulting order for almost all emergency orders is for the CAS to investigate.

So there are a lot of holes in the story of the OP that are easy to fill with facts that any qualified service provider can search.

I should have an answer by end of day tomorrow from the service provider I use. Cost me $240 though. But, if it results in nothing then we all have an answer. If they find the record we have even more answers.

I will let everyone know by close of court what the answer is.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #22 (permalink)  
Old 03-16-2012, 05:19 PM
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As suspected the service providers found nothing filed in Newmarket or Toronto for any emergency application filed in either court for grandparent access.

Bragging about your control of your children. (free)
Coming back to lie about the proceeding and providing no evidence to make yourself feel good about it. (free)
Having service providers search for the records that don't exist (240$).
Finding the truth. (priceless)

For advice on separation, divorce, custody and access there are over paid lawyers for finding the truth there is the OttawaDivorce.com forum.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 03-16-2012, 06:13 PM
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Well done Tayken.. I wonder if the OP will come back and try to defend her children... like I stated before... I think the daughter just decided to leave the bf and the only ones who would help her were her parents who so desperately wanted to see their grandchildren.

The liars are often weeded out, and this is another prime example
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 03-16-2012, 07:34 PM
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Tayken:

lol....too funny although I'm confused over the motivation to post such a falsehood..its odd.

I can't believe you paid $240 for that. If you feel like wasting any more money, let me know.
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 03-17-2012, 09:02 AM
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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
Tayken:

lol....too funny although I'm confused over the motivation to post such a falsehood..its odd.
There is an excellent book written by Dr. Lawson titled "Understanding the Borderline Mother".

Understanding the Borderline Mother: Helping Her Children Transcend the Intense, Unpredictable, and Volatile Relationshi: Amazon.ca: Christine Ann Lawson: Books

Factitious disorder by Internet is a pattern of behavior in which Internet users seek attention by feigning situations in online venues such as chat rooms, message boards, and Internet Relay Chat (IRC).

Reports of users who deceive Internet forum participants by portraying themselves as gravely ill or as victims of violence first appeared in the 1990s due to the relative newness of Internet communications. The pattern was identified in 1998 by psychiatrist Marc Feldman.

The development of factitious disorders in online venues is made easier by the availability of literature on the Internet, the anonymous and malleable nature of online identities, and the existence of communication forums established for the sole purpose of giving support to members facing problems.

The virtual communities that were created to give support often express genuine sympathy and grief for the purported victims. When fabrications are suspected or confirmed, the ensuing discussion can create schisms in online communities, destroying some and altering the trusting nature of individual members in others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
I can't believe you paid $240 for that. If you feel like wasting any more money, let me know.
I paid the $240 because I believe it was Gary who pointed out that there are some odd patterns of behaviour from posters (and responders) of this community.

Integrity is a key element in providing support, help and information. For the OP to post something as wild as this story without providing cogent and relevant evidence could impact someone in the larger community of readers. Potentially a grandparent who then attempts to do what is boasted to have been done. Spend thousands and thousands in trying to do something that well, never happened.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 03-17-2012, 12:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tayken View Post
As suspected the service providers found nothing filed in Newmarket or Toronto for any emergency application filed in either court for grandparent access.

Bragging about your control of your children. (free)
Coming back to lie about the proceeding and providing no evidence to make yourself feel good about it. (free)
Having service providers search for the records that don't exist (240$).
Finding the truth. (priceless)

For advice on separation, divorce, custody and access there are over paid lawyers for finding the truth there is the OttawaDivorce.com forum.

Good Luck!
Tayken
Thanks for finding out the truth about this poster. The crap people deal with in regards to separation divorce and all it entails is bad enough without people giving false hope. She rubbed me the wrong way and just seemed so controlling of her daughters life.
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 03-19-2012, 03:36 AM
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Originally Posted by standing on the sidelines View Post
Thanks for finding out the truth about this poster. The crap people deal with in regards to separation divorce and all it entails is bad enough without people giving false hope. She rubbed me the wrong way and just seemed so controlling of her daughters life.
I agree. The OP's story was very disconnected. There was self blame, issues with being too involved with the daughter in question, a lot of projection of blame against the past (and now boyfriend) and the story didn't add up. It read as one of Dr. Lawson's classic architypes to me when the OP started originally telling their story.

The as the personal opinions of the OP started to unfold and challenges were made the story changed and it just didn't add up. On curious posters I keep a mind map in the background of their allegations and story as it unfolds. I find the most interesting posts are from people who are grandparents, other new spouses etc...

It isn't too hard to break apart the story and put it into a boolean setup of truth and weigh the balance on the changes in the story. The OP's story got too complex even for the OP to track it and keep it all straight.

So if you equate the statements about the daughter made, time lines given and other details it isn't hard to see the story fall apart. The egocentric nature of the OP in the original thread and this thread was thick. No one mattered but how the OP felt and what the OP felt was RIGHT.

The OP "didn't know" about childhood issues, abuse, of the daughter. This egocentric view of self and that all the problems the OP's daughter was having was the result of someone else's conduct. In no way did the OP take any responsibility for the problems or challenges the OP's daughter had in life. It was as Mr. Eddy would put it... Someone else's fault. The OP was the best mother that she could be to her now daughter who was in an abusive relationship.

"It's All Your Fault".

The postings were rich with "fear" and no substantiated evidence as to what emotion the fear was attached to. Fears and/or anxieties and/or worries are rooted in something and the OP had a hard time communicating that fear other than a "belief".

Fear drives 99.9% of high-conflict litigation. Parents who are fearful are generally "overanxious" but, if the pattern of behaviour is demonstrated over a life time as provided in the statements made by the OP... It generally demonstrates a pattern of avoidance... Which could stem from an Avoidant Personality Disorder which has a lot of connection to being the child of an overbearning / overanxious parent. Avoidance becomes their defense mechanism.

No doubt that the OP's daughter has piles of poetry, journals and other materials collected over her life which are reflective of the struggle she had with the OP. Trophies of abuse many psychologists/psychiatrists would call them.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 03-19-2012, 09:42 AM
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Just an update: I used the "Contact Us" field on CanLii re: errors (mostly typo of Names) in my Judgment and here is their response:

"As a matter of editorial policy, CanLII does not perform substantial corrections to a posted document without direct instructions from the issuing organization to do so.

Since you send us a description of the required corrections we will ask the court for a corrected decision. You may also want to contact the court yourself to ensure more certainty and expediency.

Thank you for using CanLII."

  #29 (permalink)  
Old 03-19-2012, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by hadenough View Post
Just an update: I used the "Contact Us" field on CanLii re: errors (mostly typo of Names) in my Judgment and here is their response:

"As a matter of editorial policy, CanLII does not perform substantial corrections to a posted document without direct instructions from the issuing organization to do so.

Since you send us a description of the required corrections we will ask the court for a corrected decision. You may also want to contact the court yourself to ensure more certainty and expediency.

Thank you for using CanLII."

Substantial changes. Ick. The date mistake is a substantial issue. You will have to do it through the court house. It is a painful experience. I will do some research on how to get it done with as little pain as possible and if I find anything will post.
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 03-19-2012, 03:54 PM
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Reports of users who deceive Internet forum participants by portraying themselves as gravely ill or as victims of violence first appeared in the 1990s due to the relative newness of Internet communications. The pattern was identified in 1998 by psychiatrist Marc Feldman.
Very, very odd.

When I'm on the internet, I only tell the truth about my life....like how I weigh 105lbs, have large breasts and used to be a gymnast.
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