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Divorce Support This forum is for discussing the emotional aspects of divorce: stress, anger, betrayal of trust and more.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Qrious View Post
When I receive a few more misspelled, grammatically incorrect and openly hostile communications to follow, I know I have been especially successful.
I was wondering if you could share some of the "openly hostile" words that the other parent in your situation uses? The reason I ask is that I have been studying what defines "hostility" in written communications and if the words themselves track as "hostile" or if it is possibly the emotional filter that people apply to the content that generates their belief that the content is hostile.

Specifically, I am curious as the tool Our Family Wizard provides an additional service "ToneMeter" which provides a real-time analysis of the "tone" of written communications.

ToneMeter - Our Family Wizard - child custody, parenting time

Which is built on the Lymbix system.

Lymbix Sentiment Analysis Reinvented

Lymbix's ToneCheck pre-screens the tone of your emails | VentureBeat

I find their software facinating for a few reasons, one of them being that they are a Canadian company (Lymbix) and the application in other areas in family law. (For example the analysis of written affidavit materials and court applications.)

Good Luck!
Tayken
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Old 05-30-2013, 09:12 AM
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Not sure about "Stripes", but here is a smattering of recent examples from my ex's communications to me;

"what's wrong with you!"
"I'm done with your bullshit!"
"You crazy ass man!"
"Ur crazy!"
"you aren't a very good role model at all for <childname>!"
"You really are a moron!"

The emails usually contain a lot of exclamation marks. I consider these "hostile" communications. The "tone-meter" would likely start flashing red, with a siren, if I fed it, emails from my ex. The voice-mails when she has left them, are usually worse.
  #23 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
"what's wrong with you!"
"I'm done with your bullshit!"
"You crazy ass man!"
"Ur crazy!"
"you aren't a very good role model at all for <childname>!"
"You really are a moron!"
I would forward each one of those to the ex's lawyer, and send a final email that says something along the lines of:

Please advise your client to stop sending me harassing, frivilous and vexatious messages. Unless there is an issue that directly pertains to the children, or to the settlement of the outstanding issues before the court, I would ask that your client refrain from contact in this manner.

If this behavior persists I will govern myself accordingly.

Respectfully,

$me
  #24 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by dad2bandm View Post
Not sure about "Stripes", but here is a smattering of recent examples from my ex's communications to me;

"what's wrong with you!"
"I'm done with your bullshit!"
"You crazy ass man!"
"Ur crazy!"
"you aren't a very good role model at all for <childname>!"
"You really are a moron!"

The emails usually contain a lot of exclamation marks. I consider these "hostile" communications. The "tone-meter" would likely start flashing red, with a siren, if I fed it, emails from my ex. The voice-mails when she has left them, are usually worse.
Actually, dad2bandm, having run this through tonemeter just now, I can confirm that it does indeed turn red. I had to put all those statements into a fluid statement to really get the system to react. But, if you just cut and paste the quotes as is, you get a big red bar. If you structure it into a conversation it gives you even a larger red bar.

These are all excellent examples of truly "hostile" communications. Most of the common scores on these statements were "upsetting" and "aggressive" that were produced from ToneMeter.

Aggression being the key element to identifying "hostility" in communications.

Thank-you for providing the sample data. They are very similar to the other samples I have collected form high-conflict family law matters when I pull court records.

Common hostile-like words and statements that I often see are statements that the other parent is "immature", "a bad parent", and pretty much align to everything you provided as an example.

I am trying to narrow down the most common hostile statements to something similar to George Carlan's seven dirty words. But, more of a "seven hostile statements made by highly conflicted parents".

By the way there doesn't seem to be any relationship to gender or sexual orientation on who does this "more often". It is quite equal. Most times, what you see in the review of the court files is that one party is often more hostile and the other party is defensive in nature.

Some times though, what you see is two people who have are both equally embroiled in the nonsense.

Mostly, it is easy to identify the highly-conflicted party. Generally they are the ones who try to leverage evidence prior to having children, make generalized statements of "fearing" the other party without evidence and verbally assault the other parent's character.

Also, a tell tail sign is when the party involved in the matter is the applicant and starts it all off on an "emergency" ex party motion before the courts...

Good Luck!
Tayken

Last edited by Tayken; 05-30-2013 at 09:36 AM.
  #25 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by NBDad View Post
I would forward each one of those to the ex's lawyer, and send a final email that says something along the lines of:

Please advise your client to stop sending me harassing, frivilous and vexatious messages. Unless there is an issue that directly pertains to the children, or to the settlement of the outstanding issues before the court, I would ask that your client refrain from contact in this manner.

If this behavior persists I will govern myself accordingly.

Respectfully,

$me
Actually, this is very good advice and structured quite well. Often, when a lawyer gets exposure to the true nature of their client they will either defend the statements made by their client (negative advocate lawyer), silently give their client some advice and not respond (positive advocate lawyer) and in the rare cases of a true professional will respond and apologize for the conduct of their client (a truly positive advocate lawyer).

If you have a combination of a parent who makes such statements and a lawyer to endorses and defends them... You are dealing with the stupid and crooked negative advocate lawyer problem. Settlement will be nearly impossible in a situation like this without court intervention in my personal opinion.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #26 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tayken View Post

These are all excellent examples of truly "hostile" communications. Most of the common scores on these statements were "upsetting" and "aggressive" that were produced from ToneMeter...
...
Thank-you for providing the sample data. They are very similar to the other samples I have collected form high-conflict family law matters when I pull court records...
No problem. I have reams of these "examples".
  #27 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tayken View Post
Actually, this is very good advice and structured quite well... Often, when a lawyer gets exposure to the true nature of their client they will either defend the statements made by their client (negative advocate lawyer)...
In my particular situation, we have a final order already (for some time), so we are not "active" before the court right now...right now anyway. So I just ignore the statements.

If we were active before the court, then I would use this suggestion, as I think it's a good idea.

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack the original poster's thread. :-)
  #28 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 11:20 AM
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I don't really feeling trawling through ex's missives to pull out complete sentences, but from the last few weeks, here are some of the words used I remember to describe me (before the recent turn to patronizing and passive-aggressive):

"belligerent" (spelled three different ways), "creepy", "sick", "disgusting, "aggressive", "playing cute games", "completely full of bullshit", "hiding [my] hostility behind a false front of reasonableness", "pissing [him] off", "deliberately invading [his] life'", "destructive".

... and on it goes. That's the overtly angry stuff - there's also the vague threats, beginning with phrases like "you leave me no choice but to ...". The only responses from my end were statements that I would not read or respond to emails that were either vulgar or insulting.

One thing I noticed was that he's recently started referring to me as "high conflict" and going on and on about how he needs to protect himself from "high conflict persons" like me. This in the midst of volleys of insults and rants from his end. I can only imagine what this would look like to a lawyer or judge. I can assure you that I'm extremely careful with my communications and actions.

I'm guessing "high conflict" has become a buzzword detached from any actual behaviors, and is now being used just to mean "a person who won't give me what I want".

It would be very interesting to do a thematic analysis and come up with a "seven statements from hostile exes" typology.
  #29 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 12:36 PM
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In an email, I have, "once a ##### always a #####."

He actually used the pound signs, not that he's above actually saying the words to me, but he must have known better than to put it fully in writing.

Also, "You are who you are." (I took this as a compliment because I happen to like who I am)

And when I emailed and asked him to stop calling me down to our son through text message (that I had copies of), I got, "F... off. He knows what you are like..."

I've had a LOT worse to my face, but he's a little more careful about what he puts in writing. I have phone message recordings that would peel the paint off a new car.

Oops - forgot - controlling, mentally unstable....
  #30 (permalink)  
Old 05-30-2013, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stripes View Post
... "you leave me no choice but to ...".
This was a phrase my ex. also used when he wasn't getting what he wanted.
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