Grandparents in Family Disputes

[Tayken]

Originally Posted by Patty60

Tayken, my daughter had a fantastic upbringing. She once told me that I, her mother, was her role model and that she wanted a husband like her Dad.

What child doesn't say this? Even the most abused children will say this. This is why CAS has to properly investigate matters.

Originally Posted by Patty60

So I would say we did something right.

Interference and involvement in your daughter's life may be the problem. Your daughter's conduct as described by you does not reflect the "right" decisions.

Generally speaking, people who allow themselves to be victims have a very troubled childhood.

Originally Posted by Patty60

We are not perfect but we sure did the best we could in all aspects.

Yet, your daughter is in a repeated relationship with someone who abused her prior according to your accusations.

Originally Posted by Patty60

She wanted for nothing.

This is an odd statement. All children want love and affection from their parents.

Originally Posted by Patty60

She only told us, when she was 24 years old, that she had been bullied at school between the ages of about 10 to 14 years old.

You didn't observe any avoidan't behaviours? Long nights home alone, lack of friends, conflict with friends at school during 10 to 14 years of age? Generally, there would have been clear signs of this abuse.

General patterns of behaviour include weird clothing, avoidance, self harm, suicidal idealization and other things. Is your daughter a creative person? Generally a lot of victims of childhood abuse keep detailed journals, write stories, poetry and other "dark" and "odd" things well beyond normal teenage development.

Originally Posted by Patty60

I dont know how I missed that at the time because was heavily involved in the PTA.

I am not sure how your involvement in an organization, even though centred around the school, should have circumvented the abuse you are describing. PTA moms are often known to be the over-involved parents who dominate their children.

Originally Posted by Patty60

I don'tknow if that has affected her now.

If left unchecked and not treated properly through psychotherapy your daughter may have developed a post traumatic scar as a result. Your daughter could have developed a personality disorder (generally a cluster "C" avoidant type). This could be AvPD or DPD. I am just throwing darts as I don't have much insight other than your comments about your daughter and what has happened to her based on your interpretation.

At age 10-14 key elements of your daughter's personality were developing. Her personality could have been significantly altered and a resulting post-traumatic scar could have developed. Your daughter could look normal on the outside but, be dealing with some significant psychological issues.

Has your daughter ever expressed any direct fears to you? For example, fear of being judged, fear of being humiliated, fear of what others think of her, fear of social situations, fear that her friends were out to get her, etc... A consistent pattern of these fears over a life time could demonstrate an Axis II disorder. But, you would need significant evidence (or psychological testing) to demonstrate this.

Originally Posted by Patty60

We have absolutely no skeletons in our closet whatsoever. We very boring people, worked hard, saved money, no smoking, no drugs, no infidelity.

Well, your daughter's relationship with her current partner is a skeleton potentially that has come back out.

Originally Posted by Patty60

There is not a single possible item that I care if the entire world knows about us.

What you allow "the world" to know about your family. Everyone has skeletons in their closet.

Originally Posted by Patty60

My daughter has been very close to us all throughout her life, BUT when this monster abuser is involved she becomes like a cult member under his influence.

You are projecting blame on the "monster abuser" and none on your daughter. You are making excuses for your daughter's behaviour, who she chooses relationships with and are eluding to some magical "cult-like" power this person has over your daughter. Your daughter is an adult and makes her own choices. Unless she has some brain injury or mental health condition...

Your was "very close" to you. Potentially too close and was controlled by you. You do seem very over-anxious about potential dangers versus real dangers which can be proven in a court. Judges do not want to hear emotional reasoning and projections and future predictions. They operate on cogent evidence and facts. Not something someone believes will happen should this person be around the children or your daughter.

Originally Posted by Patty60

I will do whatever I have to, no matter the cost, to save daughter but moreover to save the two innocent victims in all this, our only two small grandchildren. End of my story for this thread, it must be boring for others at this point.

It appears that you are rather controlling based on these statements. I hope you did not raise your daughter with this same "all or nothing" belief structure. You sound like you are "going for broke" on this matter and well, you have to understand the consequences of actually doing this.

You either get what you want or you go broke.

It sounds more to me like you are more worried about your relationship with your daughter's children than anything else. You will put your daughter, your family through the hells of court to get what you want. This is behaviour potentially is reflective of a borderline mother and not of a loving parent.

Are these your only grandchildren? Why put your family through this hell just to get what "you want".

Good Luck!
Tayken

[Tayken]

Originally Posted by Patty60

It seems that I have had a problem communicating my situation on this forum. so I am going to, for the last time, simplify matters.

This statement reflects that you feel that people are not "hearing" what you want them to and the following points are reflective of a potential "fear" of how people are "judging" you on this message board.

Originally Posted by Patty60

1. We are not trailer trash and all that implies.

No one implied that you were from what I could tell. You are potentially demonstrating your own personal anxiety of how people view you and your family.

Originally Posted by Patty60

2. Have a very good relationship with daughter before she rekindled relatiosnhip with this jerk.

You are demonstrating the animosity you have towards your daughter's partner clearly. You even used a rather rude word to describe him. Don't allow your anger to drive your litigation. Logic, reason, cogent evidence and facts. Put that statement into an affidavit and see what a judge has to say.

Originally Posted by Patty60

3. My daughter can live her own life, anytime, anywhere even with her abuser.

Then why won't you let her do this? The children are her parental responsibility not yours.

Originally Posted by Patty60

4. My grandchildren are vulnerable to his abuse. They have a very close relatiosnhip with us - the grandparents. We are their only protectors.

You seem to have some higher calling to protect these children, even from their own mother, your daughter, who you are now "ok" with being in a relationship with someone you have alleged is an abuser?

This is similar argument that people who bomb abortion clinics use often. Generally, these people are Axis II disordered.

Originally Posted by Patty60

5. The CAS, a private corp, and other governmental organizations are useless.

CAS is not a private corporation. They are a public not-for-profit organization. Like many organizations they are not perfect but, your conflict with them seems to be more that they don't do what you want.

Originally Posted by Patty60

Keep watch for new precedent setting judgements and opinions for access between grandparents/grandchildren.

Signing off.

The case law is in place already and changing it is an incredibly expensive proposal to any litigant. Judging by your screen name you are in your 60s. Litigation like what you are seeking, unless your daughter caves under your abusive plan to litigate her, could take longer than you will be alive. Is this how you want your grandchildren to remember you if at all?

Good Luck!
Tayken