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Divorce Support This forum is for discussing the emotional aspects of divorce: stress, anger, betrayal of trust and more.

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-23-2013, 05:33 PM
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Somewhere along the way many women (I say this since they initiate 75% of divorces) somehow learn to romanticize divorce.
I disagree that women romanticize divorce. Most women I know that leave their marriage do it because it becomes unbearable. They are willing to take extreme risks to get out of it.

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...and in every case divorce never solves any problems, it only makes everything harder for both people... forever.
I disagree with this too. I know many happily divorced people. And I'm one of them. Divorce solved a lot of problems for me and continues to bring blessings that I didn't anticipate. I'm actually a better parent on my own and its considerably easier to do pretty much everything without my ex in my presence. Divorce continues to be one of the best decisions I've ever made. And I know I'm not the only person on this forum who is in that position.

To the OP, I understand how the change in the way that you see your child must be very difficult. Having no access to him on the off weeks with your ex is probably a lot different than what you're used to. But very few women these days get the opportunity to spend all their time with their kids...most work. In doing so, its not unusual to leave your children with caregivers. I did it for years. Be grateful that he has a wonderful caregiver, there are so many bad ones out there. And take this as an opportunity for some self-improvement. Maybe improve your skills...take some classes....Work on your health and body...Or improve your financial outlook by going back to work. Your son is being well taken care of whether he's with your ex or the nanny and that really is the most important thing. Eventually, she won't be there anymore but you will always be your child's mother...always.
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Old 09-23-2013, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
I disagree that women romanticize divorce. Most women I know that leave their marriage do it because it becomes unbearable. They are willing to take extreme risks to get out of it.
That's been the case for the women I know who have left.

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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
I disagree with this too. I know many happily divorced people. And I'm one of them.
Waves hands! Moi aussi... and frankly, I think my ex is just as happily divorced. In no world, were the two of us meant to be together for life.

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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
And take this as an opportunity for some self-improvement. Maybe improve your skills...take some classes....Work on your health and body...Or improve your financial outlook by going back to work. Your son is being well taken care of whether he's with your ex or the nanny and that really is the most important thing. Eventually, she won't be there anymore but you will always be your child's mother...always.
Can't stress the above enough, OP. You will always be his mom. Seek some help, focus on yourself during the times you don't have access.
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Old 09-24-2013, 07:58 AM
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That's been the case for the women I know who have left.
So you all honestly believe that more than 1 in 3 men are so intolerably cruel that divorce is the only option?

Since more than half of marriages end in divorce, is the only conclusion that 50% of people are sick, twisted and evil to the point that it's worth destroying families, children's futures and entire lives over it?

I can't believe that's true.

I think many people romanticize marriage and have unrealistic expectations about what it will be like, what their partners will be like, how much work it is and how much sacrifice is involved for both partners. Eventually they romanticize divorce as the solution to all their problems.

Studies point out that life was a lot better (ie higher levels of overall life satisfaction) before divorce was legal or acceptable, and mostly for women.

Last edited by FightingForFamily; 09-24-2013 at 08:51 AM.
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:40 AM
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Hi everyone, I went the the gym yesterday, read my Buddha book and went to volunteer at my 3 year olds playschool, where he talked about the peanut milkshake the nanny made him and the mouse she caught. Disheartening, but what can I do. I guess it's good he has bonded with her, I wouldn't be surprised if she becomes the next Mrs. _____. I'm so angry he hasn't bonded to me the way the other boys did. The ex took my baby and gave him to another woman. I know that if me and the nanny were lined up my son would go to her. Is up to age 5 not bonding years? Ok, I'm stuck on this. I've got an appointment today at 2 to talk to someone.
I bawled my damn eyes out before bed last night looking at the picture of my boys on the wall. My s7 & s5 I have that good natural relationship with, but that 3 year old - I feel robbed. I never tried to take their dad out of their lives and now I gotta be at peace that he and the nanny marginalized me.

I'm happier without my ex for sure. In hindsight, I should have tried to stay for 2 more years until baby was in grade 1.

Anyone have any books they can recommend?
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:58 AM
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I've got the last mediation tomorrow. My old work from 10 years ago has a maternity leave position that I can take if I want it- they need my answer by Thursday, it's full time.
Nothing is a simple answer. I've been fighting to be with my son until grade 1. Now I've got a job opportunity that will make it so I won't see him at all. I was fighting for primary, now my ex will fight for primary because I get a job.

Do I stay jobless and just keep showing up at the school and the sports to see the kids or take the job and get on with my life? Technically, for now, I could live off the $ Im getting, but I live in a frantic state.
I guess I need to calm down and see what my 2pm appointment does for me and that mediation tomorrow.
For today, i asked ex if I could take s3 to his swim lessons at 10:30, but he and nanny have it covered, so I'm off to the elementary school to hopefully volunteer. During the weeknights I have the kids, the ex just shows up to take boys to their sports, but I can't take the baby to a half hour swim lesson on his day. Should I just tell ex to beat it on my days? I'm just trying to be amicable, but I think I've just turned into a pushover.
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Old 09-24-2013, 10:58 AM
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So you all honestly believe that more than 1 in 3 men are so intolerably cruel that divorce is the only option?
My ex wasn't intolerably cruel but he was intolerably not partner material. I expected a partner that wasn't endlessly moody and angry...who participated in helping, not sabotaging my contributions to the marriage and who I could accomplish my life goals with. People are either liabilities or assets and my ex became one of the biggest liabilities to my chances of success in life. Therefore, I came to the conclusion that I'd rather take my chances without him. It was the correct decision. Maybe my standards were too high but I clearly explained my expectations over a long period of time and he didn't really care to meet them. Most women I know that have gotten divorced have simply come to the conclusion that not only can they do it on their own...they'll do it with less resentment and more ease.

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Since more than half of marriages end in divorce, is the only conclusion that 50% of people are sick, twisted and evil to the point that it's worth destroying families, children's futures and entire lives over it?
Again, that's setting the bar for partnership pretty low. And to suggest that all people that get divorced ruin their children's futures and lives is highly ridiculous. My children are doing much better with divorced parents...we were miserable together and it affected the entire household.

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...how much sacrifice is involved for both partners. Eventually they romanticize divorce as the solution to all their problems.
The issue is how unequal marriages become for many people. One person's expectations are met and the other's isn't. Its the unbalance that generally causes divorce.

Again, I don't know anyone that romanticizes divorce. Quite the opposite. Most people I know exhaust every avenue to preserve the marriage and waste a lot of time because the message is loud and clear that divorce is a nightmare.

Personally, although it didn't solve all my problems...divorce was and continues to be the solution to the problem of my marriage. I'm better off...my kids are better off...and probably my ex is better off.

Quote:
Studies point out that life was a lot better (ie higher levels of overall life satisfaction) before divorce was legal or acceptable, and mostly for women.
I guess no divorced woman I know was part of the study because it doesn't apply to my situation nor any of theirs.
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Old 09-24-2013, 11:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Karver View Post
Hi everyone, I went the the gym yesterday, read my Buddha book and went to volunteer at my 3 year olds playschool, where he talked about the peanut milkshake the nanny made him and the mouse she caught. Disheartening, but what can I do. I guess it's good he has bonded with her, I wouldn't be surprised if she becomes the next Mrs. _____. I'm so angry he hasn't bonded to me the way the other boys did. The ex took my baby and gave him to another woman. I know that if me and the nanny were lined up my son would go to her. Is up to age 5 not bonding years? Ok, I'm stuck on this. I've got an appointment today at 2 to talk to someone.
I bawled my damn eyes out before bed last night looking at the picture of my boys on the wall. My s7 & s5 I have that good natural relationship with, but that 3 year old - I feel robbed. I never tried to take their dad out of their lives and now I gotta be at peace that he and the nanny marginalized me.

I'm happier without my ex for sure. In hindsight, I should have tried to stay for 2 more years until baby was in grade 1.

Anyone have any books they can recommend?
Have you looked into counselling yet?

The problem is that everyone is robbed in divorce. Nobody wins. So your feelings of being robbed are justified however they are misplaced. If you had your son all the time he would be robbed of a relationship with his father. Again the Nanny is a big part of your childs life.

It's a delicate balance and you will find it with time. I've been doing 50/50 officially for 5 months now and I miss my kids a lot when they are gone. But I can't change it and it IS in their best interest to have that relationship with their mother. I'm sure she feels the same.

Again I now occupy my time with reffing hockey and exercise. It keeps me busy and my mind occupied with other things.

It will get easier I promise you, it does not mean however that you love your boys any less.

Find a group activity to do. Something you have never done before. You are the only person who can make you happy.
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Old 09-24-2013, 11:52 AM
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As far as taking kids to sports ....

How about on the boys' sports nights, take them yourself, but leave the house early - maybe go to the park first (or some other short stopover) so he doesn't get a chance to butt in. Tell him when you are leaving the house that you and the boys will see him there.

And if you are able, go to the little one's swimming lesson, but don't worry about the driving.
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:30 PM
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Options:

Take the ex to court to ask that the Right of First Refusal clause be enforced so that you can take care of the child when your ex is not available, instead of the nanny. Present your evidence that your ex is manipulating the terms of the current clause to prevent you from seeing the child by coming home at lunch. I suspect this won't go over very well.

Get a full time job, and insist that the child be placed in a full time daycare that is neutral to both of you, rather than being with the nanny hired by your ex. You'll be busy and independent now rather than jobhunting in two years, and you get the kid away from the nanny (which seems to be half your focus).

Take the child to every playschool and swimming lesson opportunity even when it is not your time. If your ex does this on your time, he can't argue that you shouldn't do it on his time.

Stick with what you have now, and when the child starts talking about the nanny, change the subject with a good diversion. Do fun things and enjoy the time you do have instead of lamenting the loss of the time you don't have. Use your free week to do housecleaning, research, prepare crafts, get you time, etc, so that on your kid weeks, you are able to focus fully on them.

It totally sucks that by ending a marriage that was not functioning properly, we also end up seeing our children less. It's a horrible form of collateral damage that to change the relationship with our spouse we must also change the relationship with our children. I'm sure all of us did a lot of soul-searching to make that choice. Don't second guess your motives then because of the results now. Remember what made your marriage intolerable, and know that you are in an overall better place now, despite what is happening with your child.

As for the child calling you by the nanny's name, it's not a sign of greater affection to the nanny than to you. I accidentally call my children by each other's names, I got called by my sibling's name in childhood, my children sometimes call me "dad" or the daycare lady's name all the time. It's a normal slip of the tongue and you shouldn't read more into it than that.

Honestly, what you are going through is no different than what all parents do when they return to work after parental leave, or when kids start going to school.
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Old 09-24-2013, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
Maybe my standards were too high but I clearly explained my expectations over a long period of time and he didn't really care to meet them.
It sounds like you expected your partner to change. If he was worth marrying and worth having a family with he should have met your expectations from the start without you needing to nag him about how he wasn't meeting your expectations for X years. He probably also had expectations which were not being met.

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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
My children are doing much better with divorced parents...we were miserable together and it affected the entire household.
In your opinion they may appear to be doing fine for now. The statistics suggest that as they grow up, reach adulthood and try to have their own families they will lack all the skills to do so successfully. Do I really need to quote statistics about how many people in jail were raised by single moms? Isn't it above 90%? How about success in education? In the work place? In relationships?

A simple way to put it is that people aren't going to be better than their role models. So yes, by all means let's talk about setting the bar low.

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Originally Posted by Pursuinghappiness View Post
The issue is how unequal marriages become for many people. One person's expectations are met and the other's isn't. Its the unbalance that generally causes divorce.
I agree with this 100%. As you state, the cause is expectations. Which are often not realistic. Take the typical situation:

-Husband has a good job and derives worth and expresses love for his family by working hard, occasionally travelling for business, and on average is away from the home working and commuting 11 hours per day. When he is home, he spends some time with his kids for an hour or two, playing and participating in the bed time routine. On the weekend, he dutifully visits friends and family with his wife and kids. His life is VERY full, very busy, he barely has any personal time for his own hobbies or interests, but he realizes this is married life and is pretty happy most of the time.

-Wife had a good job, but decides it would be better and save on costs to stay at home and raise the kids. She sees her husband as "free" while she feels like a prisoner at home, dealing with difficult kids, struggling to go out with them on her own, and doing endless piles of laundry... much of it her husbands clothes for work. She barely ever sees him, and when he is home, he seems more interested in spending time with the kids than with her. Why can't he at least come to bed with her instead of staying up later, wasting time on his own stupid interests (video games, reading, internet, hobby, etc). Oh, except once in awhile when he wants sex. Then all of a sudden he has an interest in her. Selfish asshole.

-So what exactly did the guy do wrong? He provided for his family, he loved his kids, he was involved in his family with the time he had. And now she will dump him, take half his stuff plus half his salary in SS and ride off into the sunset to seek greener pastures. She considers her husband "unbearable", just as you all claim. But honestly, what did he do wrong? Whose expectations were not realistic?
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