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Financial Issues This forum is for discussing any of the financial issues involved in your divorce.

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Old 12-07-2012, 06:31 AM
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Default Appraisal for a vehicle

Is it necessary to get an independent appraisal of a 12 year old vehicle to do a property settlement? I relied on the Black Book (?) value (available at CAA's website and other places) - make, year, mileage. - when I completed my 13.1 about a year ago.

As you can imagine, this value was not high - a few thousand dollars. My ex is insisting again and again that I get a proper evaluation.

Meanwhile, I have returned this vehicle to him because he refuses to sell or donate it.... or allow me to do the same.

It needs a fair amount of repairs to keep it safe and comfortable. I don't want to drive my kids in it this winter and I don't have any place to park it. (We live in a cheap rental.) I now have a new small and basic but also reliable car and pay extra for this one parking spot. (There are not enough parking spots to go around.)

Anyway, am I legally obliged to find an independent appraiser to assess the other vehicle's value? (On Kijiji similar vehicles are going for $1.5 to $3K max.) If he is so insistent on getting this vehicle appraised, can't I just claim that he has the vehicle so he is at liberty to get an appraisal?

Basically he's just holding this vehicle hostage - a tactic to control, make life difficult, etc. If I fight against this with a lawyer the legal costs will likely approach or surpass 50% the value of this dying vehicle.

Incidentally, my STBX continues to live (alone) in the matrimonial home - double car garage and driveway.
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Old 12-07-2012, 06:41 AM
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how is him having the car holding it hostage?? The car is 13 years old and not worth much. Unless its a show car then the black book value should be good enough. If not then go to a couple of car dealers to see what the trade in value would be.

Whose name is the car in?? To me the car is now in his possession so his problem if he wants the apprasial done
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Old 12-07-2012, 07:30 AM
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Registered in both names. Insured with both names on the policy - tied to a policy that covers his current vehicle it seems. The insurance company reassured me that they are aware of the situation - so now the policy cannot be cancelled w/o both parties agreement.

"Hostage" b/c he won't let me sell or donate the vehicle and he refuses to do the same. (I am aware of the procedure to transfer ownership to a relative.) He is constantly threatening to have it towed away (and bill me somehow for this) or to bring it back to my current address, etc., etc.

So you think his threats are empty - anything he does can come back and bite him too? It saps a lot of energy... dealing with someone so combative, irrational, angry, etc. Guess that's how a lot of people here feel.
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Old 12-07-2012, 08:38 AM
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Black book value seems reasonable.
It's a 12 year old vehicle. What are we talking here...$3000 to $4000 grand tops? If that?

Ask him if he wants to keep it or have it appraised, to give you half of the black book value then, and sign it over to him? If he thinks it's worth so much more (which it ain't), then he should think he's getting a deal at buying you out, at half the black book value.

One would only get an appraisal (they cost money!), when it's worth it... as "standing" already mentioned...in the case of a classic show car or something. If you had dumped a lot of custom improvements into a vehicle, that would actually raise the worth of the car.

This does not sound like it. lol.

Last edited by dad2bandm; 12-07-2012 at 08:39 AM. Reason: Corrected spelling...
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Old 12-07-2012, 09:54 AM
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The owner of the vehicle is whomsoever has the title to the vehicle.

If you cannot agree on the value of property, your options are:
1 - Take reasonable steps to ascertain the value and ask a court to rule. If he wants to say it is worth more than XXX, ask for evidence.
2 - If he says it is worth YYY, then he can pay you (median of YYY and XXX) and have the property. He paid less than he thinks it is worth while you were paid more than you thought it was worth.
3 - Sell it on the open market. Whatever dollar amount you receive is market price. Be certain to agree to this beforehand.

For vehicles, black book value is reasonable, particularly if it agrees with common public listings.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:04 AM
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I work in the industry.

For a vehicle of that vintage, Blackbook should be more than adequate. You could also try using Autotrader to find comparable models. When you do a search they actually show a range.

This is sillyness, since your Ex is fighting over maybe a 10% variance in an asset worth 3000. What is half of 10% of 3000? About the cost to get a formal appraisal.
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Old 12-07-2012, 11:42 AM
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The single biggest remaining fight I am having with my STBX is over the cars. We bought a car months before separation, which she has used exclusively for the last year. Outstanding loan on the car is higher than value of the car at this point obviously. Nonetheless, she wants it valued at black book value, whereas I want it valued at auto trader value (and, frankly, I think it should be valued at the value of the outstanding loan on the car).

Roughly

Outstanding Loan: $19,000
Auto trader: $17,000
Black Book: $12,000

So, no way in hell I am accepting a $12,000 valuation on a car that was bought for $20,000+ a year ago. Sadly, this means we will probably have to sell the car at that ridiculous $12,000 value, just trying to figure out how to sell it in a fair way now.
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:08 PM
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The fact that you owe more than its worth is quite common.
The loan should be listed in your joint debts for the NFP.

I did use an Autotrader value (median for that model and year) and it was accepted.

I bought my van two years ago for 10,995, and was given a value of $4,000 two months back. (dealer trade in). I could probably sell it on autotrader for $5,000
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DowntroddenDad View Post
The fact that you owe more than its worth is quite common.
The loan should be listed in your joint debts for the NFP.
I know, and it is

I am just irked that she got to use the car during its period of highest depreciation, and then I effectively get charged for that depreciation. At the very least, the car should be valued as it was on the separation date, but that is difficult to work out.

Either way, she is stuck on the black book value, which I obviously cannot accept, so the car will have to be sold at a substantial loss... ironically enough probably at black book value. I even offered less than auto trader value... but she just cannot appreciate the great deal she would be getting.
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Old 12-07-2012, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knave View Post

Outstanding Loan: $19,000
Auto trader: $17,000
Black Book: $12,000

So, no way in hell I am accepting a $12,000 valuation on a car that was bought for $20,000+ a year ago. Sadly, this means we will probably have to sell the car at that ridiculous $12,000 value, just trying to figure out how to sell it in a fair way now.
Within the Red Book Values, there is also a section pertaining to mileage which may offset the loss. Also the purchase agreement might have things that are value added such as extended warranty, sound/rust proofing. Any non standard items on the vehicle could also help to close the gap.
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