Ottawa Divorce .com Forums


User CP

New posts

Advertising

  Ottawa Divorce .com Forums > Main Category > Parenting Issues

Parenting Issues This forum is for discussing any of the parenting issues involved in your divorce, including parenting of step-children.

Closed Thread
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 02:31 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 17
SelfEmployedDad is on a distinguished road
Default Exchange 9 yr old son with person I have never met?

Everyone,

We have a well defined 50/50 custody order with the dates, exact time and location of the exchanges. It seems my ex is going on a vacation and asked that I take our son for 2 days. Then there was another weekend she wanted to exchange also. Of course I am willing to do this, and have done so many times. It is all documented in email and has gone smooth for a few years. However, it always is at her request, and convenience; both for the days she wants our son to be with me, and when we do the 'make up' days. I have allowed this, because it has always been fair, and worked with my schedule.

This time however, it is not fair. The 'make up days' would create huge sections of time that I would not see my son at all. So, I offered to take our son for the days she requested, (she needed an answer fast) and we could work out the 'make up days' later. She said; "No Thanks. I'll make other arrangements." That's fine.

But, here is the problem .....

I am now being asked to exchange my son with a person (friend I presume) that I have never met before. A complete stranger to me. I do NOT feel comfortable doing this. All I have is an email from my ex directing me to exchange with that person, her name, and her phone number.

What are my options?

Thanks!
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 02:33 PM
wretchedotis's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: ON
Posts: 2,317
wretchedotis is on a distinguished road
Default

If you are forewarned with the persons identitiy, and have checked their license to make sure they are the person expected...


well that's all you can do.

I went through something similar where I refused to hand over my child to a stranger. The difference being I had no fore knowledge that the situation would unfold as such. The poilice were called, and I waited with child at cop shop until Mom arrived in person.

From what I gathered listening to the cops, if I had known 'susie q' was supposed to be there in proxy of Mom, I would have been wrong to withhold the child.

Not that 'withholding' the child in that situation is that big of a deal. Withholding the child is a tactic that goes un punished in my sad experience.

That is definately not an endorsement of using that tactic, however.

Last edited by wretchedotis; 12-20-2012 at 02:41 PM.
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 02:46 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,770
dad2bandm is on a distinguished road
Default

I didn't understand if you are exchanging your son with this person, and this person is looking after your son, because Mom is gone or away? Or is this person looking after your son, until Mom gets home from work or something?

I think you are entitled to know who your son is being dropped off to. Did you ask who this person is, to find out if they are a sitter or something?
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 03:21 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Hamilton
Posts: 3,724
HammerDad will become famous soon enough
Default

Do you have a right of first refusal clause in your agreement? How long is the ex taking off?

If the need to switch was for work that is one thing. If it is for vacation, that is something entirely different.

If it is for work for their business hours, it isn't a huge issue.

But if they are taking off for 4 days vacation and leaving the child with a stranger, I'd simply state that you don't agree that the child should be with a third party instead of parent. And that you are willing to discuss making up her parenting time at a later date, but that you don't agree with her proposed schedule for makeup time. You are willing to be flexible on the matter, but should they choose to go on the vacation and to use a third party caregiver, you will use your discretion on whether you permit the child to remain with said person for the duration of their vacation.

If this because of vacation, they should choose their vacation time more wisely next time so that they go when you have the child.

Show that you are willing to be flexible and work with her, but that you don't agree that the child should remain in the care of a party who is not their parent for an extended period of time. It is a completely reasonable position.

Edit - For questions sake - if this is for vacation, and the ex will be gone, what is preventing you from calling the person the day after the ex leaves to advise them that you will be keeping your child and they don't have to worry about it any more. I mean, it sounds like the ex will be gone. Who is going to stop you from keeping your own child.

Last edited by HammerDad; 12-20-2012 at 03:24 PM.
  #5 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 04:54 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 17
SelfEmployedDad is on a distinguished road
Default

Everyone,

I do not have a right of first refusal clause in your agreement. It was left out.

I suspect that my ex is going on vacation, and will not be back in time. So, for 2 days, our son will be with someone else. It may be that the 'stranger' is only doing the 'pick up' so that the 2 other family members do not need to interact with me. The ex brother-in-law has mental health issues and is an inch away from a restraining order for his past behaviour, and I am sure my ex wants to avoid any chance for him to 'snap'. (As do I.) The ex mother-in-law is not healthy, and can't drive.

So, I have no idea if my son will be with the extended family, or the 'stranger'. All I know, is that it won't be his Mom.

Having said that, in the past, I have dropped off our son at my ex-mother-in-law's house, but that seems to not have been an option. This leads me to believe that the ex-mother-in-law is either away, or not healthy enough to look after our son.

I guess I could counter with the statement that I am not comfortable giving custody to a 'stranger', and that I would be happy to drop our son off at her mother's house and see what the response is.

All advice (critical or otherwise) is appreciated!

Thanks
  #6 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 05:26 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 17
SelfEmployedDad is on a distinguished road
Default

I have learned more. The ex-mother-in-law is going on vacation with my ex. I do know the 'stranger'. It was years ago I met her. She is a friend of my ex, that has a daughter his age.

I asked my son if he would rather be here those 2 days, or with Mommy's friends, and that single question caused him to vent a 'boat load' of stuff he had been told - that he didn't like - about schedule changes. He was clearly frustrated trying to keep all the 'reasons' straight in his head.

So, I no longer have a 'safety issue' with the person picking him up at the exchange, or the family he will be with (single Mom and her daughter) but it makes ZERO sense.

I can't see how it is in the best interest of my son, to be with those people instead of with me. I offered 'make-up' days. I just didn't agree to the ones she was 'dictating' to me.

When I asked my son if he would rather spend time with the friends family or stay here - of course it was a 'no-brainer' for him too.

So, this has now simplified to knowing what the courts would expect in such a scenario. There is no 'first-refusal' clause in the agreement, but it is not stated at all - that it is in force or not. The agreement does say that the PARENTS will do the exchange. It has been that way for about 5 years - NEVER with anyone else acting as 'proxy'.

Thoughts?
  #7 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 07:16 PM
OhMy's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 412
OhMy is on a distinguished road
Default

'When I asked my son if he would rather spend time with the friends family or stay here - of course it was a 'no-brainer' for him too.'

Sorry to hear of your dilemma. However;
1) you have no clause regarding right of first refusal.
2) whether or not you knew the alternate care giver is irrelevant. Your co parent trusts this person. (I do understand your concern though).
3) you have involved you son in this matter- which is highly frowned upon. Every child will tell their parent what they think their parent wants to hear... His response was normal. Adults should not involve children of this age in matters such as this.
4) step back and see if any of your own responses may have continued the trigger response.

I truly hope it all works out. Best of luck.
  #8 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 08:34 PM
wretchedotis's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: ON
Posts: 2,317
wretchedotis is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SelfEmployedDad View Post
I have learned more. The ex-mother-in-law is going on vacation with my ex. I do know the 'stranger'. It was years ago I met her. She is a friend of my ex, that has a daughter his age.

I asked my son if he would rather be here those 2 days, or with Mommy's friends, and that single question caused him to vent a 'boat load' of stuff he had been told - that he didn't like - about schedule changes. He was clearly frustrated trying to keep all the 'reasons' straight in his head.

So, I no longer have a 'safety issue' with the person picking him up at the exchange, or the family he will be with (single Mom and her daughter) but it makes ZERO sense.

I can't see how it is in the best interest of my son, to be with those people instead of with me. I offered 'make-up' days. I just didn't agree to the ones she was 'dictating' to me.

When I asked my son if he would rather spend time with the friends family or stay here - of course it was a 'no-brainer' for him too.

So, this has now simplified to knowing what the courts would expect in such a scenario. There is no 'first-refusal' clause in the agreement, but it is not stated at all - that it is in force or not. The agreement does say that the PARENTS will do the exchange. It has been that way for about 5 years - NEVER with anyone else acting as 'proxy'.

Thoughts?
I would say, as much as it sucks - her time is her time. She can arrange ccare for him during that period as she see's fitting.

You could send a letter/email saying the situation has come to your attention and that you would prefer to ct as caretaer for future similar instances, but she is under no obligation to do so.

So be nice, ask nice, nd maybe you'll get it.

Or, fight hard, make a fuss, go to court, pay the money, and maybe you'll get it.
  #9 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 08:36 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 17
SelfEmployedDad is on a distinguished road
Default

" you have involved you son in this matter- which is highly frowned upon. Every child will tell their parent what they think their parent wants to hear... His response was normal. Adults should not involve children of this age in matters such as this."

I agree it is wrong, and I avoid it at all costs. However, it is not frowned upon in the courts. Based on my experience, my ex is REWARDED for doing that. OVER and OVER again. Anyway, based on his response, OH MAN he is being hugely manipulated by my ex. Ugh.
  #10 (permalink)  
Old 12-20-2012, 08:49 PM
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 17
SelfEmployedDad is on a distinguished road
Default

"So be nice, ask nice, and maybe you'll get it."

I am always nice. I never get [insert any request here], unless it is in her favour.

"Or, fight hard, make a fuss, go to court, pay the money, and maybe you'll get it."

I refuse to pay a lawyer a dime any more. It always is a waste.

I understand your point, but I have always been nice. Too nice. Too cooperative. There comes a point where always being nice means no one 'wins'. I want at least ONE 'winner'; our son. So, my position on this issue is to leave the schedule as it is, or he stays with me those 2 days, and we decide the 'make-up' days together later.

The latter option gives her more time with our son, but she is refusing it because she can't dictate the specific days. So, her having 'control' is more important than her time with our son. Pathetic.
Closed Thread

Tags
exchange


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can I serve my ex when they have a lawyer billm Divorce & Family Law 39 08-09-2013 08:47 PM
Sponsorship Breakdown Tinkbug Financial Issues 63 07-11-2012 01:46 PM
Ex Misbehaving at Exchange Teddie Divorce & Family Law 10 11-10-2011 09:54 AM
Should He Exchange Financials - Vote now (please) newone Financial Issues 4 06-02-2011 07:26 AM
Person to Person Costs Hephzibah Financial Issues 4 05-26-2010 06:12 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:35 PM.