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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2015, 01:18 PM
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Thank you to those who took the time to look at my history. FYI I have only once called CAS myself, when she told me of abuse. I quickly learned that it does no good. He has called on me numerous times out of revenge. There has never been a concern on their part for my care.
I am not trying to instigate or escalate anything. That may not be apparent from this post, but I have tried for 6 years to establish a proper co-parenting relationship. At this point I don't know if working towards cooperation is going to be effective, or if it is time to protect my child. If it is protection, how do I protect a child who rejects every attempt I make?

Look, I was abused by this person for 15 years and now another 6 as separated. By no means can I say I am perfect or I have done everything right. BUT, I did what i could to encourage change and a relationship with her dad. It is his responsibility to do the same for me, and he does not by constantly belittling everything I do and making accusations and undermining her relationship with me. It has gotten to the point where I can no longer defend his actions to her and yes, I have walked her towards a conclusion that the way he is treating her is wrong. But I have never put the words in her head. It has always been that i talk to her about the way people should treat each other and she has walked herself to that conclusion herself. My child does know it is not right (shes almost 9), but also has no idea how she can change her situation.

The situation is this: she loves her dad (as she should) but she realizes things are not going well. She is scared of his anger, she has said so many times. She has said she is afraid to do something wrong, and has said she thinks dad will stop loving her. That is NORMAL reaction for a child her age (children think everything is about them no matter whether it is or isn't). So to her the fear of dad fulfilling his threat and losing her dad overrides everything. She knows explicitly that I will love her no matter what she does wrong, and so the lesser evil is to please dad however she can and deal with whatever anger or hurt she does to mom. Because she is already sure that mom loves her unconditionally.


Yes my kids is as healthy as any other. She does not have a best friend, she has friends but has a belief that she is being singled out and bullied constantly. In my opinion and her teachers it is irrational and she is treated quite normally just like the rest of the kids. I suspect this is a reflection of her home state and not her peers.

Yes, I do have material change to request court action. I just dont know if that is the route that will effect a permanent improvement. It certainly wont make anything better right away.

My question to all of you is what do i do next?
Do you know of resources to get her to open up, to help her deal with the situation, to get her help. How do I get a child to talk (about this or just her depression and anger) when she is so dead-set against counselling.

FYI, I did enroll her in Brownies and she has been going for a year. It is her biggest love. She has done self esteem programs with Rainbows, has gone through something similar at 5 with an abuse program for moms and kids.
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
I think YOU need to seek some professional counselling and support first.
I completely agree. I am on several waiting lists and am working with a friend who is a qualified life coach and deals with relationship issues. I am a work in progress and have been working on this for years. But I can't fix him. Dealing with him and creating cooperation and safety for her is my primary concern.
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by standing on the sidelines View Post
ugh you are worried about your kids mental and emotional health yet you tell her that "I explained to her that dad is saving up all those lies and eventually the judge will take her away from me." That puts even more pressure on the kid. Now the poor thing probably doesn't know what to do. She is going to try and please everyone and it will tear her apart.
Yes it will. She has been talking about being pulled and tugged at for well over two years. I told her this Thursday evening. It was by no means put into her head as she already has voiced many times that is what is happening. It was an acknowledgement that I know it is happening and the reality of what lying to him will do. Maybe not a good move on my part and i regretted it instantly. But at least I am being honest about my mistakes so that I can get proper help here.
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
From the outside-looking-inside it seems that you are fear-mongering your child so you are no better than the other parent.

I would recommend a form of family therapy.

The text-messaging with your ex is getting you where?

Avoidance of counselling and delving into cell phone texting so that you can avoid face-to-face response seems to be your way of communication. It doesn't work.

Once you put up a retainer the lawyer will tell you whatever you want to hear.

Kid needs counselling after the parents have calmed down and sought their own sort of counselling/mediation. How would a counsellor advise a child to deal with warring parents? Duck?
How long should it take for a parent to calm down? is 6 years long enough? Do you actually recommend family counselling to a parent who was abused and continues to be manipulated and controlled that long after separation? I appreciate your advice, and agree it is a good idea for most parents.

Texting is a horrible form of communication. We have tried sitting down and half the time it ends in arguing. Not exactly effective. I have asked repeated for his email address and yet he wont give it. I have requested, ordered huim to stop texting me, have blocked him fro short periods of time. If I go back to court I will ask for an email monitoring program. They used to recommed Family Wizard. I don't want to stop communication but to keep it relevant. Not getting texts telling me how he didn't like my ex-boyfriend (who I have not seen in 3 years) or that I am a bad mom because I forgot to send her a spoon in her lunch.
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:31 PM
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I can see Arabian that you are still a judgemental ass and can't be bothered to go back in the history or actually try to help solve a problem. Some people never change
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
WTF? Gatekeeper/control freakish?
I can see Arabian that you are still a judgemental ass and can't be bothered to go back in the history or actually try to help solve a problem. Some people never change
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Old 06-07-2015, 01:53 PM
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You really need to understand the single most important thing going through your childs head right now -- SURVIVAL. She is trying her best to keep her head above water in a major battle between two grown ups. If you think dealing with your ex is bad, imagine a child dealing with that AND what it does to you. Then remember that she is trying desperately to make sure SHE is not also causing problems. You need to wrap your head around what she is FEELING as a result of her parents ACTIONS.

The two of you need to stop fighting. You need to stop allowing him to bait you. You need to stop feeding him. All of those actions are leading to upset for her. She is a prisoner of your divorce. Even if your ex husband doesnt get it and is intent on making your life hell you have to find a way to not feed whatever he does that has a direct impact on your child.

If court action to change custody is needed fine, do that. If you need court action to get her into therapy then do that. Whatever it takes you have to get supports in place for your daughter. If that means getting supports in place for you NOW so you are strong enough THEN, do it.

The bottom line is by fighting with your ex you are making your daughters life much worse. Think of her as a hostage. Do you continue to anger the hostage holder or do you negotiate?

You survived his abuse. You can do this for your daughter.
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Old 06-07-2015, 02:35 PM
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THANK YOU Rockscan. That is exactly what I am struggling to do. I am part of the problem and part of the solution. It is difficult sometimes to put my own emotions aside and deal with this rationally, but i do my very best. Your encouragement and straight advice is appreciated

At this point based on a talk with my coach today, I have decided that I will ask him for a meeting in a public place with the limited topic of how we can handle the different stories we are each getting from her. I will suggest getting her counselling jointly, and offer that I will be getting my own help and ask that he also do the same.

My coach has suggested that we have our daughter present for the initial part of this conversation, so she can see that we are in fact working together and also to gauge her reaction to the different stories at each house issue. I think some place like McDs will work, as we can send her into the playground and she will not be part of the main discussion.

If things go well then I may also suggest we move towards a bi-weekly email or phone call for issues that are not time sensitive. I'm being coached on establishing boundaries. Up until now I have gotten overwhelmed trying to do this and have allowed him to cross them over and over. It certainly helps to have someone coaching me.

Honestly, the easiest way to deal with this would be to take it back to court and go after full custody. But I don't want my daughter to learn that the way to deal with a problem is to go into attack mode. She already has a bad example teaching her that. It certainly is an option I won't put aside, but I have to continue fighting to make this work, at least a little longer until I KNOW that I gave it every chance I could to make it work for her.

I would appreciate any further feedback or suggestions. We are in Vaughan and Brampton so if anyone has a good resource to recommend I would really love to look into it. Thanks!
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 06-07-2015, 02:53 PM
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Court isnt a bad idea if you both are working at improving yourselves. There is an option of therapy being ordered for both of you separately and as a family together. If your ex is an abusive person his abuse doesnt stop with you and he may not understand he is abusing his child. Many people have the misconception of what physical or emotional abuse is. Saying things about you to his child or putting her in the middle IS ABUSE. You telling him is not effective. A judge telling him may hold more weight.

It sounds like you are moving in the right direction, its just a matter of getting him on board. That may be the hardest part. Hopefully he has enough caring for his child that he is willing to work together with you but from what youve said, I cant see him agreeing. Good luck!
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Old 06-07-2015, 03:12 PM
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Originally Posted by billiechic View Post
I can see Arabian that you are still a judgemental ass and can't be bothered to go back in the history or actually try to help solve a problem. Some people never change
Name calling is not a good thing. If this is how you deal with your ex when under pressure then it's no wonder you have issues.

Actually I did look at some of your posts from 2009. You have been a self-described victim of abuse from your ex for over a decade now?

There are many people who have posted on this forum over the years who have said that they are victims of spousal abuse. Fortunately courts are on to people (notably women) who allege this only to try to get an advantage in child custody disputes. So I'd be cautious about using the term "victim of abuse" cautiously as the onus will be on you to prove the abuse should you end up in court. Allegations of 6 years of abuse AFTER you are no longer living with your ex will definitely raise some eyebrows.

With that said I think it's not uncommon for a young child who is in the middle of an ongoing high-conflict relationship between parents to try to say whatever the child perceives the parent wants to hear at any given time (just like sleaze-bag lawyers tell clients what they want to hear rather than the cold, hard truth). And, yes, your daughter might be struggling with balancing how to love her father but not let you know. You say you are happy that your daughter loves her father but somehow that sounds disingenuous.

Maybe you have to quit trying so hard to control the situation? You sound quite anxious... almost hysterical.
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