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-   -   Request for children's counselor to report. (http://www.ottawadivorce.com/forum/f3/request-childrens-counselor-report-21287/)

Trix 08-24-2017 05:04 PM

Request for children's counselor to report.
 
OP has filed for sole custody. (We presently ..and for 8 years...have been 50/50)

I have responded with a request for OCL as things are extremely complicated. She is doing everything she can to avoid the OCL and the possibility of an 'interests of the child' assessment

OP position is that the principle matter should be their wishes alone and wants our daughters counselor to report on the wishes of our daughters (D10 and D13) to determine the best go forward schedule.

There is signifcant concern about the incosistencies in both behaviour and what is expressed byour daughters when with her mom (as expressed by myself, CAS and OP's own family). And an assessment would serve to shed light on that nd a number of other concerns.

My question, though, is primarily procedural:

I do not want our daughters role of autonomous support to be undermined by 'reporting' what our daughters say. It is a piece of information though (even if influenced)

Is it accurate that, as part of any process undertaken by the OCL, information may be obtained from their counsellor in such a manner where the integrity of the relationship between the children and the counselor can be maintined?

I would like that to be part of my response, but I'm not sure if it is accurate.

Tayken 08-25-2017 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
I have responded with a request for OCL as things are extremely complicated. She is doing everything she can to avoid the OCL and the possibility of an 'interests of the child' assessment

To be frank. OCL will not be a good thing for you as a parent. OCL is not magical and frankly under qualified. Furthermore, often the more lighter approach of a interests assessment with a mediator is faster, better, cheaper and creates less conflict at times if you HAVE TO have an assessment.

Section 30 and OCL are a waste of time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
OP position is that the principle matter should be their wishes alone and wants our daughters counselor to report on the wishes of our daughters (D10 and D13) to determine the best go forward schedule.

Actually, this is a good recommendation. But, generally they won't comment on it. You should ask the counsellor for a recommendation for someone out of the practice that can do the assessment.

The children are too old to deal with OCL or a Section 30. The 13 year old will be heard by the court and by the time it makes trial the child will be 14+... and the game changes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
There is signifcant concern about the incosistencies in both behaviour and what is expressed byour daughters when with her mom (as expressed by myself, CAS and OP's own family). And an assessment would serve to shed light on that nd a number of other concerns.

No it won't. It will inflame conflict significantly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
My question, though, is primarily procedural:

I do not want our daughters role of autonomous support to be undermined by 'reporting' what our daughters say. It is a piece of information though (even if influenced)

See my recommendation above.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
Is it accurate that, as part of any process undertaken by the OCL, information may be obtained from their counselor in such a manner where the integrity of the relationship between the children and the counselor can be maintained?

Actually, at those ages both children (if deemed by the medical practitioner) are old enough to lock those records so neither parent nor the court can obtain the records. There is no age of consent. Be very careful with this. A smart 13 year old can lock you out. I have assisted 11 year old children in locking their medical records from nosy parents and OCL investigators. One call to the Kids Help Line and the kid will be armed with all the info on their rights about their medical records.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trix (Post 223057)
I would like that to be part of my response, but I'm not sure if it is accurate.

OCL is a waste of time, money and will only create conflict.

Trix 08-25-2017 10:00 AM

I don't know that there is much choice.

CAS is involved with our family. Over a period of seven months we worked "voluntarily" with them to stabilize our family routine and it was working.

As it advanced, OP began throwing up roadblock after roadblock, finally refusing to follow their recommendations and finally undermining the entire process completely and filing for sole custody with an incredible reduction in time spent together.

Her motion actually reads "access to reflect the wishes of the children".

We had noticed her involvement in all of our daughters counselling session where she had, for years, been completely uninvolved. She also started petitioning, in recent weeks, friends and family members for letters reporting one what our daughters had expressed to them.

In particular one of her parents had approached me stating that they had a conversation with our children where, our children had, at the suggestion of OP, made specific statements which the parent had felt were rehearsed. OP then requested a letter. Not only was the letter not provided, they were so concerned about the nature of this and other events that they themselves approached the CAS worker.

Our daughters are slowly but surely being isolated from their family. OP is estranged from her brother, so our children have NEVER met their cousins and no longer see their only uncle. They are now again limited in seeing grandparents (for the third time...two years in the past).

OP is now looking to rip into our relationship. Again.

So the way I see it I have a choice: I can engage in a full fledged custody battle and let fly with everything I know (not believe but know) or provide a forum for everybody else to be heard.

In the end, it's not that I don't want the counselor to be heard, I don't want to undermine our daughter's relationship with their counselor, and where OP won't consent to releasing CAS records etc, I think there needs to be a much much more complete context given to the court if this is going to go forward to make a decision that will affect our daughter's future, and where, presently, OP has it that it is their word alone that would be responsible for making it happen.

To be clear, our time together is, by and large, exceptional, cutting it by two thirds is absurd.

Finally, OP refused to attend mediation of any type, although provisions for such were laid out in our divorce agreement. Something she will have to answer for if she continues forward.

In the end, I don't want to fight, she won't talk, our daughters were suffering and I don't want to focus on the conflict, I want to focus on our daughters.

denbigh 08-25-2017 12:10 PM

Quote:

In the end, it's not that I don't want the counselor to be heard, I don't want to undermine our daughter's relationship with their counselor, and where OP won't consent to releasing CAS records etc, I think there needs to be a much much more complete context given to the court if this is going to go forward to make a decision that will affect our daughter's future, and where, presently, OP has it that it is their word alone that would be responsible for making it happen.
I think it is entirely understandable that if the counsellor is reporting on what child says in counselling it would seriously undermine the childs trust in the counsellor, unless the child knew and consented. Isn't that is what a voice of childrens report is for? I am not sure what OCL is, but I thought it was like a voice of children report, To have a third party express the child's point of view? Or could you have a third party counsellor interview the child and do that?

I am confused why a parent would have to consent to having CAS (is that the child welfare people?) records released. If a parent is behaving in a way detriment to the child, it seems likely the parent would never consent, yet that is very important information for a court to know, I assumed they could say things to a court without consent.


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