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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 06-20-2014, 09:49 PM
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Originally Posted by standing on the sidelines View Post
yes I have seen "snide"comments made about both sexes. Mothers that try to make their exs to be the devils spawn and Fathers that try to make out that their ex is the biggest b**** in the world.
Then I do apologize. I am a bit touchy on the subject after how easily people dismiss the idea that the husband can be the one abused specially by the legal system. The assault was meant to be simple statement of fact and pertinent to my question.
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Old 06-20-2014, 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
Of course always be thinking of a formal offer to settle so you can move on with your life. Some people on here think offers to settle should be made frequently throughout the case conference process.
I made what I thought was an extremely fair offer to settle a couple of weeks ago but she has rejected it. The sticking point is I want her to be responsible for any shortfall in the sale of the home. When I left the home in October 2010 there was approx 70k equity based on an appraisal done a couple of months previous. If there is a shortfall now then it certainly isn't my fault. Other than that, I have offered a 50/50 split in the proceeds of sale.

I have copies of the original contract, real estate appraisal and a number of other documents showing what her behaviour has been like since I left. I am just doing my best to gather all the ammunition I can prior to going into the conference.
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Old 06-20-2014, 10:08 PM
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Real estate appraisals are generally worthless IMO. IF the house sells you split the proceeds of the matrimonial property. Read up on equalization. Occupational rent is a reality for her. I assume you closed your joint bank accounts at the time of your separation?

Someone's behaviour, good or bad, generally isn't relevant when considering finances. The only time bad behaviour is considered is when the behaviour has directly caused an interruption of court process. Then you might get a few thousand for costs, but that is not common.

I don't know what you hope to accomplish or think the outcome of this will be. Your ex was an ahole and you left. Now you have to pick up the pieces and figure out a way to move on. Family court does not punish people for poor behaviour. It all comes down to the numbers now. From here on in the only winners are lawyers who love people who are willing to spend top dollar on disputing things that happened years ago. Don't get sucked into that void my friend. It just isn't worth it in the end. There is no vindication, rather meagre survival if you can manage to hang on to some assets.
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Old 06-20-2014, 10:14 PM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
I don't know what you hope to accomplish or think the outcome of this will be. Your ex was an ahole and you left. Now you have to pick up the pieces and figure out a way to move on. Family court does not punish people for poor behaviour. It all comes down to the numbers now. From here on in the only winners are lawyers who love people who are willing to spend top dollar on disputing things that happened years ago. Don't get sucked into that void my friend. It just isn't worth it in the end. There is no vindication, rather meagre survival if you can manage to hang on to some assets.
Thanks for the advice. My offer is still open for her, just trying not to be taken to the cleaners for anything that has happened to the house in my absence. Other than that, I want my fair share and to put this behind me. Btw, my offer also contains a clause promising no further litigation as I have enough to sue her but I would rather not go that route. Just want this over.
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Old 06-20-2014, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by rmacq62 View Post
I made what I thought was an extremely fair offer to settle a couple of weeks ago but she has rejected it. The sticking point is I want her to be responsible for any shortfall in the sale of the home. When I left the home in October 2010 there was approx 70k equity based on an appraisal done a couple of months previous. If there is a shortfall now then it certainly isn't my fault. Other than that, I have offered a 50/50 split in the proceeds of sale.

I have copies of the original contract, real estate appraisal and a number of other documents showing what her behaviour has been like since I left. I am just doing my best to gather all the ammunition I can prior to going into the conference.
Is the shortfall due to the market or damage to the home?
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Old 06-20-2014, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rmacq62 View Post
I made what I thought was an extremely fair offer to settle a couple of weeks ago but she has rejected it. The sticking point is I want her to be responsible for any shortfall in the sale of the home. When I left the home in October 2010 there was approx 70k equity based on an appraisal done a couple of months previous. If there is a shortfall now then it certainly isn't my fault. Other than that, I have offered a 50/50 split in the proceeds of sale.

I have copies of the original contract, real estate appraisal and a number of other documents showing what her behaviour has been like since I left. I am just doing my best to gather all the ammunition I can prior to going into the conference.
It doesn't really work like that, if the matrimonial home is in both names. If held in both names, it is a joint asset, and dealt with as such. Value is as of the date of disposition. The one who lives there should bear the cost of utilities, but all other finances, i.e. mortgage, taxes, upkeep, are joint.

Now, if only one of you held title, you'd have a winning argument for value as at date of separation.
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Old 06-20-2014, 11:19 PM
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Originally Posted by standing on the sidelines View Post
Is the shortfall due to the market or damage to the home?
Market value in the area has increased since I left. Damage, I don't know as I have not been allowed access.

Mortgage has continued to be paid down and is now in the area of $20k so there should be plenty of equity. That is part of why I am so concerned over her insistence that shortfall be shared, there should not be a shortfall no matter what. Of course, she may just be trying to force me to capitulate to her again.
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Old 06-20-2014, 11:19 PM
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A person can offer to not litigate. This can be written into a separation agreement. However, all it takes is for a material or substantive change in circumstances to allow for a deviation of the agreement. So offering to 'not litigate' is essentially meaningless.

Some of us go through extremely difficult separation/divorces where there is police involvement, criminal charges, and ensuing peace bonds or restraining orders. The system keeps us engaged in a never-ending court battle. Once you're in the arena it's difficult to get out, but get out is exactly what a person should do.

You had a long marriage and it failed. Courts don't care about who was right or wrong, or who the better person is, particularly if child custody is not on the table.

People lie in family court all of the time. People also do not provide full financial disclosure in a timely manner - some never provide it at all. You can spend thousands upon thousands of dollars and end up with nothing.

Best thing to do is get a settlement. Keep making offers and don't get hung up on trivial things just because you have a point to make. No one cares and in the end you will pay dearly just to prove your point.

I'd get the house sold and divide things up. What is worth more - your sanity or a few thousand dollars that you might realize after months/years in court going after occupational rent?

People who have been married for a long time sometimes have a very difficult time parting and they stay attached via litigation. It's a kind of sickness unto itself. Kind of an attachment thing.

I'd make a 6 month plan (or 3 month or whatever works for you) and try everything you can do to end this thing. You cut your losses and move on.
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Old 06-20-2014, 11:24 PM
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Originally Posted by rmacq62 View Post
Market value in the area has increased since I left. Damage, I don't know as I have not been allowed access.

Mortgage has continued to be paid down and is now in the area of $20k so there should be plenty of equity. That is part of why I am so concerned over her insistence that shortfall be shared, there should not be a shortfall no matter what. Of course, she may just be trying to force me to capitulate to her again.

Then you are merely speculating. Get the facts. Try to get the other side to agree to get some appraisals on the house and GET IT SOLD. Do not haggle over the realtor, just get it sold. Proceeds go into a lawyer's trust account (either your lawyer or her lawyer - doesn't matter). Meanwhile get your financials straightened out. The longer you bicker over things the more the lawyers make.

When you meet with your ex do not discuss things in the past because they are irrelevant. Only discuss finances. (I assume there are no 'children of the marriage' issues?)

Last edited by arabian; 06-20-2014 at 11:26 PM. Reason: adding another thought
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Old 06-20-2014, 11:30 PM
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I'd get the house sold and divide things up. What is worth more - your sanity or a few thousand dollars that you might realize after months/years in court going after occupational rent?
I have no desire to go after occupational rent, it is an option I will keep open if she keeps pushing for me to $30k in expenses since I moved out.

My last offer was fair to both of us and there isn't much more I can do to be more fair. As I said, there should be no shortfall in the proceeds of sale and I find her insistence on it very worrying. What has gone on in the last few years that she thinks there will be a shortfall? Or is she, as you said, just enjoying the litigation.

However, I also do not believe this will end with a settlement. I have believed she would leave me alone before just to be dragged back into something. I am afraid that giving up everything just to get it over with is no longer and option because I no longer believe the divorce will be the end of her in my life.
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