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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2017, 01:13 AM
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I think it would be highly inappropriate (and likely not permissible by presiding judge) to use a laptop to take notes. You have to be prepared to discuss your manner in a frank and open manner and "props" won't help you evade direct discussion or questioning. I visualize your face in the laptop, not making eye contact or, worse, you telling everyone to "hang on" while you slowly type things into your computer.... this just wouldn't be conducive to effective problem-solving.

I would think that trying to set a CC at the same time as a SC would mean they want to come to a resolution but failing that they want to proceed to discuss trial arrangements. In other words, they have concerns that it is you that would be the one to stall things and they want to move on (to trial if need be).

You could perhaps use your brief as an outline for specific topics you would like to focus on. Preparation of a simple outline of the major points in your brief would be helpful? I think it would be useful to remember that the judge will be conducting and directing the conference and you should be prepared (know your material).

Go with the attitude that you want to resolve issues and that you are reasonable.
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Old 01-27-2017, 10:16 PM
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Totally agree, thanks for the input

Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
I think it would be highly inappropriate (and likely not permissible by presiding judge) to use a laptop to take notes. You have to be prepared to discuss your manner in a frank and open manner and "props" won't help you evade direct discussion or questioning. I visualize your face in the laptop, not making eye contact or, worse, you telling everyone to "hang on" while you slowly type things into your computer.... this just wouldn't be conducive to effective problem-solving.
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Old 01-27-2017, 10:55 PM
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Here's a brief outline of what I want to discuss...

Access
  • The current access schedule is not in the best interest of the children
  • The applicant is willing to amending the Access schedule on her terms only
  • Offer to extend Mondays and Wednesday until 8pm
  • Offer to extend Mondays and Wednesday until 8pm only on days the respondent has access and the applicant works
  • The current access schedule was based on a recommendation by the (OCL)
  • The OCL report was drafted when the Application was on Maternity leave
  • The fact the applicant claimed to be the primary caregiver
  • A2 was less than 1yr old
  • False allegations and collaborated efforts (neighbours)
  • Failed to see the result of the current schedule when the applicant returns to work
  • Prior to the separation
  • The respondent and applicant jointly cared for the children
  • The respondent would care for the children during the application work rotation.
  • The applicants parents rarely cared for A5 (1 occasion)
  • The respondent parents would care for the children if needed.
  • Since the Separation
  • The applicant, her parents, the respondent, school/daycare and NOW the 3rd party caregiver
  • Talk about CALENDAR
  • The current schedule offers no routine for the children and who cares for them
  • The children are constantly asking the respondent who’s picking them up at the end of the respondent access.
  • When the applicant is picking up the children the children constantly ask if the grandparents are there.
  • The school teacher suggested we provided the children with a visual calendar
  • The applicant schedule is based on shift work 4 x12hrs shifts 2Day Shifts and 2 Night Shifts
  • The morning of her 1st shift the applicant can no longer care for the children
  • The children’s routine is from 6:00am (awake) until 7:30-8:00 bed
  • During these times the applicant is either going to work , at work or coming back
  • The children are not in her care.
  • If the respondent has access; parents or caregiver pickup children
  • This is true for the 1st two day shifts in her rotation
  • The 3rd day a night shift, the applicant must rest during the day
  • The children are not in her care.
  • If the respondent has access; parents or caregiver pickup children

Temporary Day Care:
  • The applicant claims there’s no material change
  • The applicants parents are no longer a viable resources for care
  • The applicant hired a temporary caregiver as her parents could no longer provide care
  • Since being served with the motion Dec 12/2016
  • The applicant parents are now available to provide care
  • This is not a feasible solution; the applicant will eventually need help caring for the children again
  • The temporary caregiver services are still being used
  • On Jan 1st the applicant asked the respondent to drop off the boys at the end of his access. The applicant was working and the 3rd party caregiver.
  • On Jan 13th the application called the respondent to inform him A2 has a candy stuck in his nose and was going to CHEO. During the phone conversation the Respondent spoke with A5 who said the 3rd party caregiver was at home
  • The applicant is now further creating a change by mixing her parents and the 3rd party caregiver
  • The respondents proposed schedule is in the best interest of the children; allowing them maximum contact with both parents
  • The proposed schedule is the a viable solution to eliminate the need for 3rd party caregivers
  • The proposed schedule was in effect prior to the separation
  • The proposed schedule would benefit the children, the applicant and respondent
  • The proposed schedule would allow the applicant to spend more “quality” time with the children

Denying Access:
  • The applicant claims value the importance of the respondant in the children's life however;
  • The applicant fails to acknowledge the respondents request for more access and his abilities to care for the children.
  • The applicant unilaterally choose to allow 3rd parties to care for the children when she works
  • The applicant has denied access on multiple occasions; More recently
  • Jan 20th the repondant finished work early, he contacted the applicant to pick up the children early 3:30 as oppsed to 4:00. The applicant informed the respondent that A2 was sleeping. However the applicant was at work and her parents were caring for the children.
  • During the Christmas holidays, the respondent asked the applicant if A2 could stay overnight as opposed to the current access schedule which would have been A2 was to return to the applicant at 7:30. Regardless of the fact that the children have not been separated for months. The applicant denied this request. Furthermore on the 2 day of the Xmas schedule
  • The applicant denies access to the paternal grandparents and limits it to the time the respondent has access.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:33 PM
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I like your format - not sure about the content though. If this outline is for your own personal use I guess that's ok. However, if you want something that you can slide across the the table to others participating in the discussion you should look to edit it to be less accusatory and more positive.

For example, think "child-focused" when you write.

Your statement:

During the Christmas holidays, the respondent asked the applicant if A2 could stay overnight as opposed to the current access schedule which would have been A2 was to return to the applicant at 7:30. Regardless of the fact that the children have not been separated for months. The applicant denied this request. Furthermore on the 2 day of the Xmas schedule

I think you have to keep the accusatory stuff at bay. After all, is this not a settlement conference where the two of you are supposed to find some common ground?

Try to find less-combative points which show you are all for resolving problems: "...the following is put forward as a suggestion for resolving issues of access schedule: .........." and so on. I'm not sure if I'm getting my point across. What I'm trying to say is that you might try to at least appear to be trying to be offering SOLUTIONS to issues. From what I've read in child custody litigation, this is a very important thing that judges look to: ability to work out problems... reasonableness of individual parties.

Others will have much more relevant input than me I'm sure.

Last edited by arabian; 01-27-2017 at 11:37 PM.
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:59 PM
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Thanks. Was lots of work to format on this site. Thank god im a geek

These are my personal notes to make sure I keep on track. They are high level items I pulled from my case brief.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
I like your format - not sure about the content though. If this outline is for your own personal use I guess that's ok. However, if you want something that you can slide across the the table to others participating in the discussion you should look to edit it to be less accusatory and more positive.
I totally agree and this is my concern.

I want to be focused on the best interest of the children and resolving in order to help them and her have more time. Currently most of her time is spent working and not caring for the children. Furthermore on days where's she's off. I typically have access.

Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
For example, think "child-focused" when you write.

Your statement:

During the Christmas holidays, the respondent asked the applicant if A2 could stay overnight as opposed to the current access schedule which would have been A2 was to return to the applicant at 7:30. Regardless of the fact that the children have not been separated for months. The applicant denied this request. Furthermore on the 2 day of the Xmas schedule

I think you have to keep the accusatory stuff at bay. After all, is this not a settlement conference where the two of you are supposed to find some common ground?

Try to find less-combative points which show you are all for resolving problems: "...the following is put forward as a suggestion for resolving issues of access schedule: .........." and so on. I'm not sure if I'm getting my point across. What I'm trying to say is that you might try to at least appear to be trying to be offering SOLUTIONS to issues. From what I've read in child custody litigation, this is a very important thing that judges look to: ability to work out problems... reasonableness of individual parties.

That's what I'm shooting for . Keep them coming.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
Others will have much more relevant input than me I'm sure.





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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2017, 12:14 AM
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Forgot to mention this is a Case Conference...

Quote:
Originally Posted by arabian View Post
. After all, is this not a settlement conference where the two of you are supposed to find some common ground?
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2017, 01:00 AM
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Okay I printed out your thing.

I think you can shorten things up considerably.

Access Schedule:
- The current schedule is not in the best interest of the children (because.... - one brief sentence).
- The schedule (based on recommendation from OCL) was drafted at the time when Applicant was on Maternity leave.
- The schedule did not contemplate the Applicant returning to work.
- The Applicant is proposing to extend Monday & Wednesday until 8:00 PM (days respondent has access and applicant works).
- The Respondent is proposing: xxx

History

- prior to separation the infant child (DOB xxxx) was jointly/equally cared for by the Respondent and the Applicant with no external child care.
- grandparents did not provide regular, significant child care on a ongoing basis (or did they?).

Current Situation:
- The Applicant has returned to work. The Applicant works shifts (2 days/2 nights).
- The Children's wake/sleep routine is 6:00 AM - 7:30 PM (any naps?).
- Up until December 12th, 2016 the Applicant retained the services of (name Daycare).
- In addition, since December 12th 2016 the Applicant has relied heavily on her parents to provide child care.
- the child is currently in child care (XXX hrs/day/week) despite the Respondent's desire and availability to care for his children.

Access Denied

- The Applicant has denied access to the Respondent through the Christmas Holidays (2016) as well as on January 20th.
- Applicant will only allow the paternal grandparents (Respondent's parents) access to the children during the Respondent's access time.

Looking forward - Maximum Contact Principal

- The Respondent is a capable, loving Father who wants to have a significant role in the raising of his children.
- The Respondent seeks to work harmoniously with the Applicant to foster a positive parenting schedule which acknowledges importance of role of both parents in children's future.

etc.

I'd really try (I know it's hard) to keep mud-slinging out.
Some things in your points seemed to contradict so be very careful.
I think if you come across as a humble, generous person (even though you want to choke her LOL) who realizes that parenting isn't a game of perfect, you will do fine.

You might want to lay out some things about your willingness to attend "parenting after separation" courses with her in the future and that you are open to explore any other ideas she has .... You end up looking really, really good and sincere.

Last edited by arabian; 01-28-2017 at 01:03 AM.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2017, 01:33 AM
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Background:

The applicant and I married on x day. We lived together after marriage.

when we lived together, i was a very attentive father and cared for our child equally. There was never any concerns of my parenting when we lived together.

persuant to orde of J hokinpuks, i have access as follows:

the orde was influenced by an ocl report. The OCL report was drafted when the Application was on Maternity leave and the child was approximately 8 months old


Access
The current access schedule is not in the best interest of the children

The applicant is willing to amending the Access schedule to extend Mondays and Wednesday until 8pm on the days that she works

The current schedule offers no routine for the children and does not specify who cares with the children. The child is often confused as to who is picking him up. The school teacher suggested we provided the children with a visual calendar to help her. I firmly believe that the pickup and drop offs should be implemented in a consistent routine.


Changes in circumstance:


the judgment was structured upon the tender years of the children. If the parties had contemplated the children attending school, it is anticipated that detailed provisions relating to the sharing of school holidays and alternate arrangements for pickup and return of the children would have been included in the agreement.

i. [The child] is no longer a baby. She is of an age where it is reasonable for her to spend more time away from her mother and has a need to spend more time with her father.

The father’s work schedule has changed such that he is now able to provide full-time care on a predictable schedule and thus his ability to meet [the child’s] needs has changed in a fundamental way.

The applicant has retained employment with long shift works which includes a combination of nights and day shifts, leaving the child with daycare for extended periods of time. This is a very significatn material change, which if known at hte time, would have resulted in a different order.

The applicant schedule is based on 12hrs shift works. She works 2Day Shifts and 2 Night Shifts.


The applicant parents are now available to provide care. I believe this is time that the child should enjoy with me as his.her parent.

efforts to increase access
The applicant has a history of denying me any extra time with our child.

Jan 20th I finished work early and contacted the applicant to pick up the children early 3:30 as oppsed to 4:00. The applicant informed the respondent that A2 was sleeping. However the applicant was at work and her parents were caring for the children.

I asked for overnight access during Christmas of 2015. The applicant denied this request. Furthermore on the 2 day of the Xmas schedule. THis concerns me because the applicant is unilaterally setitng our times with our child without any concern of my wishes.

The applicant has made unfounded allegations agiainst me

conclusion

The respondents proposed schedule is in the best interest of the children; allowing them maximum contact with both parents

The proposed schedule is the a viable solution to eliminate the need for 3rd party caregivers

The proposed schedule was in effect prior to the separation

The proposed schedule would benefit the children, the applicant and respondent

The proposed schedule would allow the applicant to enjoy a meaningful and continious contact with the children


And I strongly urge you to read up all of the case law and referenced articles posted in the 50-50 debate thread.

and get a good lawyer to read over all that

Last edited by trinton; 01-28-2017 at 01:46 AM.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2017, 10:56 AM
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Good morning.

I'm having a hard time locating a link to the family law article online.

I have found the CLRA link off another post on this site.

I found snip it's of the family laws.

What i`m looking for is section that should be applied when making a judgement on my motion.

16(10) of the Divorce Act which states “the court shall give effect to the principle that the child of the marriage should have as much contact with each spouse as is consistent with the best interests of the child.”

My oldest son keeps asking to be with me. I know he's young. However his mother denies him this.


Article 9(1): States Parties shall ensure that a child shall not be separated from his or her parents against their will, except when competent authorities subject to judicial review determine, in accordance with applicable law and procedures, that such separation is necessary for the best interests of the child. Such determination may be necessary in a particular case such as one involving abuse or neglect of the child by the parents, or one where the parents are living separately and a decision must be made as to the child’s place of residence.

Article 9(3): States Parties shall respect the right of the child who is separated from one or both parents to maintain personal relations and direct contact with both parents on a regular basis, except if it is contrary to the child’s best interests.

I read somewhere a subsection where what ever the parent did previously would not be held against him. Not that I did anything wrong. But would like to reference it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by trinton View Post
Background:

The applicant and I married on x day. We lived together after marriage.

when we lived together, i was a very attentive father and cared for our child equally. There was never any concerns of my parenting when we lived together.

persuant to orde of J hokinpuks, i have access as follows:

the orde was influenced by an ocl report. The OCL report was drafted when the Application was on Maternity leave and the child was approximately 8 months old


Access
The current access schedule is not in the best interest of the children

The applicant is willing to amending the Access schedule to extend Mondays and Wednesday until 8pm on the days that she works

The current schedule offers no routine for the children and does not specify who cares with the children. The child is often confused as to who is picking him up. The school teacher suggested we provided the children with a visual calendar to help her. I firmly believe that the pickup and drop offs should be implemented in a consistent routine.


Changes in circumstance:


the judgment was structured upon the tender years of the children. If the parties had contemplated the children attending school, it is anticipated that detailed provisions relating to the sharing of school holidays and alternate arrangements for pickup and return of the children would have been included in the agreement.

i. [The child] is no longer a baby. She is of an age where it is reasonable for her to spend more time away from her mother and has a need to spend more time with her father.

The father’s work schedule has changed such that he is now able to provide full-time care on a predictable schedule and thus his ability to meet [the child’s] needs has changed in a fundamental way.

The applicant has retained employment with long shift works which includes a combination of nights and day shifts, leaving the child with daycare for extended periods of time. This is a very significatn material change, which if known at hte time, would have resulted in a different order.

The applicant schedule is based on 12hrs shift works. She works 2Day Shifts and 2 Night Shifts.


The applicant parents are now available to provide care. I believe this is time that the child should enjoy with me as his.her parent.

efforts to increase access
The applicant has a history of denying me any extra time with our child.

Jan 20th I finished work early and contacted the applicant to pick up the children early 3:30 as oppsed to 4:00. The applicant informed the respondent that A2 was sleeping. However the applicant was at work and her parents were caring for the children.

I asked for overnight access during Christmas of 2015. The applicant denied this request. Furthermore on the 2 day of the Xmas schedule. THis concerns me because the applicant is unilaterally setitng our times with our child without any concern of my wishes.

The applicant has made unfounded allegations agiainst me

conclusion

The respondents proposed schedule is in the best interest of the children; allowing them maximum contact with both parents

The proposed schedule is the a viable solution to eliminate the need for 3rd party caregivers

The proposed schedule was in effect prior to the separation

The proposed schedule would benefit the children, the applicant and respondent

The proposed schedule would allow the applicant to enjoy a meaningful and continious contact with the children


And I strongly urge you to read up all of the case law and referenced articles posted in the 50-50 debate thread.

and get a good lawyer to read over all that





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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 01-28-2017, 01:46 PM
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It honestly sounds like you've done your homework. Arabian and Trinton have given you some good stuff also.

I hope your CC brief was...."brief".

Mr Toronto once told me to pretend my pen would run out of ink after a few sentences, so make them count and rarely should each point be more then 2 sentences.

Depending on how the judges morning commute went and how their coffee tastes, they'll be looking for the party slinging the most garbage to pounce on. Keep garbage out. Only relevant stuff with documents to back it up.

EVERYTHING has to be how the children will benefit.

1. Kid "WANTS" to be with you more. Not sure how you can prove it but thats huge!

2. Need judicial intervention. OP is inflexible on access, etc.

3. REASONABLE: "I will always promote and respect the mothers role ion the children's life"...our children deserve and "WANT" an equal relationship with both of us.

4. MAXIMUM CONTACT: Hammer this down the courts throat. Use caselaw .. there's a ton of it.

5. ORGANIZATION:

Have a copy of your brief, including exhibits and a few examples of caselaw with you.

- Highlight points you want to focus on and be sure you know how to direct the judges eyes to it FAST: i.e - Your honor, on Page 12, para 4, exhibit 2, there's another e-mail denying my child access to me...etc.

PARENTING PLAN:

Go in there with a solid ass parenting plan. Every angle must be covered (pick ups, drop offs, etc). Make it iron clad.

I forget if there are accusations of abuse, drugs, etc. But bringing in a hair follicle test, etc and/or a clean police record would be attractive to a judge.

__________________________________________________ _______________[

Remember,

Your sole objective in the CC is to get an endorsement in your favor. Endorsements are paper trials that future judges rely on heavily for subsequent judgements. Judges usually put little invisible messages and nuances for their buddy judges to read. GET THAT ENDORSEMENT. If you get one in your favor, consider it analogous to winning a motion.
Get the endorsement by speaking in a low, non-aggressive tone, remaining reasonable and resolution-focused, organized and sticking to the best interests of the child. Some of the things you hear will make your blood boil....don't feed in to it. She will make this about "YOU". You will make it about how it will be good for KIDS. The second the judge sees both parents are mud slingers, you're both screwed. Be the bigger person.

Last edited by LovingFather32; 01-28-2017 at 01:50 PM.
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