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Old 06-02-2015, 07:10 PM
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Default Ex has Questions about OTS - Am I Being Played?

Sent an OTS to my ex's lawyer last week and don't know if or why I'm being played by her or her lawyer or both of them. I am self rep and she has been high conflict every step of the way over the last two years.

The OTS I sent is for joint custody, primary residence with her and a detailed parenting plan for young our son covering up to when he starts school.

I really don't expect her to accept the OTS, but it would be great if she does. If she doesn't, then it's the groundwork for amending my application and CYA for trial since judge said there will be costs awarded if this doesn't get settled.

Within hours of emailing the offer to her lawyer, ex suddenly texts me saying she has a "few questions" about the offer and would like to talk to me either before I pick up our toddler son or after I bring him back the next day.

NO WAY I was doing that, I know we're not supposed to discuss court stuff at exchanges in front of kid!!

I texted back (politely) asking her to send me her questions by email. Ex's response was all about how she's not good at expressing herself in writing (not true by the way) and that she would prefer for us to meet face to face to discuss things.

WTF?? She can't stand me and has accused me of domestic assault, child abuse and all kinds of other horrible things and now she wants a private meeting just the two of us?? How stupid does she think I am??

I can't trust her as far as I can throw her and just repeated my request that she email me her questions about OTS or even send me a text message.

It has been over a week now and I have heard NOTHING from her at all!

If she has questions about the OTS, shouldn't she ask her LAO lawyer? If she actually had asked me questions, I was planning to tell her to ask her free lawyer and was also prepared to suggest mediation to try and settle things.

I just don't know what she was trying to accomplish and am now a little scared of what she might be cooking up to try and screw me over one more time.

I had been attending exchanges recently (only allowed since April court date) but have gone back to letting my parents do pick ups and drop offs.

Should I suggest mediation or just carry on with my own plan of waiting a few weeks for a response and then amend my application before TMC??

Thought? Suggestions??

Thanks!
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Old 06-02-2015, 10:04 PM
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Another option is to meet with her at a time when the child is not with either of you, even if it means getting a sitter. Meet for a coffee in a public place, bring someone with you so you are not alone with her and at risk for more false accusations and record the discussion.

Although she should be able to send her questions by email, if they are really that important. She does not need to "express herself" just to ask questions, sounds to me like she is looking to have more of a "here's how I feel" conversation at you.
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Old 06-02-2015, 10:33 PM
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Did the judge say anything about modes of communication?

Recording device is not a suggestion .. its mandatory. Polite, courteous conversation..gently sticking to your guns. Watch your tone, body language, etc. Why is she adamant that it be in person?

Kind of fishy if you're this big abuser. This is actually good for you. She's so comfortable with her abuser that she wants to be right beside you talking rather than your preferred option .. e-mail.

The DV must have been out of this world I'd say. This is GOOD for you buddy.

You're not being played. She's screwing up. Playing herself. Her actions are inconsistent with her allegations and the judge will see that.

Last edited by LovingFather32; 06-02-2015 at 10:36 PM.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:23 PM
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Thanks Blink and LF32.

I find it more than fishy after I asked her for an email even said, ok just text me, that I didn't hear from her again! NOTHING!! I'm starting to think her mother put her up to it and that is part of what makes me nervous.

My ex and her mother are a tag team, with her mother often being the one to create or escalate conflict when there is none. Her mother told whopping lies to the police and CAS when they thought they could get rid of me that way.

I'm also worried about fallout if we sit down and talk (recorded of course) and I don't say or do what she expects/wants me to. We are currently cooperating on toddler son's diet, sleep schedule, potty training etc., she even sends me pics of him from her cell when he gets his hair cut or does something cute. I don't want to lose that ground for his sake.

I agree that she has actually screwed up this time, undermining what's left of her credibility in court

I'm thinking I will just sit tight for a while to see if there is any response from her lawyer to the OTS I sent and if not, so be it.

It's hard not to be paranoid after going through the fun of being cuffed and arrested in front of my dad because of their lies. (Thank God they didn't get away with it!)
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:43 PM
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Quote:
I'm also worried about fallout if we sit down and talk (recorded of course) and I don't say or do what she expects/wants me to. We are currently cooperating on toddler son's diet, sleep schedule, potty training etc
I'm with Blink on the public place thing and in the absence of the kids.

True victim's would not want to come in arm's length of their abuser's instead of e-mailing, especially when the abuser is requesting e-mail.

I know where you're at right now. Traumatized ... you want to please her or risk seeing your kids. Be polite, reasonable, non argumentative and resolution-focused with your voice low. But state you're position on your OTS in the manner above and nothing less. She probably sees she has this leverage and thinks she has more of chance of getting what she wants.

If she has a hissy fit because you dont agree with a concern she has .. it's recorded.

It gets better. Dont worry.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingFather32 View Post
Did the judge say anything about modes of communication?
Nope!

We weren't allowed to communicate for many months because of false DV allegations, which is why my parents have been so involved.

When the DV charges were withdrawn, I made sure not to have ANY contact with her until we had been back to court and had an updated order.

We have only spoken to each other once without a third part present (her mother) in the last two years, and that was at our last conference when the judge sent us out to try and reach an agreement.

Her lawyer basically shoved her into the conference room by herself and sat outside the door, keeping her eye on my ex's face and her mother out. We didn't resolve anything but it was civil.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingFather32 View Post
I'm with Blink on the public place thing and in the absence of the kids.

True victim's would not want to come in arm's length of their abuser's instead of e-mailing, especially when the abuser is requesting e-mail.

I know where you're at right now. Traumatized ... you want to please her or risk seeing your kids. Be polite, reasonable, non argumentative and resolution-focused with your voice low. But state you're position on your OTS in the manner above and nothing less. She probably sees she has this leverage and thinks she has more of chance of getting what she wants.

If she has a hissy fit because you dont agree with a concern she has .. it's recorded.

It gets better. Dont worry.
Thanks LF32

I plan on going myself to pick up my son later this week and will see if she mentions it (or sends me another text asking to meet). I try to act relaxed around her while measuring her every word and gesture which is exhausting.

If we do agree to meet in person, I have a feeling that we will both be recording the conversation, but for very different reasons.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:55 PM
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If I'm not mistaken you have a case mgmnt judge right? And he/she observed the evolution? .. (I wish I had a case management judge). The evolution is so important.

I couldn't imagine the MIL being everywhere. My situation mirrors yours with the orchestral MIL.

She said you abused the child also correct? Refresh me .. what were the allegations and do you have a CAS report to support you?

Last edited by LovingFather32; 06-03-2015 at 12:17 AM. Reason: grammar
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Old 06-03-2015, 12:45 AM
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Originally Posted by LovingFather32 View Post
If I'm not mistaken you have a case mgmnt judge right? And he/she observed the evolution? .. (I wish I had a case management judge). The evolution is so important.

I couldn't imagine the MIL being everywhere. My situation mirrors yours with the orchestral MIL.

She said you abused the child also correct? Refresh me .. what were the allegations and do you have a CAS report to support you?
We do have a case management judge and he has been great. He was OCL for over 20 years and his other area was mental competency hearings, so he knows what he's dealing with (ex diagnosed Bipolar and possible Borderline before I met her, I saw the paperwork).

He has been with us from the beginning and ordered her to finally allow DNA testing of all three of us to confirm my paternity after she hid our son from me for four months.

In addition to the DV allegations, she and her mother called CAS after my FIRST court ordered visit (in their home with them present) saying I had physically, sexually and emotionally abused our infant son (then six months old) yelling at him, leaving bruises on his legs and head, causing him to scream and cover his privates during diaper changes after I left.

The CAS protection worker did a great job, she attended their home and observed no marks on my son and that he giggled and waved his arms and legs during the diaper change. She then waited over 2 weeks to interview me, letting them hang themselves because my visits continued with no further complaints.

The historical DV allegations were then reported to the police immediately AFTER they were told CAS didn't find anything to support their claims I had abused my son.

My parents have been doing pick ups and drop offs twice a week at my ex's home for over a year now and my ex has never been allowed to bring my son to their car or pick him up without her mother being right beside her.

What is she afraid her daughter might say to one of my parents or me if she's not monitoring everybody?
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Old 06-03-2015, 12:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OntarioDaddy View Post
What do you mean by
I really don't expect her to accept the OTS, but it would be great if she does. If she doesn't, then it's the groundwork for amending my application and CYA for trial since judge said there will be costs awarded if this doesn't get settled.
The terms in my OTS are exactly what I would be willing to agree to if she accepts the terms, but if she doesn't even respond with a counter offer, the language and hours put into writing it will be used to amend my original application before our TMC later this summer.

I want to give her time to wrap her head around where I stand right now with the exception that I will be seeking sole custody in my amended application based on her false allegations, alienating behaviour and unreasonableness throughout the court process. I have to protect myself against a Kaplanis v Kaplanis type judgement.

The CYA part is, if we do go to trial, I have an OTS served with what I expect to be the most likely order that a judge would make at trial and will therefore have a chance at claiming costs against her while also protecting myself from her LAO lawyer attempting to stick me with costs for her pathetic representation of my ex. (She has already tried this on a motion I brought and was slammed by the judge)
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