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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
I know about appeal. Seems very popular to do in mobility cases. It is what it is.
Lawyers says it might take 1-1.5 years to get to trial. We will see. I am starting application in January.

In a ways, slower I go in court, I am able to earn some money along the way too and invest into all this. Once I move, I won't have chance to work at least for one year. In the meantime my fiancé can put off some money as we go through this. We will have to take trial on credit cards.

This is the only happy development that I see for mine and my child's life, so we have to do it.
Rush to court and be stuck in quicksand once you're there.

Your child's emotional stability is going to be destroyed by your choice to commence this action to replace her father.

The child is not going to want to live with you once she is of age.

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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 12:28 PM
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I doubt that the child won't want to live with me when he grows up.
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Old 12-15-2016, 01:17 PM
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I doubt that the child won't want to live with me when he grows up.
You will never know. It could go one way or the other.

The father could also use the material change of you moving to move to BC himself and secure shared custody there.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 01:21 PM
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I am moving 4 driving hours away, but in US. this is time with border pass already included. It is usually 3:45 min with border waiting
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Old 12-15-2016, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
I am moving 4 driving hours away, but in US. this is time with border pass already included. It is usually 3:45 min with border waiting
I had mistaken this for a move to BC from Ontario.

Judges don't like restricting parents from moving unless the child's best interest would be negatively impacted by the move.

If the trial judge just so happens to not be a big fan of your lawyer or yourself, then that could be a factor - we have many very ridiculous judges in our family courts. They tailor the reasoning and make decisions based on personal opinions and biases. Two judges may say you're not moving and a 3rd judge will rule that you're moving. That's just how ridiculous family law is.

Go speak to 10 different family law lawyers, 10 mediators, 10 arbitrators, 10 counselors, 10 psychiatrists, 10 family law judges, and ask them what is the best interests of your child - you will get 100 different answers.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:17 PM
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Well, system is ridiculous. I don’t know yet much about judges and their rulings out because after 2.5 years in court we signed on consent and no one decided for us in the end….but I definitely noticed that system is very expensive, slow and ineffective. I find that many things could be solved much quicker. I hope one day Canadian family law will be completely changed. Instead of saving for children education, people spend money and sell houses and go into debts for solving even simple obvious problems. Final agreements can be argued 6 month after being signed and all achievement of the past mean nothing and system does not protect you from this “suing” being stopped.Like in my case, I had status quo for sole custody because I was left alone in pregnancy and up to child’s two years old had no support, no communication, nor father’s desire to see the child. I had a lot of hardships and troubles and I overcame it all with help of my parents.Then, I had to spend 2.5 years in court only because father had money to sue me and because he did not agree on my sole custody and when child turned 2 y.o. he decided to file for 50/50 and shared custody and pay me 300 $ while keeping millions on BVI.fficeffice" />>>
it is only trial that could get me sole custody or on consent which the other party never agreed to. We managed to avoid trial a day before the trial, but only with voluntary help of my lawyer, I would not financially climb even to that stage.As I understand, the other party had it in his plan, he did not care for his expenses and wanted to sue me until I run out of money and give up sole custody…. And when he realized I will actually go for trial (he did not know my lawyer worked for free), he gave me what I asked for.And if I went to trial for costs, I really doubt judge would ask him to would pay even half of my costs, full costs literally would have been around 100 K.Conclusion: for single mom who gave birth to child without father being there, has to pay 50-100 K to get this sole custody which she should have had as per status quo.It means, even when outcome is obvious due to how things were (for custody), if you don’t have money, anything can happen to your status quo. MY parents were challenged by false claims that they put child into unsafe position when walk him through dangerous parking lot or driving on flat tires. Of course judge did not listen to this bullshit, but some other judge can listen and decide that child is unsafe in our home with grandparents. And claim by claim, little step by little step, a person with money can win over 50/50 access or even sole custody if he has money to sue.I hate this system, I was and am in court 3rd year in a row as respondent. However, this time I will have to be an applicant and no matter how much I don’t want to participate in all this and would rather resolve it peacefully, if I have no choice I have to go through this hell and let’s see what happens in the end.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
I don't think my application will be so unreasonable.
It isn't about what you think... It is what a judge would order... That is your problem.

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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
About mobility: I am moving for good reasons, to get married, it will improve stability in life, emotional state and economically will considerably improve out situation.
I have provided enough case law for you to consider... These are not good reasons.

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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
Instead of having 49 K income, our family will have 150-190 K income in several years from now.
Courts don't make orders on future predictions. What future income will be is called hearsay.

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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
My fiance's parents live there to help us with raising this child and hopefully one more in future.
Again, your future family is hearsay. Breakdown of the family situation when you move is going to be high. You have never lived with the person you are moving to be with. Not like you got a job transfer or even the future husband did. You have a long distance relationship and not very good day-to-day contact with this person. Judge will not weight this evidence very high or at all. Instability is high in your relationship in the eyes of a judge probably.

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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
School in that city are top in US and much better than the one my child goes to here. university is top 10 in US and child will have discounts to study there due to a number of reasons.
Good luck with that! A judge will never make an order to send a kid to the US because the schools are better than they are in Canada. That would be an admission that our education system is crap. University is so far in the future that again a judge won't weigh the evidence. Who knows if the kid is even going to go to university?!

Your evidence sucks. You can't pit the US against Canada in a Canadian court room. You will always lose on that argument. It would be an admission against interest by a public court system to a failing. They never ever do this...

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Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
Father has 30 % times with child which I will be able to return back, frequency will be lost, but amount will stay.
We move 4 hour drive away.
And a border that is about to get a lot of restrictions put on it. The free flow from Canada is at risk based on the president elects position. A judge is very educated.

Also you switch jurisdiction then you can file in the US. Judge won't give up a Canadian citizen's right to a fair trial. That being the child who is a CND citizen and will always be one. Sorry to say but, CND is a much better, safer and accommodating society as a whole. Your argument may hold water if you moved to a country that actually ranks better in quality of life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
Health: my fiancee has good insurance at University and he will be paying permanently for my child and mine health insurance. We are not asking father to contribute as in US it is a very different system.
Nor is it better. Just more expensive.

[QUOTE=Tatyana K;215178]My child indeed is attached to my parents as we all live together but we will be buying a big house in new place with extra space for them. They are retired and plan to do extended stays there for months. US allows 6 month visits.[quote]

Again, irrelevant really. As you will be ditching the entire other side of the child's family.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
School and friends. It is not first time my child changes environment, he is very social and easily adapts, he can make friends there easily. This is something I don't worry about it all. Same with extracurricular. He has been in new places and enjoyed it.
You will be doing a Section 30 to evaluate this. Get 35,000 ready to spend as you are the moving parent. The only way you can get your costs back is if the Section 30 goes in your favour. OCL will not touch a mobility out of country. So you are left with a private assessment. I know of NO private assessors who have ever recommended a move to another country. Especially in the limited pool in southern Ontario.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
My child can have sister or brother in future from this marriage and life in stable family unit. This is beneficial.
Again, it is not evidence that will be weighed. Nor will it be considered. You want to use it as evidence but, won't be able to. It is hearsay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
I have not intention to destroy connection with father but I truly think this is in child's best interests knowing nuances of my situation.
You think... No one cares what you think. It requires evidence and not feelings. You have presented NO evidence.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatyana K View Post
Here we are awaited with pretty miserable future of single mom living in crappy apartment, barely oping with expenses of live and being actively sued each second year by rich dad. My parents are aging and not in good health. Support from them is going down, I soon will have to support them and help out. This is reality of life.
And their travel insurance will be outrageous for 6 months if they have any health issues. Have you checked what someone with cancer has to pay to travel to the US. Long term illness is a sure shot to not travelling anymore unless you are significantly wealthy.

Your argument has more holes than Swiss Cheese.

Good Luck!
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:44 PM
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I honestly ready can lii a lot. I read maybe 50 mobility cases and I have not seen any case where many reasons outweigh in one case to be for moving parents and is in my case ( like short distance, considerable improvement conomically, sole custody, etc). I usually saw one of factors being in certain case like my factors, for example, some women had fiancé who is jobless or not doing very well financially, mediocre, or moving back to be closer to parents, or flight distance, etc or joint/shared custody…and still parents applied to move and many were successful….For many of those cases judges ruled out in favor of a moving parent. I don’t say it will be not costly or easy to achieve, but after getting a huge number of discouraging comments , I can only assume they come from fathers who don’t want their children moved, had enough hell in court for various reasons and I can understand your feelings too. Believe me in my situation dad can even buy apartment and live in that town 6 months in a row and have lots of access and keep doing his flex business who brings him $$$$$$, however, he does not want to sacrifice his comfort. This is not a story about two poor miserable families, just one for now who is pulled in court for 3rd year in a row. And even when I want to improve life for me and child, I get tonnes of discouraging comments.Remember, there are several factors that judges base their opinion: economic improvement, distance, current access and ability to return this access with non-moving parent, reason for move, custody.Many of those rule in my favor.fficeffice" />>>
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:47 PM
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You have no idea nor the qualifications to evaluate case law. You probably couldn't even explain the purpose of case law and how it is used. You see yourself in case law that you read... that is the first mistake.

Clearly you haven't properly read...

Van Rassel v. Van Rassel, 2008 CanLII 37217 (ON SC)
Date: 2008-07-23
Docket: FS-06-04395-00
Other citation: 61 RFL (6th) 343
Citation: Van Rassel v. Van Rassel, 2008 CanLII 37217 (ON SC), http://canlii.ca/t/1zt7g

Parent moving. Not able to move. Had a new partner. Had no evidence that it was better... Just personal assumptions. Judge breaks it down.

See paragraph 59. Same logic would be applied to your new partner's "success" in his career. It is new. He could get fired. It isn't guaranteed. You could divorce. blah blah blah.

Quote:
[62]** * ** I do not intend this to sound harsh, but Jennifer should not at all feel guilty that by reason of my decision she cannot move Johnathan to Halifax.* Some might argue, she ought not to have been even asked to consider this option.* Craig knew he was becoming involved with, and then marrying, a woman who had a child with another man, and that father was very involved in his son’s life.* Further Craig and Jennifer knew that Sean had vigorously opposed any idea of Johnathan being moved to Halifax at the time the parties signed their separation agreement.* They also knew, from his e-mails that Sean was very afraid of losing Johnathan and it was inconceivable to him that his son might be moved to Halifax.* He was never going to agree to Johnathan being moved to Halifax and I am quite certain Jennifer and Criag knew this when they entered their permanent relationship.
Pretty relevant to your matter. And what everyone has been telling you. By your own admission on this site you have admitted to the same.

Last edited by Tayken; 12-15-2016 at 02:54 PM.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2016, 02:49 PM
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that is right but how else I should make a judgement, just from other people's experiences with what they had to put on the table in front of the judge for their relocation and from what they say in general on which factors judges base their ruling
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