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Divorce & Family Law This forum is for discussing any of the legal issues involved in your divorce.

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Old 06-02-2015, 12:26 PM
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Default Ex re-nagged on her approval

My ex had approved that I get the kids in the morning on fathers day this year, she is now re-nagging on this agreement. We agreed that if our weekends run on either mother/father day, then we allow the pick up in the am for the whole day. I did this for her as well on mother's day.

She is now saying, She is out of town with the kids and will be home very late on father's day, therefore I don't get them. too bad so sad.

Can she do this? I have her approval so does it not become my custody day?

I have already talked to the kids about our father's day outting, they are so excited. So now she is pulling them. this is terrible for my kids, why can't parents just think in terms of what is in the best interest of the children. Instead of being so concerned about 'how can I make his life miserable and piss him off...Oh I know I won't let him see the kids on father's day" Nice!

Am I SOL with just an email approval? is there anything I can do?

any advice is appreciated.
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:41 PM
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What does your agreement say? If it is silent than you may not be able to do much.

I assume you have the emails between you and the ex where you made this agreement? That you each get to spend fathers day/mothers day with the kids? If it was verbal, ugg... next time get it in writing.

What I would do is email the ex that you both agreed that she would have the kids for mothers day and you would have them for fathers day. That you followed the agreement in good faith, expecting her to as well. That her reneging (although, re-nagging may be more appropriate ..lol..) on the agreement after benefiting from it is not acting in good faith. That you expect her to live up to her end of the bargain as you did. Should she not provide the kids for fathers day, that you will take the position that she feels this agreement is null and void, and you will also not honour the provision going forward. Meaning she will not get mothers day should it be your parenting time going forward. That you understand that she is traveling, but that she should have made her arrangements in a manner that fit with her agreement.

You could may be even suggest taking the kids after lunch, to allow them time to get back into town. But overall I think in this case, you are going to have to shed some light on the fact that if she doesn't live up to her end of the bargain, then their will be repercussions. If she follows through and keeps the kids from you on Fathers Day, well, there isn't much you can do as it isn't a formal agreement. It is just another instance you make note of should you ever have to take her back to court for contempt in the future.

It is likely that the ex wants to have the kids with her for fathers day with her parents. If that is the case, they can hold their activity Saturday and leave you the agreed time.
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Old 06-02-2015, 12:47 PM
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Our separation agreement in terms of custody has changed so much. ie. we switched the said days to a more balanced schedule and it was all done through email and calendaring. Yes, I have her agreement in an email with regards to father's day. She is not with her parents but at a friends cottage. I even offered to drive the long hour to grab my kids because I have a whole day planned for them. The answer was NO, i no longer approve this day. We are in the middle of court case so lately she has been doing everything she can to make my life absolutely miserable. I had hoped she would not use my kids to do it. I know my kids will be disappointed but she will probably plan a fun day with them to keep their mind off father's day. I was hoping there was something I could do with my email approval.

Maybe I am SOL. I will have to break the news to my kids.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:36 PM
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Is it possible that the time before fathers day the kids are with dad that before mom is scheduled to get them that he asks if she will honor their agreement for fathers day in writing. If she says no, can he not hand the kids off to her (say on Fri when her weekend starts)?

He can politely say that because she will not honor their written agreement for fathers day that he cannot honor her getting the kids on Friday?

Just a crazy thought, might create more issues and drama but would be the sure way the kids would be with dad on fathers day.

I wouldn't advise doing this, just asking what the repercussions would be.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:42 PM
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What a great idea. Not sure I can pull it off tho I may have the cops at my door.
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Old 06-02-2015, 01:50 PM
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Don't be home. Be somewhere else.

But what can the police do? There is no enforcement clause in your agreement, you have a written email from your ex saying she will not give you the kids Sun at 8am for fathers day as per her previous promise email months ago.

Then show your polite email that says "due to the inability of you to follow the fathers day schedule I will not be transferring the kids this weekend. I will return them to you after fathers day as scheduled."

Obviously send that email out Friday after the kids are with you. If the cops come, say to them sure, I will let the kids can go with their mom as long as she promises to return them to me on Sun at 8am as she promised and if she breaks that promise that you have the officers word he will be able to enforce that on Sunday if she re-nags. If the police cannot enforce the kids return on Sun at 8am then you can let them go because you know she won't return them.

Sometimes fight fire with fire.
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Old 06-02-2015, 02:05 PM
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You certainly have me thinking canadaguy! :-)

Are email approvals legally binding?
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Old 06-02-2015, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcj2012 View Post
Our separation agreement in terms of custody has changed so much. ie. we switched the said days to a more balanced schedule and it was all done through email and calendaring. Yes, I have her agreement in an email with regards to father's day. She is not with her parents but at a friends cottage. I even offered to drive the long hour to grab my kids because I have a whole day planned for them. The answer was NO, i no longer approve this day. We are in the middle of court case so lately she has been doing everything she can to make my life absolutely miserable. I had hoped she would not use my kids to do it. I know my kids will be disappointed but she will probably plan a fun day with them to keep their mind off father's day. I was hoping there was something I could do with my email approval.
If you are in the middle of a court case with her, and she outright refuses after sending the email I said to send above, my next email to her would be "I do not believe you are acting in good faith or in the children's best interests. I acted in good faith and provided you with Mothers Day on the basis that I would have Fathers Day in return. Further, the children were aware of our fathers day plans, as I was under the impression you would abide by the agreement.

It is clear that you do not value your word in this regard. I guess this will just be further evidence of your refusal to cooperate and act reasonably to submit to the judge. I will also have to take your reneging on the agreement into consideration in future should either of us require a change to the parenting time schedule."

Quote:
Maybe I am SOL. I will have to break the news to my kids.
Keep the kids out of it. I wouldn't bring it up with them. If they bring it up with you, deflect it. Why drag them into the middle any more than they are?
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Old 06-02-2015, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcj2012 View Post
You certainly have me thinking canadaguy! :-)

Are email approvals legally binding?
I would argue that they are not legal binding. But that they confirm the intent to bind. While similar, they are not the same IMO.

Not handing the kids over for her parenting time is worse IMO. That schedule IS in writing per the order/agreement. I am sure a judge would love it if they heard "Yeah, I didn't hand over the kids for her weekend because she said she wouldn't hand over the kids for fathers day." The judge would likely take you both over the coals for acting worse than the children you are supposed to be caring for. She is giving you some rope to hang her with if she reneges on the agreement. Why even the playing field by acting equally as bad?
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Old 06-02-2015, 02:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Canadaguy View Post
Don't be home. Be somewhere else.

But what can the police do? There is no enforcement clause in your agreement, you have a written email from your ex saying she will not give you the kids Sun at 8am for fathers day as per her previous promise email months ago.

Then show your polite email that says "due to the inability of you to follow the fathers day schedule I will not be transferring the kids this weekend. I will return them to you after fathers day as scheduled."

Obviously send that email out Friday after the kids are with you. If the cops come, say to them sure, I will let the kids can go with their mom as long as she promises to return them to me on Sun at 8am as she promised and if she breaks that promise that you have the officers word he will be able to enforce that on Sunday if she re-nags. If the police cannot enforce the kids return on Sun at 8am then you can let them go because you know she won't return them.

Sometimes fight fire with fire.
I wouldn't do this. It creates more stress for the kids, especially if the ex does call the cops (the cops may show up but they won't get involved or give you their word on anything - they have actual crimes to deal with - but for the kids, seeing the police called by Mom to go after Dad will definitely ruin this Fathers' Day and any following ones). The well-being of the kids is more important than the struggle between Mom and Dad. HammerDad has given you good advice, I suggest you follow it.
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