Ottawa Divorce .com Forums


User CP

New posts

Advertising

  Ottawa Divorce .com Forums > Main Category > Financial Issues

Financial Issues This forum is for discussing any of the financial issues involved in your divorce.

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2012, 05:49 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 504
frustratedwithex is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Costs for Arbitration

Arbitration award was issued and I am contemplating asking for costs.

We had already been in mediation for months and each of us made offers during this time. I then sent stbx an additional offer just prior to the start of the arbitration process.


My lawyer has e-mailed a chart to me showing the results of success.
  • successful in 3 out of 7 items.
  • mixed success in 2 out 7 items, although result is closer to my offer.
  • unsuccessful in 2 out of 7 items.
My lawyer also said that there are 2 types of costs, taxable costs and solicitor/client costs, and where I was awarded better than my offer, taxable costs double.

I am trying to figure out how to calculate how much I might be awarded but don't know where to start.

I know the amount spent on just the arbitration portion but how do I break it down into taxable costs and client/solicitor costs?

Thanks
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2012, 07:06 PM
Janus's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,341
Janus will become famous soon enough
Default

Offhand, that doesn't sound too successful...
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 10-25-2012, 11:16 PM
Tayken's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 6,563
Tayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant future
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janus View Post
Offhand, that doesn't sound too successful...
Actually that is quite good.

5/7 is better than 2/7 if there is are offers to settle that have been made that reflect the 2 "mixed success" better than the other party.

Last edited by Tayken; 10-25-2012 at 11:18 PM.
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 01:55 AM
Janus's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,341
Janus will become famous soon enough
Default

Mixed success counts as success?

The case law I keep on reading shows judges not awarding costs when there is any level of "mixed" success, as is the case here. Obviously, this is arbitration, not a trial, but I imagine that it would be similar?

Yes, you are probably going to ask me to cite the cases (as well you should), but I wasn't really tracking the cost ones, so I don't have a handy file of those decisions. I'll look around.
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 09:15 AM
Tayken's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 6,563
Tayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant future
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janus View Post
Mixed success counts as success?

The case law I keep on reading shows judges not awarding costs when there is any level of "mixed" success, as is the case here. Obviously, this is arbitration, not a trial, but I imagine that it would be similar?

Yes, you are probably going to ask me to cite the cases (as well you should), but I wasn't really tracking the cost ones, so I don't have a handy file of those decisions. I'll look around.
Janus, not to be rude, but it is clear that you do not understand how costs awards work and offers to settle.

For costs an evaluation of the Offers to Settle after the order needs to be presented and for the arbitrator (or judge) has to analyze the "mixed" results. If the person in question made an Offer to Settle in accordance with Rule 18 of the Family Law Rules that is "similar or better" then they can seek costs and more than likely will be awarded costs.

Costs would be awarded in favour of the person who made an Offer to Settle that is similar or better. So, if the OP has this material in hand, service was made in accordance with Rule 18 then the there is a high probability they will be awarded costs for (a) the work to create the offer to settle and (c) the time having to litigate a matter that a comprehensive offer already said it should be "similar" to.

The purpose of costs awards is to insure that people don't go the litigated route for matters that could have been settled.

For example:

If the Applicant's position was Sole Custody and 80-20 access.
The Respondent's position was joint custody and 50-50 access.

Order reads:

The Applicant and Respondent shall share custody of their children in the model of parallel parenting.

The Applicant shall have access to the child 60% of the time in accordance with the schedule.

The Respondent shall have access to the child 40% of the time in accordance with the schedule.

If the "Respondent" had made an offer to settle that was 50-50 full joint custody there is high probability that the Respondent will be awarded costs because they are closer to the final order than "Sole custody and 80-20 access".

Hope this helps you understand "costs awards".

Think of it like the Price is Right. If you go over you don't win. But, some times the person who bets 1$ wins because everyone was way off base in their offer to what the actual price of the item was.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 09:31 AM
Janus's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,341
Janus will become famous soon enough
Default

I never claimed that I was an expert

That said though, your example shows a single issue, where the result is in favour of one party. The OP indicated that there were 7 issues, of which only 3 were pretty much in his favour, and 2 were against. I am not sure how that makes his offer "better" in terms of awarding costs.

What am I missing?
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 01:55 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 504
frustratedwithex is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by frustratedwithex View Post
I know the amount spent on just the arbitration portion but how do I break it down into taxable costs and client/solicitor costs?

Thanks
I am still unclear on and what Taxable costs are and solicitor/client costs? As well as how to calculate?

Thanks
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 04:58 PM
Tayken's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 6,563
Tayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant future
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by frustratedwithex View Post
I am still unclear on and what Taxable costs are and solicitor/client costs? As well as how to calculate?

Thanks
Your lawyer should be doing everything up for the costs award request. No?
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 10-26-2012, 05:01 PM
Tayken's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 6,563
Tayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant futureTayken has a brilliant future
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Janus View Post
I never claimed that I was an expert

That said though, your example shows a single issue, where the result is in favour of one party. The OP indicated that there were 7 issues, of which only 3 were pretty much in his favour, and 2 were against. I am not sure how that makes his offer "better" in terms of awarding costs.

What am I missing?
3 issues with success - costs would be awarded.
2 mixed issues could all very well be awarded if the offers to settle were more reasonable and in-line with what was ordered than the other party.
2 issues were against.

3+2=5

5/7 = 71% (considering that the 2 mixed issues he gets success on)

Cost of 100,000. Other party could end up paying 71% of 100,000 of legals or 71,000.

Now this is a VERY simplified view of costs. Your best to look for "legal aid gives you wings" on CanLII to see a really complex costs order.

Good Luck!
Tayken
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 11-27-2012, 05:25 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 504
frustratedwithex is an unknown quantity at this point
Default

Before going to the expense of submitting costs directly to the arbitrator, my lawyer suggested to send a letter to ex.s lawyer and ask for less than what the arbitrator might award.

Exs. lawyer responded that he does not agree with the level of success and is instructed to offer the sum of $1.00.

I sent an offer to ex. prior to the start of the arbitration process. My lawyer refers to this offer as a Calderbank offer. This is what I based my success on.

Based on this offer I believe I was successful as follows:

Quote:
Originally Posted by frustratedwithex View Post
  • successful in 3 out of 7 items.
  • mixed success in 2 out 7 items, although result is closer to my offer.
  • unsuccessful in 2 out of 7 items.
My ex. has not referred to this offer. He has based his success on both of our positions in arbitration.

Now I need to decide if I want to submit an application for costs to the arbitrator.

I estimate the cost to submit this application will be about $3,000.

I may be awarded about $10,000. Both of these numbers are conservative.

My lawyer has told me that I will not be awarded solicitor-client costs, but a % of the schedule 'C' taxable costs.

Ex has asked for a hearing to address costs and my lawyer has suggested to submit in writing.

Question
What is the likely success of any costs being awarded, if ex is not acknowledging the Calderbank offer and wants to base success on our arbitration positions?
Closed Thread


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
COSTS: EX was ordered by Court to pay 18g in Costs, if he does not, then what? hadenough Divorce & Family Law 53 12-15-2012 02:53 PM
response to costs submissions hadenough Divorce & Family Law 3 11-16-2011 08:47 PM
Costs - How/Where Do You Ask for Costs? #1StepMom Financial Issues 12 01-10-2010 11:09 PM
UK dad being crippled by maintenance plus huge travel costs. Help! UKdad Divorce & Family Law 7 09-01-2009 09:26 PM
Legal Aid serrona Divorce & Family Law 1 10-27-2006 08:00 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 03:14 PM.