making a custody/access agreement help!

[kirakisses]

ok as per the advice of many members on here (even the ones who may not believe most of what i say or seem to not care for me much)....

i have finally gotten my EX to speak to me, and he has agreed to try and work things out, outside of court. I'm hopping we can but if not then at least we tried right?

so now i am here to get advice on making an agreement between us, when i tried this with D3's father it didn't work out so i just pretty much know how to word things, and most of what to have in it..... after that i have no idea what to do with it..... i know both my ex and myself need to sign it with a witness... so the questions i have about doing this is....

1. do we each need a witness of our own to sign it? or just one witness? who can be used as a witness?
2. after things are signed what do we do with it then? how exactly does it become a legal "court order" kind of thing?

any advice about things that anyone here thinks should be in it or what is useless to put in it would be great to.....i just more or less want to know what i am doing when it comes to this.... i don't know what will be for custody/access as of yet as the ex's cell phone was cut off for non payment again....

[Gary M]

The witness is just stating that they saw you sign the document and that you are actually you. A witness can be anybody and there's nothing wrong with personal friends doing this for you. I would suggest that it would be best, once all the i's are dotted and t's crossed, that you and your ex and 2 friends sit down together and all 4 of you sign in turn.

In order for the agreement to stand up, it is necessary for both of you to acknowledge having had independent legal advice (ILA) prior to signing. Of course, you can both pretend to have had ILA in order to save cash, but I suggest that this would be foolish.

So...

1) hammer out an agreement

2) take it to a lawyer and pay ~$300 to have them read it over and provide advice (the other party should do the same, with a different lawyer)

3) initial every page together then autograph the signature area together and have your signatures witnessed (preferable to do together, and if you worked out the agreement together this shouldn't be a problem)

Then...

4) Take your SA and have it filed with the court. It'll be rubber-stamped and become a legal Order.

In cases where couples are filing for divorce an SA is filed with the application and becomes part of the entire record. I don't recall you saying that you were actually married, so I'm afraid that I don't know the specific mechanics of what happens to your SA once filed... but someone here will know.

GOOD GOING on getting the ball rolling with your ex! What you have done is taken the first step in ensuring that you two can put YOUR child(ren) through school instead of a lawyer's ::thumbs up::

Cheers!

Gary

[iceberg]

There are samples I believe for an agreement on this forum if you do a search you might find it. Gary's advice is complete except I think you both can use the same lawyer to read it and modify if necessary so you both can share the lawyer fee.

[Gary M]

Certificate of Independent Legal Advice definition:

"A document that attests that a person has received legal advice on a proposed contract, from an independent lawyer not associated with the other contracting party"

You *can* get advice from the same lawyer, parlagals, or your mothers in law, however it would no longer be ILA.

In my experience, ILA is the "trump card" when it comes to whether or not your SA, or portions thereof, may be revisited.

Cheers!

Gary

[Berner_Faith]

Gary is bang on...ILA is the way to go...

I just want to add when you are addressing access times (which I can only hope would be 50/50) be sure to put times in the agreement. This will ensure neither of you can argue about what times/places exchanges will take place...also include a clause about who will pick up.drop off (he picks up to start his time, you pick up to start yours, or you both meet half way between each others homes)

[kirakisses]

gary - we were never married, so its just dealing with child custody, but thanks for helping me out with what to do... do you know if legal aid will help with cost of a lawyer to read over the agreement i'm currently low income so even the $300 ish it would cost will be a bit hard to come up with (would take me a little bit to have that after bills are paid ect.)

iceberg - thanks i'll give a search and see what i can find.

berner - we haven't talked much about access yet, but i will be sure to put those things in the agreement. i had them put into my D3's father and my order cause he was always asking when pick up/drop offs were, even though we were already using the same time every time lol.


kinda off subject anyone know anyway i can attempt to convince him that I am not coming back to him, and that i only wish to talk about the baby and getting something in place for custody/access..... every time I have spoken to him he seems to think its a step closer to me coming back, and wont accept that i have left and am making a life for myself, doing what i need to be happy and that doesn't include him.

[Berner_Faith]

Search radio silence on this form...does he have email? Only communicate via email, if he responds with anything that doesn't pertain to the child, simply respond to ONLY the points that involve the child and either ignore everything else, or simply state that the other parts of his email are not child focused, therefore won't be address/answered.

My bf had this issue with his ex not too long ago... she couldn't understand why things didn't work out (even though she is the one who told him not to come home)... he simply replied with what I stated above and after about the 3 time of him not addressing her other mumble jumble she stopped asking.

Not sure if legal aid will help with that...but call around... you may be able to find a lawyer that will do it for a reduced cost...I know there are some lawyers in my area that are only $125/hour (smaller city)... I think if you check out MySupportCalculator.ca and type in your postal code, press next, and then at the right hand side it will give you a list of lawyers in your area...most also list their fees and many will have free initial consultation.

[Gary M]

Originally Posted by Berner_Faith

I just want to add when you are addressing access times (which I can only hope would be 50/50) be sure to put times in the agreement. This will ensure neither of you can argue about what times/places exchanges will take place...also include a clause about who will pick up.drop off (he picks up to start his time, you pick up to start yours, or you both meet half way between each others homes)

Agreed. I would love to think that this type of detail would never be necessary but all one has to do is read through these forums (foraa? forae?) to see how important this is... I think that problems with acess times, pickup/dropoff responsibilities, etc., is the conflict most often discussed here... IOW, it's a big deal.

Kira: My answer to your question is, unfortunately, "I don't know for sure but I think that ILA must be provded by a licensed lawyer in order to be acceptable for the purpose of making a contract binding." But I am confident that there are those here who do know and who will comment.

Sorry I can't be more help.

Cheers!

Gary

[kirakisses]

berner - he does have email but he doesn't check it very often cause he doesn't have internet and uses his cell phone for everything so far i have been keeping it to texting so i can save the messages, but i can try email if it would be better and just let him know in advance that i will only be talking to him through emails from now on and see if that gets him checking it more often.
thanks for the link i'll give it a look and see what i find, although i'd love to use the same lawyer as i did going to court with D3 but not sure what his rates are maybe i'll look into that as well.

gary - i agree that having those details in place are a must to stop many disagreements/arguments that would take place other wise.

I know i'll want to get advice and talk with a lawyer before i sign anything with him to be safe, but i have no idea what he will do. i'll be keeping on eye out for responses from anyone who knows more of what has to be done, but will be sure to seek a lawyer when the time comes anyway

[iceberg]

I guess I was wrong about having the same lawyer for SA. Anyway, like others suggested, include all important things in your SA.