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Divorce Support This forum is for discussing the emotional aspects of divorce: stress, anger, betrayal of trust and more.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2014, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MS Mom View Post
What I've personally found - the legal system allows those that have a tendency to be over-bearing and controlling to be even more over-bearing and controlling. The courts/law/agreements can throw the power right back into the hands of the controller. They don't "have" to do what they agree to so they don't.
Exactly, so far STBX has disregarded court orders, stolen my mail, bounced checks, lied in court and attempted every dirty trick you can imagine and there have been ZERO consequences.

What's the point in negotiating for hours when it results in him doing WTF he wants regardless? There should be stiff fines or even jail time for those who BS their way through the courts.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2014, 08:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Janibel View Post
Exactly, so far STBX has disregarded court orders, stolen my mail, bounced checks, lied in court and attempted every dirty trick you can imagine and there have been ZERO consequences.

What's the point in negotiating for hours when it results in him doing WTF he wants regardless? There should be stiff fines or even jail time for those who BS their way through the courts.
The ZERO consequences is the problem.

That's exactly how I feel.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2014, 08:57 PM
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If there were more serious consequences then there would likely be a whole new level of court instituted. The "contempt" court. This exists in a way now as someone charged with contempt gets a whole new series of court dates/appearances due to the requirement to let the accused "purge" their contempt. Problem is that they get wayyyyy too much time to do this.
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Old 05-27-2014, 08:58 PM
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Yep, agree. Especially worse when you throw brainwashed kids in the mix and the ex can play innocent.
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Old 05-28-2014, 01:22 PM
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My 2cents.

I don't buy into the terminology of "legal abuse".

Why?

Because someone who is using the legal system to bully the other party in a matter would be found to be conducting themselves in "bad faith".

So, in my view the proper definition for the consistent pattern of bringing and subsequently having orders made against the party in question would constitute "bad faith".

Many people fail to realize that a person has a right to bring a lawsuit. It isn't "abusive" to do so. To bring one on "bad faith" is and there are appropriate means to deal with litigants who conduct themselves in this manner.

If you have good legal counsel then it is hard to be "legally abused" by someone. Retaining a qualified and competent lawyer is the best way to insure you negate the losses (both $ and emotional) from having to deal with an improperly litigious party.

Good Luck!
Tayken
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Old 05-29-2014, 11:41 PM
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I definitely buy into the term legal abuse. Many of the comments on this thread resonate with me. Many people do not qualify for legal aid, simply can not afford a lawyer or are forced to self-represent after spending tens of thousands of dollars in a process that got them nowhere. My opinion and experience has been that the legal system is not about justice at all. It is about who has more money to stall, threaten, delay and basically wear the other party down into submission. Most cases do not go to trial...not because a fair resolution was met but because one of the parties simply gave up. The Family Law system is seriously flawed in my opinion.
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Old 05-30-2014, 12:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by annapurna66 View Post
I definitely buy into the term legal abuse. Many of the comments on this thread resonate with me. Many people do not qualify for legal aid, simply can not afford a lawyer or are forced to self-represent after spending tens of thousands of dollars in a process that got them nowhere. My opinion and experience has been that the legal system is not about justice at all. It is about who has more money to stall, threaten, delay and basically wear the other party down into submission. Most cases do not go to trial...not because a fair resolution was met but because one of the parties simply gave up. The Family Law system is seriously flawed in my opinion.
Also let's not forget that many people simply do not have the 'stamina' to participate in a never-ending legal tug-of-war ... and as you say: give up before their health and mind break down under the stress.

After spending so much time, energy and money to finally get a fair settlement only to have it disregarded by the same person who agreed to sign it in the first place, is beyond frustrating --- no consequences unless a person is willing to spend yet more time, energy and money to have it enforced (maybe???) that is my definition of legal abuse.
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Old 05-30-2014, 10:01 PM
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I disagree with Tayken in that having a good lawyer will minimize the problems inherent with the family court system. Your lawyer can be good, above board and work towards settlement. If, however, the opposing lawyer does not communicate, creates conflict, has a client who doesn't ask questions why the behaviour...... and you have court, legal fees, and insanity.

I feel the court system supports "bad behaviour"----until court date. Then....depending on the judge...they find an excuse for the bad behaviour, or, if you have a good lawyer, and if you have been "above board" yourself, maybe, maybe you will get a good judge that will do the right thing. But it is luck of the draw on the judge......so all your good behaviour may be meaningless.

I have to say that my pre trial judge, after I explained all that I had done "above board" to bring settlement, and I begged her to help me end this nonsense, agreed that the court system has many failures that need to be addressed.

The issues with divorce court are "silent". There is no media coverage of the disaster of divorce. Most recently the Star had a little section on divorce. The article made it sound so easy to get a divorce. It was shocking.

This is a "cause" that needs advertising so that change can occur.


The judges know the system doesn't work. My lawyer admitted the system doesn't work. In theory, going through case conference, settlement conference and pre-trial is supposed to prevent people from going to trial. As we know, in the process, it wipes you out financially and emotionally. And, as my lawyer admitted, few can pay the bills for all those lovely little pre trial attempts at settlement. So yes, people just give up and give in ....even if they were willing to settle with a "win win" situation. Isn't this a very sad sad statement for all those who do the right thing (disclose, try to settle, are reasonable....) that it is such a costly waste of energy , money, emotion and time.
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Old 05-31-2014, 12:03 AM
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binding arbitration should be weighed as an option.

What most people want is someone to say who is right and who is wrong. That is the problem. Everyone plans and schemes with the thought that "a judge would view this" and "a judge would not like that." This is done from the very start before people even file motions.

If people could live without the drama (witnesses testifying) and just opted for binding arbitration it would be a whole lot cheaper. Forget the manipulative court process and just present your facts one-time in front of an arbitrator/judge and let them decide. You leave the witness out and you have to face the judge alone with your ex (and counsel if you are represented) oh gosh golly, what a terrifying thought - having to answer straight, direct questions from a judge!!!!!! [I am saying this in jest]

All of this pretrial conference crap I read about is ridiculous.... judges writing notes on the endorsements to leave coded messages to the next judge - just ridiculous IMO. I am still yet to understand WHAT IS THE POINT OF ALL OF THIS IF EVERYONE IS NOT GOING TO COOPERATE AND GIVE FULL DISCLOSURE?????

In biding arbitration you both present your facts and agree that the judge's decision is binding. Of course you have the same rights of appeal as you do in the other process if there is an error in law etc. If you don't present your facts and documents, too bad. A decision will be rendered without your details. Oh and forget about the underwear sniffing info - not relevant and will never be allowed into the briefs.

I was married for 30 yrs and divorced within 9 months. Our situation was very complicated but really just came down to the numbers. I saved tens of thousands of dollars by going this way instead of trial. Who want's their dirty linen made public anyhow?

BTW - our 30 yr divorce, business and financials and everything else was decided within one day. The decision was handed down the very same day. We went into court immediately afterwards and the judge pronounced us "divorced" DONE.


I will forever be thankful to the young lawyer I retained who pushed for this process.

Last edited by arabian; 05-31-2014 at 12:11 AM.
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Old 05-31-2014, 09:40 AM
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All of this pretrial conference crap I read about is ridiculous.... judges writing notes on the endorsements to leave coded messages to the next judge - just ridiculous IMO. I am still yet to understand WHAT IS THE POINT OF ALL OF THIS IF EVERYONE IS NOT GOING TO COOPERATE AND GIVE FULL DISCLOSURE?????




You have no idea how much I agree with you. Actually you probably do. I'm cognizant there has to be a process but shouldnt both parties at the very least have to disclose everything from the very beginning. The CC judge is supposed to give us an idea of how things may be ruled in a trial? How if one party decides not to disclose? Tayken makes the point of being represented. I get it. It IS the best way. Unfortunately some of us are too rich for LA and to poor for lawyer rates. Its not that we're "choosing" not to be represented. We can't. Simply don't have the resources. Ive been through an EM, a CC and on my way to a SC. Ive seen my daughter 3 hours in well over 3 months. I ask for mediation, ourfamilywizard, disclosure of allegation material on a regular basis. Now they want a 2 hour questioning period and probably plan to throw their materials at me an hour beforehand. Our daughters rights to have both loving parents equally in her life are definitely not at the forefront, sadly.
The process needs reform.

Last edited by LovingFather32; 05-31-2014 at 09:43 AM.
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