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Divorce Support This forum is for discussing the emotional aspects of divorce: stress, anger, betrayal of trust and more.

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 12:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
My son has ADHD although has not been formally diagnosed.
Later in your thread you mention that medications were prescribed. Generally, this happens when there is a diagnosis. Formal diagnosis are generally needed for applying for government services and educational services. So, don't think that the doctor's medical opinion is not "official" because it isn't as formal as a full on report. The doctor has to justivy in their SOAP notes why the medication was prescribed and there probably was good reason it was done. Just not the "formal" one that a government service would accept to provide services.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
A formal psycho-educational assessment is currently being done.
Note: The quality of the assessment lies with the clinician doing the assessment. Some times they are stronger in testing for learning disabilities and other patterns.

Don't expect the assessment to answer everything or provide much of an answer or the whole answer you may be looking for.

Grain of salt... Always with this stuff.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
A Pediatrician recommended medication back in 2014 and my son took this medication for 2 full years with much-improved results in his school progress and confidence.
Pediatrician's don't willy nill hand out medication. So you can probably use this result as a positive that something is up. Hopefully the assessor evaluates the medical records of this encounter and treatment fully.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
It was noticed by myself, dad and step-dad that it started affecting his appetite, such that it was preventing proper weight gain. I discussed taking him off the medication in the summer of 2016 and dad agreed.
Did you discuss the adverse impact of the medication with the doctor prior? Weight gain isn't the single most important health metric to monitor. So long as the change in medication was the result of a clinical recommendation then it was needed.

Parents are very "worried" about weight gain and loss these days.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
Dad is generally opposed to the medication (although consented for him to be on it for 2 full school years). After discussion with him, and feeling that maybe we could give it a go without the medication this school year, his dad and I agreed to try that.
Hopefully a clinician was involved in guiding you to coming to that conclusion.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
It didn't take long (November-ish) before the teachers started mentioning focus issues again. I consulted with the pediatrician (dad came too) and he agreed it was best to try a trial run of a new medication - one that would possibly have reduced side effects (appetite being the biggest concern). My son was on it for 2 weeks at a low dose and then 1 week at a slight increase, as not much change was noted after the first 2 weeks. After the 1st week on the increased dose, I received a call from the pediatrician to tell me that he wanted to recommend my son stop taking the meds. He further explained that my ex had called him complaining that it was affecting his appetite on the INCREASED dose so he wanted him removed from it altogether.
Odd that a clinician would do this. Generally they would want the child to come in for an assessment. The dramatic start-stop of any medication like this is not a good thing. Generally you have to stage down from them.

I suspect (as you probably do) that the doctor was being bullied by the other parent. The doctor probably just wanted to back out of the situation. Unfortunate that doctors don't get better training in these areas of patient management. Especially when parents are involved. When you have a busy practice it is easy to brush off the high conflict parents like this.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
The kicker is, my ex didn't see him ONCE on the schedule during the week of the increased dose, making this a blatant lie to the doctor! He successfully got the medication stopped because the doctor of course took what my ex said at face value (why would he assume it wasn't true, right?).
I suspect that the other parent was a bit forceful in their attempt. Having no contact with the child and then making this call is out-of-sorts. Generally a pattern like that smells of a high conflict situation. It is smelly to me and I am a random idiot on the internet reading what you wrote. I suspect the call wasn't friendly and a lot of pushing by the other parent was involved.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
Meanwhile, ex's argument was that he wanted to wait until the results of the psycho-educational assessment were in to decide whether to medicate or not (even though he'd been ok with it for 2 years before).
Not unreasonable position but, considering the impact the prior medication had it is an odd position to take.

Be warned... HCP (high conflict people) like proxy wars through professionals over things like this with the children. It is a way they keep themselves engaged int he conflict... Which they crave.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
This will be months from now I am told by the psychologist.
The psychologist should be kept up to date on all these developments. They generally prescribe medications if needed. So they should know about all the adverse reactions (and parental conflict). Hopefully they have a good relationship with the primary care physician.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
The doctor wrote me an email saying that he would recommend continuing the trial run of the medication if the wait time was going to be long for the assessment results (it is); however, my ex will not medicate at his house now that he got his recommendation based on the false claim.
Unfortunately, in a situation like this, where one parent refuses to provide the medication, it is best not to medicate. Most of these medications require consistency and some times medications be taken at the same time of the day. So, to have a situation where the dosing instruction is not followed is NOT good.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
My sense of it is that it's a power/control thing. He's taking charge of this but at the expense of his kid.
I suspect your "sense" is more than a "sense" and possibly 100% true. The pattern of behaviour smells of HCP. What you have described is "text book" conduct of a proxy war through a clinician. It isn't a power/control thing. It is purely conflict. They feed on it like a vampire at times. You are correct, it is at the expense of the child, but, they don't care. Just like herion addicts don't care that they just sold their prarent's furnature in their house. Just one fix... Just one more fix...

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
Question is: is this something a judge will see is not in the child's best interests?
Yes. A judge will pick out this common pattern of behaviour quite easily. You don't even need as many words to describe it in an affidavit. The medical records will all align to your access schedule and it will be clear as day.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
I am really upset about the fact that my kid is now struggling. I see his confidence fading.
Unfortunate but, there may be other support structures in the school that can help him until things are resolved.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
I may be paranoid but part of me wonders if my ex would be happy to see poor marks because the "kid is not thriving" observation could help his case. I sincerely hope this is not the case - sickening if it is.
Sorry to sicken you. I suspect that the other parent is operating on this very principal in this matter if what you have provided is truthful and accurate. HCPs create conflict to "win" at something. They don't care the impact. They just want to get the high from the "win". Yes, it is sickening.

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
I understand that this isn't "abuse" - the only criteria some of you think should prevent a 50/50 arrangement. Just wondering how serious a judge would consider this, because I consider it pretty serious.
Actually, it is "abusive" to do this. If you read the very commonly cited case law on this forum from WorkingDad the honourable justice Pazaratz labeled this (with other bad behaviour) as "abusive". Interfearing with clinicians like this is not looked upon favourably. If you have a good lawyer your 34.1 (Affidavit in support of custody and access) could easily outline what you have described with all the necessary medical records and communications for consideration as "abuse".

Bad parenting like this is "abusive".

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Originally Posted by Ange71727 View Post
Please no debating about medicating children or not...just advice on this in relation to a potential court case.
The other parent in your matter will try to use this negative as a positive towards their case - no matter how "sick" it is. How you approach the resonse to their "positive" to outlay the facts that the impact has not been positive for the child is key. You need a very very very very good lawyer. Those are not cheap unfortunately. This kind of evidence presentment is VERY HARD for self reps. Very few can present it well without looking confused or being able to focus on the key relevant issues while remaining cogent.

Good Luck!
Tayken
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 12:42 PM
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 01:47 PM
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I'm just wondering if dad got an e-mail from the school or teacher about the effects of the meds. Mom had indicated he was put on the e-mail list.

If he's pulling these stunts Ange, document them and use them in court.

However, I agree with Tayken that formal assessments should be completed before a "med switch" and that only specialized clinicians should be doing that, in conjunction with a psychoeducational assessment. These assessments arn't always the best, as Tayken points out ... but they at least describe exactly what's happening in class for the clinician. This will be the dad's case....dick move or not.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 02:09 PM
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Just thought I would add a little comment here.
Having been born with ADHD and diagnosed very early well before school. There are non medicated treatments, which relate to removing all allergies. In my case, it was everything, eggs, corn starch, apples, peanuts, etc. etc. all mild hardly noticeable but all affected my attention.
Anyhow it can be done without medications. That said I took medications, and yes one of the side effects of some of these drugs is it suppresses appetite.
One solution to this is to monitor what your child eats, and encourage them to eat at set times and set amounts.
They should understand that the medication they are on, suppresses appetite, and they should self monitor themselves or you should be doing that accordingly. This is what I did.

Look at it this way, its just like any other diet, instead of a diet for losing weight it's a diet to healthy living.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 03:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingFather32 View Post
I'm just wondering if dad got an e-mail from the school or teacher about the effects of the meds. Mom had indicated he was put on the e-mail list.

If he's pulling these stunts Ange, document them and use them in court.

However, I agree with Tayken that formal assessments should be completed before a "med switch" and that only specialized clinicians should be doing that, in conjunction with a psychoeducational assessment. These assessments arn't always the best, as Tayken points out ... but they at least describe exactly what's happening in class for the clinician. This will be the dad's case....dick move or not.


He did get himself on the email list, but this is for general info, to all the parents. There is little chance a teacher sought him out to speak to him. I am in contact with all three teachers on a frequent basis and my ex relies on me cc'ing him or relaying info to him. I cannot at all see them sharing a pertinent detail with him and not me. On the slim chance that did happen, he would've mentioned it and used this to back up his argument.


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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 03:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by involveddad75 View Post
Just thought I would add a little comment here.
Having been born with ADHD and diagnosed very early well before school. There are non medicated treatments, which relate to removing all allergies. In my case, it was everything, eggs, corn starch, apples, peanuts, etc. etc. all mild hardly noticeable but all affected my attention.
Anyhow it can be done without medications. That said I took medications, and yes one of the side effects of some of these drugs is it suppresses appetite.
One solution to this is to monitor what your child eats, and encourage them to eat at set times and set amounts.
They should understand that the medication they are on, suppresses appetite, and they should self monitor themselves or you should be doing that accordingly. This is what I did.

Look at it this way, its just like any other diet, instead of a diet for losing weight it's a diet to healthy living.


Thanks for your input. I am looking into this currently as I feel like I can't sit and do nothing for my son. Maybe I can find a few non medical strategies that will work for him.


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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 03:54 PM
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Im not a freak tree bark eater. I take regular meds and have been known to try homepathic remedies where necessary. In some instances a diet change or natural approach has helped and in other cases real drugs worked better.

I suggested it though since the battle over the meds doesnt seem to be one that will be solved soon and meanwhile this child will suffer. Remember that kids can be cruel right? This instance screams of being bullied for being "stupid". If she can give him a natural supplement to help his focus then she can do so on her own without dads input. Ditto on changing his diet.

As much as everyone has their own view on medications I think you all can agree that in a similar situation you would want your child to do well in school right?
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 01-17-2017, 04:03 PM
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Thanks for your input. I am looking into this currently as I feel like I can't sit and do nothing for my son. Maybe I can find a few non medical strategies that will work for him.
The challenge you face (now) is that any intervention requires consistency. You do not have that when the child is residing with the other parent. So, anything you do change may not have the proper impact. Right now, change is not a great thing. Dramatic change is not recommended at all.

Talk to your clinician before you do anything. Even a dietary change.
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