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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 02-27-2014, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by MS Mom View Post
He's had a chance - she's 14. He's had 14 years of chances.

This isn't about money for the OP - he's already not paying the right amount, now he wants to justify that by a 50/50 custody schedule.

If he wants his bid for 50/50 to be taken seriously, he should be paying what he's already ordered to pay and then nobody would think this is about a reduction for him.
Wo you make a lot of assomptions! they have been separated for 3 years, pror to that he was probably an involved father. OP also mentioned that he works/worked out of town, so could not really have shared custody. And don't say that he should have changed jobs, because he need to earn money to pay for CS, SS. What if he changed his job now? What if he travels less and if it is absolutely necessary his future wife will be there to help him out?

What if he noticed that his relationship with his daughter is not as it used to be, but does not realize that it is because she does not accept his new wife? Maybe his thinks it is all coming from his ex and that the things would be different if his daughter spent more time in their household.

Why are you so judgemental and angry at fathers? Every post you make reeks of anger towards your ex, and men in general.

I am not saying it is not possible that he is doing to reduce CS payments, the way to test that is to let it happen,on a test basis and if it works great a chikld has two involved parents and if it doesn't well go back to previous arrangement, but Op would have something concrete to show why it doesn't work. Although, with the age of her daughter, i dount that he has any chance of getting shared custody if she doesn't agree.
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Old 02-27-2014, 10:59 AM
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I get so tired of hearing this "access isn't about money." Ridiculous.

I think if the difference, in CS from what she is currently receiving and the CS she would receive should ex get changed custody, was put in a trust account for daughter's education you'd very well might see the ex drop the matter.

It's always about money, in my opinion. I hope the OP is getting annual financial information from ex. Anyone (particularly those who have never been in the situation of the OP) who criticizes a single parent from relying on CS is naive. The reality is that MANY people do indeed rely on CS.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:08 AM
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I get so tired of hearing this "access isn't about money." Ridiculous.

I think if the difference, in CS from what she is currently receiving and the CS she would receive should ex get changed custody, was put in a trust account for daughter's education you'd very well might see the ex drop the matter.

It's always about money, in my opinion. I hope the OP is getting annual financial information from ex. Anyone (particularly those who have never been in the situation of the OP) who criticizes a single parent from relying on CS is naive. The reality is that MANY people do indeed rely on CS.
I would not be so sure about it, that he is doing it just because of the money. If he earns as much as OP says and she earns very little, the difference between offset cs and cs amount he is paying now, would be minimal. And don't forget, he would also have expenses for his daughter while in his care, so for OP's, while cs going to her would be less, amount of money he spends on his child would be higher.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Toutou View Post
Wo you make a lot of assomptions! they have been separated for 3 years, pror to that he was probably an involved father. OP also mentioned that he works/worked out of town, so could not really have shared custody. And don't say that he should have changed jobs, because he need to earn money to pay for CS, SS. What if he changed his job now? What if he travels less and if it is absolutely necessary his future wife will be there to help him out?

What if he noticed that his relationship with his daughter is not as it used to be, but does not realize that it is because she does not accept his new wife? Maybe his thinks it is all coming from his ex and that the things would be different if his daughter spent more time in their household.

Why are you so judgemental and angry at fathers? Every post you make reeks of anger towards your ex, and men in general.

I am not saying it is not possible that he is doing to reduce CS payments, the way to test that is to let it happen,on a test basis and if it works great a chikld has two involved parents and if it doesn't well go back to previous arrangement, but Op would have something concrete to show why it doesn't work. Although, with the age of her daughter, i dount that he has any chance of getting shared custody if she doesn't agree.
I'm not judgemental and angry at fathers. I'm angry at people who ignore their kids until someone more important reminds them that if they get 50/50 their support goes down. This has NOTHING to do with gender. I'd feel the same way if the roles were reversed, but they're not.

Why are you jumping to the conclusion that this is about gender and not disgust in ignoring parental responsibility?

Why are you so determined that disinterested parents get access they so obviously don't want?
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by arabian View Post
I get so tired of hearing this "access isn't about money." Ridiculous.

I think if the difference, in CS from what she is currently receiving and the CS she would receive should ex get changed custody, was put in a trust account for daughter's education you'd very well might see the ex drop the matter.

It's always about money, in my opinion. I hope the OP is getting annual financial information from ex. Anyone (particularly those who have never been in the situation of the OP) who criticizes a single parent from relying on CS is naive. The reality is that MANY people do indeed rely on CS.
Correct. Timing tells the real story. If he were paying what was ordered already, it may be easier to believe that he really wants to see his child. But, it sounds like adjusting the agreement to suit the payments to me.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:19 AM
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The daughter is 14, so she basically can make her own decision. That being said, they have only been separated for 3 years. It is not fair to assume that Dad has been absent from the daughters life for 14 years and had 14 years to form a relationship. For all we know they had a great relationship until separation. How does one know the mother didn't paint a bad picture about the father? How does one know what Mom is saying is 100% true... maybe Dad tried, maybe Mom had a legal aid lawyer and Dad just did not have the funds any more. Assumptions do not help. Why not try to answer the OP's questions instead of playing the assumptions game?

To the OP- Give it a chance. Encourage your daughter to try it out. Give it say a month and see if Dad actually steps up. If after a month daughter is still just hanging out in her room and has no real relationship with Dad then at least you can say you tried and things can do back to normal.

Maybe this is about money to Dad, but it also seems about money to the OP, so in reality, neither of them are better than the other. A relationship with both parents is best. Give your daughter the chance to rebuild a relationship with her father. If it works out, she will be grateful, if it doesn't she will at least know you cared enough to try and encourage her to have a relationship with her father.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:20 AM
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Even if he gets access 50/50 - you can pull a contelli case and I guarantee you'll still get almost as much support.

I will say though that after being seperated for 3 years in what I will assume was a 15yr relationship you aren't working. In 3 years you could have gotten a uni degree, any sort of certification, at this point you should get a job at Timmies. The reality of divorce, face it. Living off CS, SS, Govt handouts completely for 3 years is bad.

For the father/daugher issues - I would say that kids need their dads, as a male role model who loves them unconditionally - I think it is the counter to having your daughter sleep around at a young age.

Lack of Self Esteem = vulnerable to people who stroke your self-esteem = guys take advantage = early pregnancy.

I like the increased access step - keep increasing access at your daughter's comfort level. Just a dinner at first, a day trip, a weekend, extended weekend etc.. I would make the eventual end goal shared custody (weekly) as long as things go ok and your daughter is ok with it.

Believe it or not the govt WANTED fathers to fight for custody for their kids even if it was for money because the end result was that the kids had closer bonds with dad. So it is in the best interest of your kid IF the father has money.

For the loud sex issue, maybe suggest another bedroom (basement perhaps?)
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Berner_Faith View Post
The daughter is 14, so she basically can make her own decision. That being said, they have only been separated for 3 years. It is not fair to assume that Dad has been absent from the daughters life for 14 years and had 14 years to form a relationship. For all we know they had a great relationship until separation. How does one know the mother didn't paint a bad picture about the father? How does one know what Mom is saying is 100% true... maybe Dad tried, maybe Mom had a legal aid lawyer and Dad just did not have the funds any more. Assumptions do not help. Why not try to answer the OP's questions instead of playing the assumptions game?

To the OP- Give it a chance. Encourage your daughter to try it out. Give it say a month and see if Dad actually steps up. If after a month daughter is still just hanging out in her room and has no real relationship with Dad then at least you can say you tried and things can do back to normal.

Maybe this is about money to Dad, but it also seems about money to the OP, so in reality, neither of them are better than the other. A relationship with both parents is best. Give your daughter the chance to rebuild a relationship with her father. If it works out, she will be grateful, if it doesn't she will at least know you cared enough to try and encourage her to have a relationship with her father.
Money was brought into the story by mom because DAD ISN'T PAYING WHAT HE IS ORDERED TO.
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Old 02-27-2014, 11:28 AM
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She has tried with the gf. SHe is an only child and used to 100% of her dad's time Now she doesn't get it. I have told him to try and that she has to suck it up. she is in Councelling also to help with this and other issues with her self esteem. She is encouraged to go continually by me. She also says she spends the whole time in her room when she's there. She hears the having sex and she can't have her dad to herself ever. I have spoke to her dad as I was married to him, and told him to try and keep it down. He just denies it. Sadly I know that part is true. However there are many issues that they have which has led her to to not wanting to gothere.
No. This is not about money for me. I want my daughter with me because I love her and genuinely want her home. Sure the support helps greatly and is used for her. If she was with him I would not expect anything. The issue is the whole bully tactics and the legal firm. Together him and his fiancÚ make over 250k a year. They can support her better financially. I am trying to get another job as I am just unable to rely on the support and am told not to rely in it. Sadly I have relied on it. It's supposed to be given to help me not as a bonus. Is I had the means to put some away it would be silly to be ordered support. I'm just really feeling bullied by the powerhouse legal stuff and not knowing where to start with the court proceedings. I can't afford a lawyer.
That's very tough... I understand her wanting time alone with her dad and if he is unwilling and unable to provide to her needs she will walk with her feet. There is probably not much a judge would do to change this situation.

If he is forcing this to court. I would as suggested provide a very detailed offer to settle. The offer would state that a more detailed access schedule be provided instead of a as It would also outline that due to the child's age it is more her choice than your's or his and her wishes should be respected. I would also in your paperwork request the OCL get involved to represent your daughters wishes. I would also suggest that he and her attend counseling together to work out their relationship.

You really have nothing to lose with the offer. It shows that you are encouraging the relationship as it is in the child's best interest. But you are also showing that it's really up to your daughter.

Under 50/50 he would most likely still be required to pay you child support considering the incomes at play here.

EDIT: And as Links stated you could use Contino Analysis to balance the support needs.

http://www.canlii.org/en/ca/scc/doc/...bnRpbm8AAAAAAQ

It does sound very much like an attempt to wipe out arrears and lower support. I hope the father realizes that if he gets what he wants and doesn't step up their relationship may be damaged beyond repair.. Again I would suggest counselling for both of them.

Last edited by FB_; 02-27-2014 at 11:34 AM.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 02-27-2014, 11:30 AM
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Money was brought into the story by mom because DAD ISN'T PAYING WHAT HE IS ORDERED TO.
Do you know that for sure, or is that something that Mom is adding to the story to try and paint a better picture for herself? Still NOT helpful.
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